Immunizations....what has happened

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Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 4, 2013 - 01:16pm PT
And as far as immunizations and the prolific use of antibiotics,, weve created these newer strains of ever developing and morphing bacterias. Have we not?


I think it IS fair to say that overuse of antibiotics has resulted in resistant strains.

However, I've never seen that assertion for vaccines.
rectorsquid

climber
Lake Tahoe
Feb 4, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
There was a time when you could get very sick from a vaccine. People should not trust science any more blindly than they should trust anything or anyone else blindly.

Unfortunately, a healthy social distrust in any large authoritarian power, like scientists, leads to some individuals having an unhealthy distrust.

That said, we are far past the time when distrust of vaccines is at all helpful. Even when they were a bit more dangerous, their overall social benefit was worth the risk to any individual.

It does make sense though that as something becomes commonplace and less people speak out about its potential hazards, the fearful (functionally insane) people start to get agitated. Eventually, they see the lack of concern as a big conspiracy against them. The fact that no one sane ever actually thought that contrails were chemical trails really freaks out those types of people.

I know a die hard science type of guy who got a flu shot just because he believed it was better for society as a whole that he did so. He swears that it gave him the flu or at least didn't protect him at all from it. I'll bet he'll avoid that shot for a few years.

Dave
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Feb 4, 2013 - 01:36pm PT
The current statistics for this flu shot is that it protects 62% from getting
it and that if you do get it then it mitigates the symptoms considerably.
I'll take 62% any day. Hell, bat .300 and you're a lock for the Hall of Fame.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Feb 4, 2013 - 02:05pm PT
Cosmic....I understand wheat-grass enemas are another immunization tactic for the flu virus....Do you administer those..?
Heyzeus

climber
Hollywood,Ca
Feb 4, 2013 - 08:51pm PT
No link between shots and autism but there IS a link between the flu shot and developing narcolepsy in children in Europe. Doesn't seem to be a problem in the U.S. as we do not allow the "adjuvant" or booster here. A story I read a couple of weeks ago on it was heartbreaking. Narcolepsy is far from benign and quite tragic for the girl I read about.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/uk-study-strengthens-between-gsk-flu-shot-narcolepsy-114619475.html
Jan

Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
Feb 4, 2013 - 09:19pm PT
Influenza is caused by viruses. Therefore overuse of antibiotics has no effect on them. Overuse of antibiotics has affected the growth of resistant bacteria however.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Feb 21, 2013 - 09:18pm PT
Flu vaccine not very effective for seniors this year.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-204_162-57570589/cdc-flu-vaccine-only-provided-9-percent-protection-for-seniors-against-worst-strain/

Effectiveness is defined by whether one needed outpatient medical visits due to the flu, so lots more just suffered at home.
Degaine

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 05:32am PT
For all those who have written that the overuse of antibiotics has prompted the growth of highly resistant bacteria, this is not only due to human use.

A large part of this phenomenon can be traced to factory farming and extreme overuse of antibiotics. Factory farming has also become the breeding grounds for extremely virulent strains of flu that yes humans can catch.

A good part of the blow back regarding vaccination is due to pharmaceutical industry greed and unwillingness to be straightforward with the public and doctors with regard to potential long term side effects of a who variety of products, including vaccines.

mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Nov 4, 2013 - 05:26pm PT
Good times

http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2013/11/04/240278593/getting-your-microbes-analyzed-raises-big-privacy-issues
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Mar 24, 2014 - 02:01pm PT
http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/22/health/india-end-of-polio/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

India beats the odds, beats polio

Howrah District, India (CNN) -- Rukhsar Khatoon is too young to fully grasp the significance of her life: that she is a last in a country of 1.2 billion people.
She has become the greatest symbol of India's valiant -- and successful -- effort to rid itself of a crippling and potentially deadly disease. Rukhsar, 4, is the final documented case of polio in India.

Her parents, Abdul Shah, 32, and Shobejan Begum, 30, blame themselves for their child's suffering. They had their other children vaccinated, but not Rukhsar. She was a sickly child, in and out of hospital with liver infections and diarrhea. They thought it safer not to subject her to more medication.

Rukhsar's father Abdul Shah blames himself and says he thought she would never walk again.

It wasn't until little Rukhsar's right foot swelled and twisted in early 2011 that her parents took her to a hospital in nearby Beleghata for tests. She was just 18 months old when doctors confirmed the worst: Rukhsar had polio.

Polio is caused by a virus that attacks the brain and spinal cord cells that move joints and muscles. About one-third of those who contract polio in India are left paralyzed -- as was Rukhsar.

"There were three keys to our success," Kapur says. "Immunize, immunize and immunize."
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 22, 2015 - 09:20am PT
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/01/22/the-devastating-impact-of-vaccine-deniers-in-one-measles-chart/?tid=trending_strip_4
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jan 22, 2015 - 09:48am PT
Aren't vaccines verboten under Sharia law?
Jan

Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
Jan 22, 2015 - 09:54am PT
I do wonder how bad these epidemics have to get before the thinking will change again in favor of vaccines. If it was the adults who were getting sick, I wouldn't mind, but it is innocent children suffering and dying because of the adults and their uninformed thinking.
Lorenzo

Trad climber
Oregon
Jan 23, 2015 - 05:28pm PT

Jan 22, 2015 - 09:48am PT
Aren't vaccines verboten under Sharia law?

Um... Reilly. Even if there were such a thing as a uniform Sharia law, Ask yourself how Smallpox was virtually wiped off the face of the earth without countries under sharia laws cooperating. Some of the countries under sharia law are in what were formerly the hardest hit parts of the world. And the first known widespread vaccination regimens were in the Ottoman Empire in the early 1700's. Western doctors learned it from them.

The reasons that the eradication isn't complete has mostly to do with reaching people in remote areas, and with Western countries stopping regular vaccinations for the disease

In Saudia Arabia, you can't get a birth certificate for your kid until you show it has had the first round of shots.

You might be confusing sharia with Amish, as some sects of that religion are opposed to vaccinations.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jan 23, 2015 - 05:48pm PT
Lorenzo, I was just equating stupid is as stupid does. Sharia is stupid
and not getting yer kids vaccinated is stupid. I was mainly thinking of
the Taliban in Pakistan killing workers who were vaccinating people.
Lorenzo

Trad climber
Oregon
Jan 23, 2015 - 05:52pm PT
Sorry, I didn't get that your argument was so subtle.
Bill Mc Kirgan

Trad climber
Cedar Rapids, Iowa
Jan 23, 2015 - 07:34pm PT
Did anyone mention Andy?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield
kunlun_shan

Mountain climber
SF, CA
Jan 23, 2015 - 08:01pm PT
Interesting, but short news story about the "Canadian problem", where "people who receive flu vaccines year after year can sometimes show reduced protection". And "seasonal flu vaccination almost doubled the risk of infection with pandemic flu."

Says the issue is "imperfect vaccines" intended for "a moving target of strains".

http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/topstories/flu-vaccine-paradox-adds-to-public-health-debate-1.2912790
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Jan 23, 2015 - 08:18pm PT
Got my flu shot thanks to obummercare, combined with my decently healthy lifestyle I should outlive locker and his glue shack no problem!
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Jan 24, 2015 - 05:20pm PT
Yes, flu mutates, which makes the kind of vaccines we produce today an annual best guess. Changing that requires the development of a more 'universal' vaccine which would work against some aspect of the flu surface proteins which doesn't change, or changes much more slowly (or 'conserved'), as the flu mutates and hopefully is present in all flu strains.

Today's vaccines work by attempting to recognize the head of a mushroom-shaped protein on the flu's surface as opposed to its stem. The head portion of the protein mutates at a faster rate then the stem making it the target of a lot of 'universal' flu vaccine research.

STANFORD RESEARCHERS TAKE A STEP TOWARD DEVELOPING A ‘UNIVERSAL’ FLU VACCINE



Credit: healyje

More in-depth: Options and Obstacles for Designing a Universal Influenza Vaccine
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