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zBrown
Ice climber
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Sep 30, 2015 - 10:28am PT
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RIP James Dean - September 30, 1955, Cholame, CA
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canyoncat
Social climber
SoCal
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Sep 30, 2015 - 11:56am PT
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Friends and relatives whine about online discussions of deaths because they are unable to actually control death, and are venting their frustration. Sort of shoot the messenger. IMO they should stay off the internet, or HTFU.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Sep 30, 2015 - 12:46pm PT
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zBrown, I was THERE Saturday! OMG! Does this mean I'm gonna you-know-what?
I was only doin' 70 cause I go by there a lot and it is a notorious revenuers' spot.
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
ne'er–do–well
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Sep 30, 2015 - 07:53pm PT
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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pretty good edit on that grainy video...
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HF
climber
I'm a Norwegian stuck in Joshua Tree
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Friends and relatives whine about online discussions of deaths because they are unable to actually control death, and are venting their frustration. Sort of shoot the messenger. IMO they should stay off the internet, or HTFU.
No one is able to control the death of someone else, however each and every one of us are able to control when, who and what "information" we "help" spreading.
Perhaps you should read Werner's post and his words of wisdom. Thank you Werner.
Condolences to all who have lost someone close and special to them.
HF
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canyoncat
Social climber
SoCal
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Advice from a duck who picks up pieces in buckets? Nah. Thanks for playing though.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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What CCT said for me too.
Only offer condolences on threads about accidents. But understand many wont follow that simple courtesy.
Start another thread to discuss particulars, lessons, discussion of risk in general, etc.
we participate in a risky sport and the more we discuss and analyze accidents and risk the better IMO as long as its done in a respectful way.
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AE
climber
Boulder, CO
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Oct 27, 2015 - 01:48pm PT
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When responding to accident related posts on ST, it's useful to keep in mind that many here may be close friends or family of the subject. This becomes a semi-public bulletin board for those not necessarily close or immediate, but within the community, who might have met or heard of the person, and so have a reasonable curiosity about the situation.
There is a spectrum of propriety, regarding statements expressing more than sympathy, and jumping to conclusions or judgments serves no one.
Later on, depending on how the OP is entered, there may be more appropriate threads in which to engage in conversations about causes, responsibilities, perhaps even speculation, if there are lessons for others from examining an incident. I read many of these sorts of posts the way I'd read Accidents in North American Mountaineering, that is from a more detached, analytical mindset. It takes time for facts to come together. These discussions may also not provide loved ones with information they need for healing.
That being said, those with high public profiles effectively open themselves to public judgment much more than average folks, even to higher standards of libel. Anonymous flaming is de riguer, we all know. If I've criticized some climber I personally dislike, I've tried to keep my criticism focused on some behavior, and not on the personality.
Of course, insulting an accident victim should earn a lifetime site ban for the poster.
As for the Chief, when did this thread become all about you? If a party passes you and then drops a rock onto your head, is that an accident or incident? If you mistakenly take the wrong descent gully and must commit to rapping off a single bad anchor, tell me, does it go from incident to accident before or when the anchor fails? Most here have been in irreversible situations, for whatever reasons, and choices aren't always presented to us. The illusion of control gets lots of "experts" in trouble.
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splitclimber
climber
Sonoma County
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Dec 27, 2015 - 08:45am PT
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Bump for some respect around here
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Bldrjac
Ice climber
Boulder
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Dec 27, 2015 - 10:49am PT
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Just my two cents, being the widow of a well-known climber. My experience regarding SuperTopo was exemplary.....I was SO happy to read what people wrote about Jack, and know that in many cases, I wasn't alone in my grief. No one posted up anything that wasn't positive (not always the case, I know). Same on Mountain Project. Through those forums, many people were able to access me, and send me love, or get my personal information so they could call, write,email, or visit. Also a memorial fund was set up and advertised on this site and FB, the generosity of which has allowed me to be able to stay on living in my/our house. My FB "friends" are MY FRIENDS, so I had no worries that anyone would put anything weird or hurtful up. In fact, in moments of despair I go back to those postings on both ST and FB, and am cheered by the love and memories shared.
I happened to be in Cuba when he died, and there were some complications in reaching me. I understand that the news got out on FB and maybe even ST before I was reached (nearly 30 hours later), but was quashed and taken off said sites until I was informed. Ironically, I was the proverbial "last one to know", but again, I felt nothing but love and support from those 2 sites. Additionally, his partner and a few others wrote articles about his accident (and it was also in the AAC "Accidents")....knowledge is power. I don't think we'll know the "reason" why he fell....but in the end, it's information knowing that even the safest, most experienced climbers can still make fatal mistakes. A reminder to never take this activity lightly, and to remember to make each moment count as if it were our last. I just wanted to say that in some cases, social media can be a very POSITIVE force, provided we all remember to be kind.
Pam Roberts
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Dec 28, 2015 - 04:54am PT
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hey there say, dear pam... oh my, i cry everytime i remember all this...
thank you for baring your heart and soul...
have a good eve, this night... you are loved by many...
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