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apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Nov 18, 2012 - 03:36pm PT
"...indeed Bush pulled some heavy duty BS in engaging Iraq-and now Obama is doing the same. "


Just to entertain your kool-aid soaked mind for a minute...

You're drawing an equivalency between the Shrub/Neocon shenanigans that placed us squarely and purposely into a pointless war with the Obama Administration's supposed inadequate security efforts & cover-up attempts in Libya?

Those two are equivalent?

Really?
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Nov 18, 2012 - 03:44pm PT
"The NDAA language is VERY MUCH the same as Nazi Germany. That is what i said.."

Another weird equivalency.

And pretty slimy, at that.

You guys are pretty desperate these days.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
USA Moundhouse Nev. and land o da SLEDS!
Nov 18, 2012 - 03:45pm PT
Yeesh apogee....No,, i didnt say ANYTHING of the like.. I DID say things about the NDAA including the pre-planning of the budget for an attack on IRAN, and i did say that Libya IS indeed an Obama debacle.

By the way,, Obama says taking the few rich types isnt going to be enough..




Apogee, what would YOU CALL detaining citizens with military for being "belligerent" sent off to gitmo for ten years before getting trial under a military tribunal? WHERE ON EARTH does this fit into the constitution, liberty or freedom?



edit: of course it wont be GITMO,, but one of the many detention centers being built and ammo cashes supplied to in the country.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Nov 18, 2012 - 04:32pm PT
The NDAA language is VERY MUCH the same as Nazi Germany. That is what i said..


YOUR language is VERY MUCH like that of the KKK, the Nazi's, the Stalinists, all of the fascists of history.

What does that tell us about you?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
USA Moundhouse Nev. and land o da SLEDS!
Nov 18, 2012 - 04:34pm PT
Your quite whacked this morn Ken...


STILL waiting for your list of patriotic duties though..
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Nov 18, 2012 - 04:35pm PT
Now TELL ME what youve done for our country. You wanna call my patriotism out -fine. Im callin yours. GIVE ME YOUR LIST or your just another limp wristed malingerer...

You have this bizarre concept that, instead of doing things because you love your country, you are accumulating "get out free" cards that allow you to do anything TO your country.

You appear to be in the same category of Aldrich Ames and other traitors, who thought that their life of public service allowed them to be traitors, and it is just fine.

I couldn't care less about your list of accomplishment, while you trash your country. Stand by your words, don't hide behind your history.
OR

Trad climber
Nov 18, 2012 - 04:37pm PT
YOUR language is VERY MUCH like that of the KKK, the Nazi's, the Stalinists, all of the fascists of history.

What does that tell us about you?

Really? I may not agree with Ron all the time but that statement is absurd. TOTAL FAIL.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
USA Moundhouse Nev. and land o da SLEDS!
Nov 18, 2012 - 06:16pm PT
thanks OR.. Kens kinda out there today.

Israel is getting serious with Hamas- forces now fighting in Gaza.

If my predictions are right, Obama will concentrate on Iran while Israel takes out Syria as well. Pre planned budgets for attacking Iran wont be wasted, thats govt 101. Spend every dime of your budget- so next year we get more. I did that very thing in the USFS.


Of course,, WASHINGTON is far to concentrated on who f*cked who and such so im sure they arent up to date with much else. The 'efforts' to find out the Benghazi bungle are going to be a long second to the sexual emails of generals - sounds like a SOAP OPERA....
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Nov 18, 2012 - 06:55pm PT
Republicans - the party of hysteria and drama.
Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Nov 18, 2012 - 08:36pm PT
edit: as for the NDAA ,, indeed it isnt just a dem or repub thing,,it IS a downright COMMUNISTIC thing.

Big difference between Communism and Fascism,

We've got the basis for Fascism in place but more subtle.

Sorta like Imperialism. Countries used to have to invade a country and dominate them in order to have an empire. now we do it with trade policies, the world bank, IMF, and other tricks. We make them keep their own slaves to us so we don't have to.

Same with Fascism (Tyrannic government and Corporations in cahoots) The Elite money and power rule us but keep us from even realizing that they've bought the system and the laws being passed are ready to use against us if we wake up and try to change things

PEace

karl
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Nov 19, 2012 - 12:42am PT
OR, Ron likes to make sweeping generalizations, drawing similarities to things that are in no way related, like the Congress and Nazis. This is his approach, and I just get tired of it.

I thought he'd see how he liked the technique applied to him. Apparently, he feels that his diminishes his worth and contributions. Of course, that would not apply to anything or anyone that HE attacked in the same way.

Perhaps he might open his eyes.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
USA Moundhouse Nev. and land o da SLEDS!
Nov 19, 2012 - 11:54am PT
Ken ill never be diminished by some politard thread on a forum.

Todays news: 110 rockets have been fired at Israel in the last couple of days from Hamas.



and TAXES will be GOING UP FOR 163 MILLION workers...!!!!!!!!!!


http://finance.yahoo.com/news/psst-taxes-2013-163-million-134829232.html
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
i WASNT ON THE INTERNET during bush years...
Nov 20, 2012 - 02:24pm PT
Top Five Worst Obamacare Taxes Coming in 2013

Of the twenty new or higher taxes in Obamacare, below are the five worst that will be foisted upon Americans for the first time on January 1, 2013:
The Obamacare Medical Device Tax – a $20 billion tax increase: Medical device manufacturers employ 409,000 people in 12,000 plants across the country. Obamacare imposes a new 2.3 percent excise tax on gross sales – even if the company does not earn a profit in a given year. In addition to killing small business jobs and impacting research and development budgets, this will increase the cost of your health care – making everything from pacemakers to prosthetics more expensive.
The Obamacare “Special Needs Kids Tax” – a $13 billion tax increase: The 30-35 million Americans who use a Flexible Spending Account (FSA) at work to pay for their family’s basic medical needs will face a new government cap of $2,500 (currently the accounts are unlimited under federal law, though employers are allowed to set a cap).
There is one group of FSA owners for whom this new cap will be particularly cruel and onerous: parents of special needs children. There are several million families with special needs children in the United States, and many of them use FSAs to pay for special needs education. Tuition rates at one leading school that teaches special needs children in Washington, D.C. (National Child Research Center) can easily exceed $14,000 per year. Under tax rules, FSA dollars can be used to pay for this type of special needs education. This Obamacare tax provision will limit the options available to these families.
The Obamacare Surtax on Investment Income – a $123 billion tax increase: This is a new, 3.8 percentage point surtax on investment income earned in households making at least $250,000 ($200,000 single). This would result in the following top tax rates on investment income:

Capital Gains
Dividends
Other*
2012
15%
15%
35%
2013+ (current law)
23.8%
43.4%
43.4%
The table above also incorporates the scheduled hike in the capital gains rate from 15 to 20 percent, and the scheduled hike in dividends rate from 15 to 39.6 percent.
The Obamacare “Haircut” for Medical Itemized Deductions – a $15.2 billion tax increase: Currently, those Americans facing high medical expenses are allowed a deduction to the extent that those expenses exceed 7.5 percent of adjusted gross income (AGI). This tax increase imposes a threshold of 10 percent of AGI. By limiting this deduction, Obamacare widens the net of taxable income for the sickest Americans. This tax provision will most harm near retirees and those with modest incomes but high medical bills.
The Obamacare Medicare Payroll Tax Hike -- an $86.8 billion tax increase: The Medicare payroll tax is currently 2.9 percent on all wages and self-employment profits. Under this tax hike, wages and profits exceeding $200,000 ($250,000 in the case of married couples) will face a 3.8 percent rate instead. This is a direct marginal income tax hike on small business owners, who are liable for self-employment tax in most cases. The table below compares current law vs. the Obamacare Medicare Payroll Tax Hike:

First $200,000
($250,000 Married)
Employer/Employee
All Remaining Wages
Employer/Employee
Current Law
1.45%/1.45%
2.9% self-employed
1.45%/1.45%
2.9% self-employed
Obamacare Tax Hike
1.45%/1.45%
2.9% self-employed
1.45%/2.35%
3.8% self-employed

Click here to view PDF form.
Posted by John Kartch on Friday, September 28, 2012 2:58 PM EDT


Read more: http://atr.org/five-worst-obamacare-taxes-coming-a7217#ixzz2CnCApEmY
Follow us: @taxreformer on Twitter
rectorsquid

climber
Lake Tahoe
Nov 20, 2012 - 02:27pm PT
How exactly can the government pay for all of the stuff that people want without raising their taxes? By borrowing of course.

What's worse, tax-and-spend liberals or borrow-and-spend conservatives?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
i WASNT ON THE INTERNET during bush years...
Nov 20, 2012 - 02:31pm PT
Well Obama has hinted at a 163 billion dollar tax hike- that wont be coming from the "rich" as he said that wont be enough..If something appears to be too good to be true~~~. I dont know how much of that will go to the pre-budgeted attack on Iran though.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
i WASNT ON THE INTERNET during bush years...
Nov 20, 2012 - 02:45pm PT
And since JUST after the election,, Obama has decided to re-engage with the UN and the Treaty that was turned down PRE election, things like AGENDA 21 below are now on the table. "ONE WORLD" sort of proposals, as if we have any extra money to take care of every third world nation right!????????


We have been hearing the rumors for quite some time, and they are showing their ugly heads to be true.

Resources > Publications > Core Publications

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Agenda 21
Cover
TOC
Preamble
Sec I
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Rio Declaration
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Order


Chapter
Ch 1
Ch 2
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Ch 4
Ch 5
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Preamble

1.1. Humanity stands at a defining moment in history. We are confronted with a perpetuation of disparities between and within nations, a worsening of poverty, hunger, ill health and illiteracy, and the continuing deterioration of the ecosystems on which we depend for our well-being. However, integration of environment and development concerns and greater attention to them will lead to the fulfilment of basic needs, improved living standards for all, better protected and managed ecosystems and a safer, more prosperous future. No nation can achieve this on its own; but together we can - in a global partnership for sustainable development.

1.2. This global partnership must build on the premises of General Assembly resolution 44/228 of 22 December 1989, which was adopted when the nations of the world called for the United Nations Conference on Environment and Development, and on the acceptance of the need to take a balanced and integrated approach to environment and development questions.

1.3. Agenda 21 addresses the pressing problems of today and also aims at preparing the world for the challenges of the next century. It reflects a global consensus and political commitment at the highest level on development and environment cooperation. Its successful implementation is first and foremost the responsibility of Governments. National strategies, plans, policies and processes are crucial in achieving this. International cooperation should support and supplement such national efforts. In this context, the United Nations system has a key role to play. Other international, regional and subregional organizations are also called upon to contribute to this effort. The broadest public participation and the active involvement of the non-governmental organizations and other groups should also be encouraged.

1.4. The developmental and environmental objectives of Agenda 21 will require a substantial flow of new and additional financial resources to developing countries, in order to cover the incremental costs for the actions they have to undertake to deal with global environmental problems and to accelerate sustainable development. Financial resources are also required for strengthening the capacity of international institutions for the implementation of Agenda 21. An indicative order-of-magnitude assessment of costs is included in each of the programme areas. This assessment will need to be examined and refined by the relevant implementing agencies and organizations.

1.5. In the implementation of the relevant programme areas identified in Agenda 21, special attention should be given to the particular circumstances facing the economies in transition. It must also be recognized that these countries are facing unprecedented challenges in transforming their economies, in some cases in the midst of considerable social and political tension.

1.6. The programme areas that constitute Agenda 21 are described in terms of the basis for action, objectives, activities and means of implementation. Agenda 21 is a dynamic programme. It will be carried out by the various actors according to the different situations, capacities and priorities of countries and regions in full respect of all the principles contained in the Rio Declaration on Environment and Development. It could evolve over time in the light of changing needs and circumstances. This process marks the beginning of a new global partnership for sustainable development.

* When the term "Governments" is used, it will be deemed to include the European Economic Community within its areas of competence. Throughout Agenda 21 the term "environmentally sound" means "environmentally safe and sound", in particular when applied to the terms "energy sources", "energy supplies", "energy systems" and "technology" or "technologies".

Copyright © United Nations 2009 | Terms of Use | Privacy Notice






Yes im sure treatys and "deals" with those sworn to hate and kill us are going to work out swell.. I wonder how washington proposes to pay for any of that? The more we here about one world,, one power etc,, the scarier this all becomes. All one has to do is look back, at each and every attempt to help those third world nations such as the ME. Each and every time they have turned around and used any advancements against us, from guns to bombs to people to computers. And Now this admin seeks to further our dealings in countries weve no business dealing with. Take the time to read the whole of agend 21- you will be shocked.


and ill mention again how this treaty was already canned BEFORE the election, and is NOW back on the table.. Weve been LIED too,, again..

And the very fabric of our Nation is now being "changed" to include absolute dependence upon foreign countries from what guns you may have to how many children you should have to who pays for what- where. Some sort of "world union" that will be as effective as the UN- the biggest joke to ever be as MANY know. This is all strikingly scary to think of- yet these proposals are HERE! And we are essentially in debt to a point of no return- HOW can this even be seriously considered by ANY representative of the USA is beyond me..



http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/10/un_agenda_21_coming_to_a_neigh.html
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Nov 20, 2012 - 04:05pm PT
The average Republican has no idea how to work with others.


Once the poster child for the GOP, NJ governor Christie is now on the GOP sh#t list for working with Obama when his state became a disaster zone.


When will they learn that the world is made up of people, and many are not white men.

Ron, why do Republicans hate women??
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
i WASNT ON THE INTERNET during bush years...
Nov 20, 2012 - 04:13pm PT
uhhmmm kind of a blanket statement .. I know many republicans none of whom hate women..

Romneys platform failed many republicans in truth.. Just as Obamas actions have failed his platform thus far.

No one i know thinks its the govts business in what a woman does to or with her body. That is up to her and her own convictions.

But Kman,, did you look at the posts above? This isnt about dem/repub, but about all of US, just as the NDAA 2013 bill is about US.


No partisanship here what so ever. Both are /have been involved in the shredding of the constitution.


BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Nov 20, 2012 - 04:20pm PT
THANKS RON FOR SPREADING SOME TRUTH!!!!!
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Nov 20, 2012 - 04:24pm PT
OK Ron, Why do you hate to help those in need?

Here's the bolded text from your post:

1.4. The developmental and environmental objectives of Agenda 21 will require a substantial flow of new and additional financial resources to developing countries, in order to cover the incremental costs for the actions they have to undertake to deal with global environmental problems and to accelerate sustainable development.



And if all the Republicans you know love women, they why are they still Republicans when the GOP hates women??
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