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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 22, 2015 - 09:48am PT
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Aren't vaccines verboten under Sharia law?
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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Jan 22, 2015 - 09:54am PT
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I do wonder how bad these epidemics have to get before the thinking will change again in favor of vaccines. If it was the adults who were getting sick, I wouldn't mind, but it is innocent children suffering and dying because of the adults and their uninformed thinking.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 23, 2015 - 05:28pm PT
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Jan 22, 2015 - 09:48am PT
Aren't vaccines verboten under Sharia law?
Um... Reilly. Even if there were such a thing as a uniform Sharia law, Ask yourself how Smallpox was virtually wiped off the face of the earth without countries under sharia laws cooperating. Some of the countries under sharia law are in what were formerly the hardest hit parts of the world. And the first known widespread vaccination regimens were in the Ottoman Empire in the early 1700's. Western doctors learned it from them.
The reasons that the eradication isn't complete has mostly to do with reaching people in remote areas, and with Western countries stopping regular vaccinations for the disease
In Saudia Arabia, you can't get a birth certificate for your kid until you show it has had the first round of shots.
You might be confusing sharia with Amish, as some sects of that religion are opposed to vaccinations.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jan 23, 2015 - 05:48pm PT
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Lorenzo, I was just equating stupid is as stupid does. Sharia is stupid
and not getting yer kids vaccinated is stupid. I was mainly thinking of
the Taliban in Pakistan killing workers who were vaccinating people.
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Jan 23, 2015 - 05:52pm PT
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Sorry, I didn't get that your argument was so subtle.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Jan 23, 2015 - 08:18pm PT
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Got my flu shot thanks to obummercare, combined with my decently healthy lifestyle I should outlive locker and his glue shack no problem!
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 24, 2015 - 05:20pm PT
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Yes, flu mutates, which makes the kind of vaccines we produce today an annual best guess. Changing that requires the development of a more 'universal' vaccine which would work against some aspect of the flu surface proteins which doesn't change, or changes much more slowly (or 'conserved'), as the flu mutates and hopefully is present in all flu strains.
Today's vaccines work by attempting to recognize the head of a mushroom-shaped protein on the flu's surface as opposed to its stem. The head portion of the protein mutates at a faster rate then the stem making it the target of a lot of 'universal' flu vaccine research.
STANFORD RESEARCHERS TAKE A STEP TOWARD DEVELOPING A ‘UNIVERSAL’ FLU VACCINE
More in-depth: Options and Obstacles for Designing a Universal Influenza Vaccine
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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That's goddam funny, JB. And spot-on.
I take exception, though, to the choice of words used by those docs at the start of their rant:
"I'm xxx, and I believe in vaccinations."
This ain't no goddam religion...this is science, and medicine. Facts stand by themselves...you can either choose to acknowledge them, or stick your head in the sand (which is up your arse) and ignore them.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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For a lot of educated parents videos like the above are counter productive. I'm not going to give my children something for herd immunity that can cause:
Deafness.
Long-term seizures, coma, lowered consciousness.
Permanent brain damage.
Without thorough and accurate knowledge of the risks involved. When my son was born in 2001 we couldn't find actual statistics and we delayed some of his shots. It's gotten much better lately. Not all parents don't immunize because of beliefs, some don't immunize because of lack of scientific understanding of the risks. Or some kids have bad reactions to one shot and the parents don't want to risk more shots.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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My wife has had patients who wanted the Ebola vaccine but refused the flu vaccine.
What is really needed in this country is a brain vaccine.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 3, 2015 - 09:57pm PT
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Ok, since I started this post, we've come aways.
http://www.polioeradication.org/Dataandmonitoring/Poliothisweek.aspx
There was a setback in 2014, with 359 cases worldwide.
Through last week, there have been 25 in the world, and now it seem confined to 2 countries, down from 11 last year.
All due to vaccines.
Another emerging success, although not vaccine controlled, is Guinea Worm:
http://www.cartercenter.org/health/guinea_worm/case-totals.html
When The Carter Center began leading the international campaign to eradicate Guinea worm disease in 1986, there were an estimated 3.5 million cases in 21 countries in Africa and Asia. Today, that number has been reduced by more than 99.99 percent, with the vast majority of cases remaining in South Sudan.
In 2014, 126 cases of Guinea worm disease were reported worldwide.
Through April, in 2015, the number is THREE, worldwide.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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I guess as long as you implicitly trust big pharmaceutical companies then its no problem. Who do you work for Ken?
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dirtbag
climber
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Yes studly, efforts to eradicate guinea worn (not through vaccines, btw) and polio haven't greatly improved the human condition.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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I'm not going to give my children something for herd immunity that can cause:
The Fet, I know you're a smart guy, and I see your point, but I would guess you'd have to admit that the big picture goals and missions of vaccines have been an overwhelming success, I mean in terms of global suffering, which there is still plenty of.
For a lot of educated parents videos like the above are counter productive. That's a first world problem I'd say.
How would you feel about the total disappearance of vaccines? Or if none of the community around you was vaccinated for anything?
The truth is that much more massive numbers of people have died from giant outbreaks of disease than have been injured by vaccines.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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This is so tiresome.
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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I'm looking forward to seeing third world comedians spoof first world ignorance about vaccines.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Only in America can one be considered a caring parent if you don't spank yer kid yet you
refuse them a smallpox or polio vaccine. Do we have lead water pipes?
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