help climbers visciously attacked in Peru

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Messages 741 - 760 of total 910 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 5, 2013 - 12:31pm PT
Those of you supporting the Peruvians are really funny.

Explain. Why is it funny to support the people who live there and had their lives interrupted by foreigners who didn't speak the language and refused to show any ID? You'd rather take the side of the "extreme adventurers" who boldly vacationed in another country, figuring it would be fine if they knew nothing about the area, the language, or the people?
Gerg

Trad climber
Calgary
Feb 5, 2013 - 12:43pm PT
Is there any windshield experts that can tell if the two impacts on the photo are outward(drunken heads) or inward(crazed locals). It is odd that such impact never left much damage on the girl who would have hit your skull.
Who to believe DMT, this is fun!
WBraun

climber
Feb 5, 2013 - 12:53pm PT
The windshield damage was definitely rocks .....
Big Mike

Trad climber
BC
Feb 5, 2013 - 12:59pm PT
I agree with Werner. The damages look to have originated from the outside.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 5, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
The one on the driver's side is from a rock. But look at the other one... clearly a much broader object caused the one in the middle. I'm guessing it was the dude's head. It all makes sense... a chick was driving (which is why they ended up in the ditch). The dude was sitting in the back, between the seats and bloodied his head when he hit the glass, then banged his jaw against the dash or other person's head.



Sad that it all could have been avoided with a little common courtesy and common sense.
Big Mike

Trad climber
BC
Feb 5, 2013 - 01:32pm PT
The middle one looks to have an outside impact mark just like the drivers side to me.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Feb 5, 2013 - 01:35pm PT
SuperTopo: where I always go first for crime scene analysis of pictures
on the intardnet.
zBrown

Ice climber
chingadero de chula vista
Feb 5, 2013 - 01:36pm PT
It would be wise, if a Blue Ribbon panel (Pabst does not qualify) were formed and sent down there posthaste to get to the bottom of this important matter once and for all.

Dinner and companionship will be provided gratis.



Addendum: Licky may not serve.




Big Mike

Trad climber
BC
Feb 5, 2013 - 01:39pm PT
Hence the phrase "looks like". Although I have seen a few broken windows in my time.. I swear I never broke any of em! ;)
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 5, 2013 - 02:24pm PT
rock: high density fractures near point of impact approximately twice the size of the rock, tightly spaced concentric rings


head: lower fracture density near point of impact gradually becoming less dense away from the point of impact, wider spacing between concentric rings


horse:
Jim Brennan

Trad climber
Vancouver Canada
Feb 5, 2013 - 02:31pm PT
Where's the blood if a head was used to open the window ?
Gerg

Trad climber
Calgary
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:14pm PT
Aah Jim good point. And would there not be airbags gone off too if it was heads?
This is so Wings of Steel.
Maybe the movie will tell the real truth hehe
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:25pm PT
Jan: American consulate was uninterested in helping...

Hey, that's patently untrue. When I was in jail in Tokyo they came right over with the latest copy of Newsweek. Unfortunately, I wasn't in it so I never saw or heard from them again.
graniteclimber

Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:26pm PT
I'm guessing it was the dude's head. It all makes sense... a chick was driving (which is why they ended up in the ditch). The dude was sitting in the back,

According to Jenny, the dude (her brother Jed) was driving.


http://www.jhnewsandguide.com/article.php?art_id=9499

No more than 10 minutes after leaving the village, the group reached a school. They asked the headmaster if they could camp. He denied their request and turned them away.

Villagers had created a small roadblock with boulders, Wolfrom said. Attempts to talk failed and they decided to simply drive over the roadblock.

As they were driving, someone threw a large rock through the passenger side window, striking Jenny Wolfrom in the jaw. Others cracked the windshield.

Down the road, they came to a larger roadblock of boulders about 2 feet tall, Wolfrom said. On one side of the road was a cliff. The other side was an irrigation ditch.

Jed Wolfrom aimed for the canal and gunned it, trying to make it through. The truck flipped on its side.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:37pm PT
The truck flipped on its side.

Down the road, they came to a larger roadblock of boulders about 2 feet tall, Wolfrom said. On one side of the road was a cliff. The other side was an irrigation ditch.

I don't see enough rocks to make a 2" tall roadblock... let alone a 2 foot tall roadblock.

I also don't see cliffs on either side of the road.

Do you?
graniteclimber

Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:42pm PT
In the beginning I was trying to ignore this thread, but then let myself get sucked in. I was surprised that people jumped to the conclusion so quickly that the whole account was a hoax and wouldn't even give them the benefit of a doubt. I didn't know (and still don't know) what happened, but their story did not sound as unlikely as many here claimed.

Then people said they weren't even climbers This is false. They have climbing pics all over their blog.

I don't think some people care about the truth.

The only detailed accounts we have is from the Wolfroms and I wish we had a police report, or newspaper reports by journalists that spent more time interviewing the people in the village. However, according to the Peru papers, the mayor of the village and the authorities believe that they were attacked.

The excuse is that the villagers thought they might have been cattle thieves. But how many gringo cattle thieves have there been in Peru?

Maybe they shouldn't have tried to drive away, and shouldn't have tried to drive around the barricades. I think this was a mistake. But if their instincts were telling them that something bad was going down and they needed to run, maybe it would have been a mistake not to try to escape. A book, "The Gift of Fear" was recommended here on Supertopo and I read it. According to that we should trust our instincts when they tell us to flee, because they are often right. I think that the way they were treated, especially the way the women were treated, points to their instincts being right.

Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:43pm PT
I don't see enough rocks to make a 2" tall roadblock... let alone a 2 foot tall roadblock.

I also don't see cliffs on either side of the road.

Do you?

Why would the roadblock be behind them? Lol.

DMT
Gerg

Trad climber
Calgary
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:46pm PT
Maybe there is a cliff ahead, behind the photog?
I also don't see broken glass on the seats from the rock that came through the passenger window, or pieces of glass still stuck in the window caseing?
Or on the ground but it very well could be on the ground on the side of the truck we can't see.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 5, 2013 - 03:56pm PT
Dingus, you know enough about geology to make a reasonable inference there.

Gerg, it was supposedly dark when they wrecked. How would they even be able to see a cliff? Not that the terrain looks all that cliffy...
blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
Feb 5, 2013 - 04:05pm PT
In the beginning I was trying to ignore this thread, but then let myself get sucked in. I was surprised that people jumped to the conclusion so quickly that the whole account was a hoax and wouldn't even give them the benefit of a doubt. I didn't know (and still don't know) what happened, but their story did not sound as unlikely as many here claimed.

Then people said they weren't even climbers This is false. They have climbing pics all over their blog.

I don't think some people care about the truth.

The only detailed accounts we have is from the Wolfroms and I wish we had a police report, or newspaper reports by journalists that spent more time interviewing the people in the village. However, according to the Peru papers, the mayor of the village and the authorities believe that they were attacked.

The excuse is that the villagers thought they might have been cattle thieves. But how many gringo cattle thieves have there been in Peru?

Good points. One of the few things we can safely conclude is that they were in fact attacked, even if many people posting here seem to think the attack was justified.
In addition to how many gringo cattle thieves have there been in Peru, I'd like to know how many cattle-thief gangs are composed mostly of women.
I don't think anyone really believes the locals-thought-they-were-cattle-thieves theory, at least I hope not.
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