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ricardo
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 22, 2004 - 03:45pm PT
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Hypothetical situation: "You're fixing on the trip, and can't make p4 on the first day."
Would be it better to fix to P2, or P3 .. I remember there being a discussion of a sharp edge that has a history of chopping fixed lines on one of this stations.
 ricardo
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ricardo
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 22, 2004 - 05:17pm PT
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thanks for the quick replies guys! ..
ricardo
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Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
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Sep 22, 2004 - 08:31pm PT
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yup, edge on 2 (top)
Both 3 and 4 are clean to the ground.
charge that sh#t Ricardo you got it!
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nature
climber
Flagstaff, AZ
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Sep 23, 2004 - 10:32am PT
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One way to avoid having to "fix" is to do Virginia. Or, do the dumb thing we did last year. Start up Lost In America (only need to lead the first pitch but do the second just for fun because that arrow pounded straight up is RAD!), realize you just don't have the sack to finish LA, bail to Virginia, then continue on the Trip. You can haul each pitch one at a time. The climbing is a bit more stiff (NW A2+) but considering the potential for chaos on the regular start one might argue it's less dangerous. It's only three pitches to the start of "the fifth" on the trip.
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Sep 23, 2004 - 11:16pm PT
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I want to warn you that I know of 2 instances when people have fixed pitches to pitch 3 and had their ropes damaged while jugging back up, one resulting in death, though I can't remember her name. The other instance involved my good friend Errett Allen who was fortunate enough that when he saw the sheath pull apart he was able to transfer to someone elses fixed lines. It is a rounded edge and looks harmless enough but, it was pretty much common knowledge that you either fixed to the 2nd or the 4th. If you don't beleive me at least do some research as I would hate to read about another death on the Trip. Climb safely.
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Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
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Sep 24, 2004 - 12:11am PT
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Just to clarify...it is the top of the 2nd pitch that goes over the edge(or bottom of the 3rd...which ever you want to call it)...not the top of the third. Been through those pitches twice in the last two seasons.
from Clint Cummins site...
>1-2. Two people who fell off the Trip.
1 - fixed rope cut by sharp/rough rock while jumaring back to top of p2
(late 70s?). Maybe the same as #17 below.
2 - Carol Moyer, 1983 (ANAM 1984). Following a downward diagonal
pitch 4 on jumars, when they came off the rope (she wasn't tied
in to end of rope).
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ricardo
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2004 - 04:31am PT
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.. At this point i think i'm going to climb P1 of Lost in America and then do p2 and p3 of Virginia to get onto the trip ..
.. looks more straight forward in paper .. and i am more confident that i can do that in a day.
ricardo
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Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
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Sep 24, 2004 - 10:27am PT
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In my opinion, you should do the Trip start. It is part of the route...and it's kinda cool in a weird way.
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David
Trad climber
San Rafael, CA
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Sep 24, 2004 - 11:53am PT
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When Cmac hauled my ass up the Trip in May we used the Lost in America/Virginia start. It was pretty funny. After carrying a loads to the base I headed back to the car for the ledge and some more water while Chris stayed at the base to sort out the rack and get us started. I thought I did the hike down and back rather quickly. I don't think I stopped once but by the time I was back at the base of the climb he was on the ground and both pitches were already fixed. Redicuolous!
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Rhodo-Router
Trad climber
Otto, NC
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Sep 24, 2004 - 11:57am PT
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The Trip start is fine-- think how many people have managed to pull it off successfully. Bring edge pro if it keeps you happy.
Ahh, what the f*#k am I saying? Do what you like, it's your climb. Traverse in from the Nose if that's what you feel like.
I need to get a life.
Although-- the down-aiding arch is pretty cool. For the leader. I remember following it, hanging off tat from this creaky, rusty old knifeblade with nothing between me and the belay but an ugly 150 degree slam into a pedestal, and my partner laughing at me saying "I bet right about now you're hoping that knifeblade doesn't blow"-- he had penji'd 25 feet to the bee-lay from it...
F%ckin' I sound like an old-timer...them was the days...
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Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
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Sep 24, 2004 - 01:09pm PT
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Rhoto,
My friend/partner was in that exact same position....but the pin did blow...and he took a 30fter straight onto the anchor. It was prety wild, glad nothing bad happened other then having to cut the knot out of the rope.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Sep 24, 2004 - 09:06pm PT
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Wonder if that LIA/Virginia start would be a better option when the Trip is drippy?
Still haven't got around to the Trip but I want to. Last time I found myself at the base it was super wet and Zodiac was empty so I got tempted and went over there.
Peace
karl
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ricardo
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2004 - 09:27pm PT
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karl:
what are you doing next week? -- lets do the trip.
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Rhodo-Router
Trad climber
Otto, NC
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Sep 25, 2004 - 11:12am PT
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Lucky the jugs didn't bite right through...eek.
Sometimes it pays to be a lightweight.
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nature
climber
Flagstaff, AZ
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Sep 25, 2004 - 11:33am PT
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Karl... My guess is it is less drippy. In fact, Virginia is probably a result of the drip factor. The top of the first pitch of LIA can be connected with the top of the second on Virginia via a short 5.easy section.
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ricardo
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2004 - 06:46pm PT
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Well here is the skinny on the alternate start.
P1 of Lost In America: A dicy move close to the ground, where some dead heads clutter up a small seam. Placed a beak and moved on up. It gets easier after that. Bring lots of medium pieces if you plan to aid the 5.8 ramp.
I did not go all the way to the virginia anchors due to time and lack of gear.
From LA to Virginia, its easy 5.7 medium pieces. Goes quickly.
P2 + P3 of Virginia, link easily. Mostly fixed heads + rivets. Several of the head moves can be skipped by hooking, or using offset-aliens. If I had been thinking more clearly i would have cleaned the fixed heads that were next to good offset alien placements, or hook moves. Some reachy fixed pieces. I added 1 head towards the top since topstepping on very steep terrain above sketchy gear did not sound that much fun to me. -- bring lots of rivet hangers. I had about 10, and that was not enough. (I ended up using my nuts, but then you loose a few inches of reach due to the longer length of the cable)
I am fairly average on speed for a soloist (2 pitches a day), so it took me 2 days to fix to p4 this way. But it was way relaxed, and i was humping loads up to the base at the same time.
If you climb this variation start for the trip, you will have done the crux in the first 2 pitches. Nothing on the trip is even close in difficulty as the stuff in Lost In America or Virginia.
All the fixed gear tested fine, and felt solid, though i agree with chris, if some piece goes, you could sail for a while -- alot of air beneath you.
ricardo
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nature
climber
Flagstaff, AZ
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Oct 26, 2004 - 08:21pm PT
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ricard - that's a very good summation. It actually did bring back lost memories :-). P2 + P3 link because you come into Virginia P2 from L in A - is that correct? (trying to remember).
Toss in a fun variation - do the 2nd pitch on L in A before deciding to sissy out and bail to the trip. If I remember anything from that climb it was the arrow/blade? pounded straight up into a crack near the end - yummy and fun. Or hell, just don't be a sissy at all and do L in A.
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