From MP - JOSHUA TREE: THE BOLTING PRESSURE COOKER

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Messages 61 - 80 of total 120 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
madbolter1

Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
Mar 14, 2018 - 09:53am PT
Tempest in a teacup?

Perhaps the hangers could just be replaced by somebody who cares, and, voila! Solved. Perhaps?

My $0.02.
xCon

Social climber
909
Mar 14, 2018 - 10:04am PT
wasnt smashing a hanger flat was always a particularly venomous "f*#k you" to the developer?
xCon

Social climber
909
Mar 14, 2018 - 11:17am PT
smirk...

drljefe

climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
Mar 14, 2018 - 12:05pm PT
Bolts actually hold in that choss?

xCon

Social climber
909
Mar 14, 2018 - 12:13pm PT
heresy!
xCon

Social climber
909
Mar 14, 2018 - 12:28pm PT
dont forget to make a targeted purchase as soon as possible...
Credit: xCon
drljefe

climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
Mar 14, 2018 - 12:47pm PT
All this talk about flattening hangers- that itís bad form, chicken sh°t, etc...
in many cases, yes.
But that method has its place.

Not saying this bolt, route, or area is or isnít the place.
But that method has its place.
xCon

Social climber
909
Mar 14, 2018 - 12:57pm PT
better the confront

still recall the day billy was accosted for him and his lackey e trashing development at Williamson

water under the bridge now

but if your intention is to bring a stop to what they were offering its best to rub their chicken sh#t noses in the dirt in front of the community

the positive effect is longer lasting that way

StahlBro

Trad climber
San Diego, CA
Mar 14, 2018 - 12:57pm PT
I donít know Jefe. Seems like a lack of commitment to me. If someone is that offended, they should confront the FA team or finish the job.
Mungeclimber

Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
Mar 14, 2018 - 01:43pm PT
Flattening hanger, generally, isn't restoring the rock to its original condition. So I don't see how it would be useful.


If it can go in, it can come out. But if it comes out, the reason and method should be about restoring it for a future ascent in better ethical approach or no ascent. Removal and restoration is a message of the clearest type, but without the apparent hypocritical baggage of leaving the offending bolt in place.
drljefe

climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
Mar 14, 2018 - 02:55pm PT
Munge- you can never restore the rock to its original condition.
WBraun

climber
Mar 14, 2018 - 03:09pm PT
Smashing over the hangers sends a different message that says the person is pissed and your ass is on the line if you keep it up.

And that line means your routes will keep getting erased.

But those jobs are for you save the world and rock types, lol.

What's mind blower ya all can't even save yourselves which far more important.

So go save yer rocks while yer whole world is being slaughtered all around ya .....
Highdesertman

Trad climber
jtree ca
Mar 14, 2018 - 04:13pm PT
I got no subbies and I'm not making up any stories. The Lucky Boy area has allways meant a lot to me over the years. I'm one of those people who clean up any garbage I see so while I did make a bit of a rant about being followed out there I have way to much respect for that area and rock in general to trash it like that. It makes no sense that if I had of done that I would then post a picture but deny it. I posted a picture because I am amazed that somebody would do this. All of my above posts are true I've never harmed a bolt or a hanger. The other route out there is untouched by the way. And I am as curious as any one as to who might have done that.
Mungeclimber

Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
Mar 14, 2018 - 04:36pm PT
Jefe, metaphysically, no, first strike warfare being what it is in the psyche of the victims.

But I've patched granite holes and rhyolitic tuff using native sand/dirt, where I would challenge anyone to be able to find the original offending hole. To all but the driller and the patcher, it would be restored.

Immaculate Restoration, Inc. :)

Largo

Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
Mar 14, 2018 - 04:38pm PT
personally I don't believe there is any excuse for tolerating dangerous routes any longer.
-----


This is really an issue of what people feel are their inherent rights per climbing. Except, as Kelly Cordes once said, no one has an inherent "right" to stand on any summit. So when a given route is not safe enough for you, you can't logically say you have the right to change it to your satisfaction. You are not being done out of (safetly) something (rights) which Nature did not provide you to begin with.

Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Mar 14, 2018 - 04:46pm PT
So when a given route is not safe enough for you, you can't logically say you have the right to change it to your satisfaction.

Yet we do that all the time. Place bolts on blank faces, leave pin scars, clean cracks of vegetation, etc.
Ojai Alex

Trad climber
Ojai, CA
Mar 14, 2018 - 05:06pm PT
^^^
Thats some proper gaslighting there, Gary.
To conflate sport routes with bold lines is either not totally honest or grossly misunderstanding the two approaches.

I figured xCon was trolling when he said that about bold routes, but Largoís response has me thinking maybe Im wrong.

Its a bit like preaching to the choir here in the echochamber, but nevertheless...the sanitization of the sport, in the name of safety, errodes centuries of mountain culture. Itís the culture, history, and tradition that I love about the sport, and thatís why its so disheartening to see these kinds of attitudes.

Iíve watched the same attitude result in bolted cracks, grid bolted wilderness, etc. But in this age of opinions, resolution seems dim and distant. And Ďmight makes rightí.

In which case, best quit the talkiní and commence the chalkiní. Every new traditional FA is perhaps a kind of service. Not only to our selfish desires for fun and adventure. But also to climbers passed and the sport itself.

Iíll be over here doing my part on these 5.8ís.
AP

Trad climber
Calgary
Mar 14, 2018 - 05:14pm PT
Its OK to have dangerous routes as long as the hazards are common knowledge.
If people know what they are getting into, no problem.
Brian Greenwood wrote about a new (mainly rock) route on the North Face of Kitchener
mainly to make sure no one ever went up there again!
drljefe

climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
Mar 14, 2018 - 07:59pm PT
Metaphysically lol.

zardoz

Trad climber
Colorado Springs, CO
Mar 15, 2018 - 01:56am PT
But those jobs are for you save the world and rock types, lol.

Save-the-rock-type-guys. Ha ha ha. I love that. It's definitely some kind of guy.

I think it's more of a you-did-something-I-didn't-like guy. You know that guy? He doesn't like anything. What are we going to do about those kinds of guys? Can we get them some sort of gift card to Cracker Barrel or something? There's just no pleasing them.
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