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Tomcat
Trad climber
Chatham N.H.
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:13pm PT
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Which brings us neatly around to just what Jack Burns posted...lol.
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:14pm PT
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Tomcat, it's because the numbers don't add up to support what you are saying.
12% of the voting population is black.
80-90% are dems: they'd vote for Hillary if she was the nominee, and she is white, btw.
Even if the number jumps to 100% voting this year for Obama because of his skin color, you are still looking at an increase in only 1-2% in Obama's vote total.
Now...20% of the democratic primary voters in West Virginia admitted race was an issue for their selection. And these are just the ones who would admit it in person to an interviewer. This total is likely higher because admitting racism is considered a social faux pas. W VA may or may not be representative of the rest of the USA, but extrapoloate it as you wish across the rest of the US white population, which is over 50%.
Sorry, it just doesn't add up Tomcat.
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philo
Trad climber
boulder, co.
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:16pm PT
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For Tomcat...
These are not my words but food for thought.
'What if John McCain were a former president of the Harvard
Law Review?
What if Barack Obama finished fifth from the bottom of his
graduating class?
What if McCain were still married to the first woman he
said 'I do' to?
What if Obama were the candidate who left his first wife
after she no longer measured up to his standards?
What if Michelle Obama were a wife who not only became
addicted to pain killers, but acquired them illegally
through her charitable organization?
What if Cindy McCain graduated from Harvard?
What if Obama were a member of the Keating-5*?
* The Keating Five were five United States Senators accused
of corruption in 1989, igniting a major political scandal
as part of the larger Savings and Loan crisis of the late
1980s and early 1990s.
What if McCain were a charismatic, eloquent speaker?
If these questions reflected reality, do you really believe
the election numbers would be as close as they are?
This is what racism does. It covers up, rationalizes and
minimizes positive qualities in one candidate and
emphasizes negative qualities in another when there is a
color difference.
PS: What if Barack Obama had an unwed, pregnant teenage
daughter....
You are The Boss... which team would you hire?
With America facing historic debt, 2 wars, stumbling health
care, a weakened dollar, all-time high prison population,
mortgage crises, bank foreclosures, etc:
Educational Background:
Obama:
Columbia University - B.A. Political Science with a
Specialization in International Relations.
Harvard - Juris Doctor (J.D.) Magna C#m Laude
Biden:
University of Delaware - B.A. in History and B.A. in
Political Science.
Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)
vs.
McCain:
United States Naval Academy - Class rank: 894 of 899
Palin:
Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester
North Idaho College - 2 semesters - general study
University of Idaho - 2 semesters - journalism
Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester
University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in Journalism
Now, which team are you going to hire ?
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Witch Hunter
Social climber
Templeton, CA
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:20pm PT
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LEB, how can I be racist for calling people white trash when I'm white?
And where's your evidence that Edwards ever fathered a baby out of wedlock? As far as I know he was just banging her, his buddy acccepted responsibility for the baby.
LEB is spinning again, don't drop the Koolade!
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just passing thru
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 10, 2008 - 01:26pm PT
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PP:
"there were alot of elderly and infants and people without cars in Katrina"
Sure this is where you can blame the local leadership of the Democrats for not properly preparing their citizens for a storm that was on N.O. tract for days
Those in the Super Dome were the underbelly of our society. If the Super Dome refugees were white folk, I would feel the same way about them: unprepared, lazy people that were unable to take care of themselves.
It's not like this was an earthquake with no warning, everyone knew Katrina was coming.
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Tomcat
Trad climber
Chatham N.H.
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:36pm PT
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Dirtbag,I know how much you want to spin this that way,but your post does not add up,simply because you chose West Virginia as a litmus test.There are many states in the Union where people care little,if at all,about people's color.In my estimation,the percentages of prejudiced whites is about equal to that of blacks overall.
Philo,on paper your man looks of substance,in real life,be honest.President of Harvard Law Review,published nothing.Eight years as Illinois State Senator,along with 66 other senators and 118 legislators in that state.So worried about ruffling feathers he voted present mostly.Community organizer,what is that?Communities are organized by nature,did he start one?
McCain graduated low in a class at the Naval Academy,everyone there is an overacheiver.Obama get's a free pass on his past decisions because he never made any,and has just a wee tiny amount of time in the Senate,the real Senate.Looking at the money he diverted to his pals in Illinois,I'm certain he would not be in the Senate as long as McCain without a few snafus,just comes with the territory.
I don't see where Obama has held a single performance based job in his entire life.He is good at getting job titles,and exploiting them to get a bigger one.If elected president,for the first time in his life,he will have to actually perform.That will be interesting.
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PP
Trad climber
SF,CA
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:44pm PT
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JPT if come upon an injured person in a car crash do you first ask them if they are lazy? or unprepared? they need help, you help them.
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:46pm PT
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"lazy" people in Katrina -
What an awful, but telling, thing to write.
People of all colors stayed and evacuated from the Katrina hurricane.
Elderly people in particular are wont to stay put in crises, for they haven't got the resources(money, transit, place to go) available. Elderly also tend to become nervous when faced with unfamiliar scenarios; they'd rather stick to their routines than deal with chaos.
Many people couldn't have left had they wanted to. One DOES need resources....like money, transit and a place to go to. Some people stayed because their family pets would not be accepted in shelters. You can bet your ass I would not abandon MY dog if I was told I had to leave him behind.
The afult of the Katrina debacle came down on Bush for ONE reason, because he had appointed his good friend "Brownie" to head FEMA.
FEMA DID do a heck of a job in NYC after the 9/11 crisis, which was really when the organization came into public eye for most of us. It was a functioning and pretty effective organization.
And Bush stuck his finger in it when he should have left it alone.
The man he appointed was completely incompetent and utterly failed when he was needed to shine. People DIED because of that man's lack of competency and experience. DIED. Left in wheelchairs by the side of the road, drowned in the waters and starved waiting in their homes. because of the failure of the system; not because they were lazy.
Those who had no resources to evacuate the city were told to go to that stadium. They did what they were TOLD, and they TRUSTED their government.
And they were left there alone.
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philo
Trad climber
boulder, co.
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Oct 10, 2008 - 01:48pm PT
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Tomcat stop and look at it hisway for just a moment.
What of the comparitive experience of Palin? If McCain wins and dies she steps in.
If Obama wins and dies then Biden steps in.
Now Biden has at least as much practical experience as McCain.
Can you honestly say that Palin's resume even remotly stacks up to Obama's?
Based on any of the criteria you stated in your post that questioned Obama's credentials what can you truly say Palin has ever done that qualifys her?
Great post Happiegrrrl
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SMQ
climber
Grand Rapids, MI
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Oct 10, 2008 - 02:41pm PT
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just passing thru: "I am certainly not a racist."
Well, I am. I find it more difficult to trust people I have a harder time understanding, I find it easier blame people who are different from me, I make a host of assumptions and generalizations about someone based on nothing more than the color of their skin, the fit of their clothes, the manner of their speech, and I do it every day. I fight it, I attempt to consciously recognize and compensate for my own bias, I try not to be a racist, a classist, an elitist, but I often fail. Despite my efforts, I am a racist.
And it seems to me that unless more people on all sides are willing to treat racism as something that's *here*, not *there* -- unless more people are willing to own the issue themselves -- not one thing of any importance will be changed. Not one d@mn thing.
--SMQ
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 10, 2008 - 02:41pm PT
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LOL, Talus fool!
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 10, 2008 - 02:45pm PT
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nice post SMQ, It's better to know yourself and take the time to adjust for our preconception than to just stew in denial
"I don't see where Obama has held a single performance based job in his entire life.He is good at getting job titles,and exploiting them to get a bigger one.If elected president,for the first time in his life,he will have to actually perform.That will be interesting."
Thing is, Obama chooses good staff around him while McCain choose political karl rove clone operatives. The president can't know everything. He delegates %90 of everything and is the leader who inspires and make priority calls. Obama should excel.
peace
Karl
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just passing thru
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 10, 2008 - 02:59pm PT
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So, it is okay to rail on white trash (white people of lower economic and social status)
But if we point out the “Black Trash” (Super Dome folks) it is taboo?
Dallas's crime rate increased when the Super Dome refugees started showing up.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 10, 2008 - 05:20pm PT
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"But if we point out the “Black Trash” (Super Dome folks) it is taboo? "
This happens all the time pretty much. People have just gotten very good at using other words for it. Reagan was the master with his "welfare Cadillac queens." There was no question as to the race of the people he was referring to. In fact "welfare recipients" became essentially a euphemism for "poor and black."
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Witch Hunter
Social climber
Templeton, CA
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Oct 10, 2008 - 05:39pm PT
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DJ, the fact of the matter is an overwhelming majority of people on welfare are white. To reference to Welfare Cadillac Queens is meant to work on people bigotry.
When I see white people using food stamps, using the ER for medical treatment, and then going out and getting into a new $40k SUV (because the value of a vehicle can't be used against you when you apply for assistance), in my eyes, they are trash, white trash to be specific.
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Oct 10, 2008 - 05:40pm PT
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And you're posting this just passing thru because out of your selfless concern for others?
What a warm, decent human being you must be. Thank you for caring.
Why don't you just keep "passing thru."
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Oct 10, 2008 - 05:52pm PT
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Witch: Yes I'm aware of the real welfare demographics, that is part of what makes it so racist.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Oct 10, 2008 - 06:03pm PT
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There's nobody more PC in this country than uptight conservatives.
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Pennsylenvy
Gym climber
Fannie's Crack, AZ
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Oct 10, 2008 - 06:21pm PT
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'Dallas' crime rate went up when they showed up'.......This is truely a stab in the dark. Crime rates have been tied to so many ambiguous figures. The book freakonomics goes into a study on crime rates and how everyone ascribed crime to a certain factor when in reality years later that factor had nothing to do with it. Crime rates fluctuate due to a variety of factors. Give me a source and a direct link to Katrina victim's relationship to crime in Dallas and I'll believe you. Other than that you are just trying to defend your position. This thread now has become about questioning weather you are actually a racist, or just an observant person. Your arguments have a revealing direction in them though. If your an observant person, no problem,if your racist it helps to admit it. I am a racist to the extent that I have natural inclinations that may make me fear people who aren't like me. You can say your not a racist, but the direction of your arguments make me wonder.
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