Fixing on Tangerine Trip..

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ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 22, 2004 - 03:45pm PT
Hypothetical situation: "You're fixing on the trip, and can't make p4 on the first day."

Would be it better to fix to P2, or P3 .. I remember there being a discussion of a sharp edge that has a history of chopping fixed lines on one of this stations.

    ricardo
Chris McNamara

SuperTopo staff member
Sep 22, 2004 - 03:55pm PT
much better to fix to 3. i think the shape edge is on 2.
Gene

Social climber
Two hours away
Sep 22, 2004 - 04:02pm PT
http://www.fishproducts.com/index1.html


http://www.stanford.edu/~clint/yos/elcapd.txt
Mike.

climber
Sep 22, 2004 - 05:06pm PT
Combining 3 & 4 might help. Or fix one and go.
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 22, 2004 - 05:17pm PT
thanks for the quick replies guys! ..

    ricardo
Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Sep 22, 2004 - 08:31pm PT
yup, edge on 2 (top)

Both 3 and 4 are clean to the ground.

charge that sh#t Ricardo you got it!
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Sep 23, 2004 - 10:32am PT
One way to avoid having to "fix" is to do Virginia. Or, do the dumb thing we did last year. Start up Lost In America (only need to lead the first pitch but do the second just for fun because that arrow pounded straight up is RAD!), realize you just don't have the sack to finish LA, bail to Virginia, then continue on the Trip. You can haul each pitch one at a time. The climbing is a bit more stiff (NW A2+) but considering the potential for chaos on the regular start one might argue it's less dangerous. It's only three pitches to the start of "the fifth" on the trip.
Chicken Skinner

Trad climber
Yosemite
Sep 23, 2004 - 11:16pm PT
I want to warn you that I know of 2 instances when people have fixed pitches to pitch 3 and had their ropes damaged while jugging back up, one resulting in death, though I can't remember her name. The other instance involved my good friend Errett Allen who was fortunate enough that when he saw the sheath pull apart he was able to transfer to someone elses fixed lines. It is a rounded edge and looks harmless enough but, it was pretty much common knowledge that you either fixed to the 2nd or the 4th. If you don't beleive me at least do some research as I would hate to read about another death on the Trip. Climb safely.
Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Sep 24, 2004 - 12:11am PT
Just to clarify...it is the top of the 2nd pitch that goes over the edge(or bottom of the 3rd...which ever you want to call it)...not the top of the third. Been through those pitches twice in the last two seasons.

from Clint Cummins site...

>1-2. Two people who fell off the Trip.
1 - fixed rope cut by sharp/rough rock while jumaring back to top of p2
(late 70s?). Maybe the same as #17 below.
2 - Carol Moyer, 1983 (ANAM 1984). Following a downward diagonal
pitch 4 on jumars, when they came off the rope (she wasn't tied
in to end of rope).
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2004 - 04:31am PT
.. At this point i think i'm going to climb P1 of Lost in America and then do p2 and p3 of Virginia to get onto the trip ..

.. looks more straight forward in paper .. and i am more confident that i can do that in a day.

    ricardo
Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Sep 24, 2004 - 10:27am PT
In my opinion, you should do the Trip start. It is part of the route...and it's kinda cool in a weird way.
David

Trad climber
San Rafael, CA
Sep 24, 2004 - 11:53am PT
When Cmac hauled my ass up the Trip in May we used the Lost in America/Virginia start. It was pretty funny. After carrying a loads to the base I headed back to the car for the ledge and some more water while Chris stayed at the base to sort out the rack and get us started. I thought I did the hike down and back rather quickly. I don't think I stopped once but by the time I was back at the base of the climb he was on the ground and both pitches were already fixed. Redicuolous!
Rhodo-Router

Trad climber
Otto, NC
Sep 24, 2004 - 11:57am PT
The Trip start is fine-- think how many people have managed to pull it off successfully. Bring edge pro if it keeps you happy.

Ahh, what the f*#k am I saying? Do what you like, it's your climb. Traverse in from the Nose if that's what you feel like.

I need to get a life.

Although-- the down-aiding arch is pretty cool. For the leader. I remember following it, hanging off tat from this creaky, rusty old knifeblade with nothing between me and the belay but an ugly 150 degree slam into a pedestal, and my partner laughing at me saying "I bet right about now you're hoping that knifeblade doesn't blow"-- he had penji'd 25 feet to the bee-lay from it...

F%ckin' I sound like an old-timer...them was the days...
Mike.

climber
Sep 24, 2004 - 12:32pm PT
Where else can one do a Robbins/Porter route? The down aiding is silly and fun (and probably good practice for the reportoir). I did it in the rain - totally dry.

Best,

Mr. Not-finished-the-actual-route-cuz-offroute-climbing-is-my-thing
Kofi Donny Annan

climber
Utah
Sep 24, 2004 - 01:03pm PT
yea what Mike said. robbins/ porter = must see TV
Kofi Donny Annan

climber
Utah
Sep 24, 2004 - 01:04pm PT
yea what Mike said. robbins/ porter = must see TV
Kofi Donny Annan

climber
Utah
Sep 24, 2004 - 01:04pm PT
sorry. i stutter.
Lambone

Ice climber
Ashland, Or
Sep 24, 2004 - 01:09pm PT
Rhoto,

My friend/partner was in that exact same position....but the pin did blow...and he took a 30fter straight onto the anchor. It was prety wild, glad nothing bad happened other then having to cut the knot out of the rope.
Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Sep 24, 2004 - 09:06pm PT
Wonder if that LIA/Virginia start would be a better option when the Trip is drippy?

Still haven't got around to the Trip but I want to. Last time I found myself at the base it was super wet and Zodiac was empty so I got tempted and went over there.

Peace

karl
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 24, 2004 - 09:27pm PT
karl:

what are you doing next week? -- lets do the trip.
Rhodo-Router

Trad climber
Otto, NC
Sep 25, 2004 - 11:12am PT
Lucky the jugs didn't bite right through...eek.
Sometimes it pays to be a lightweight.
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Sep 25, 2004 - 11:33am PT
Karl... My guess is it is less drippy. In fact, Virginia is probably a result of the drip factor. The top of the first pitch of LIA can be connected with the top of the second on Virginia via a short 5.easy section.
Chris McNamara

SuperTopo staff member
Sep 25, 2004 - 02:14pm PT
The L in A/Virginia start is pretty fun. Definitely harder than the regular trip start. but soooo much more direct. what is cool is that you can climb in two REALLY LONG pitches instead of the Trip's 4 pitches. the second of those two pitches is really steep and wild. Mostly clipping bolts and fixed heads, but sometimes have to make a spicy RP or hook move. and a few big reaches to avoid nailing. it goes clean.

on the L in A/Virginia start you are protected from most of the drips BUT the virginia pitch leading to belay 4 of the trip IS wet. and since that section involves fixed #2 heads and RP's... and is super steep... its pretty spicy. Totally safe, but you could sail through the air for a while...
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 26, 2004 - 06:46pm PT
Well here is the skinny on the alternate start.

P1 of Lost In America: A dicy move close to the ground, where some dead heads clutter up a small seam. Placed a beak and moved on up. It gets easier after that. Bring lots of medium pieces if you plan to aid the 5.8 ramp.

I did not go all the way to the virginia anchors due to time and lack of gear.

From LA to Virginia, its easy 5.7 medium pieces. Goes quickly.

P2 + P3 of Virginia, link easily. Mostly fixed heads + rivets. Several of the head moves can be skipped by hooking, or using offset-aliens. If I had been thinking more clearly i would have cleaned the fixed heads that were next to good offset alien placements, or hook moves. Some reachy fixed pieces. I added 1 head towards the top since topstepping on very steep terrain above sketchy gear did not sound that much fun to me. -- bring lots of rivet hangers. I had about 10, and that was not enough. (I ended up using my nuts, but then you loose a few inches of reach due to the longer length of the cable)

I am fairly average on speed for a soloist (2 pitches a day), so it took me 2 days to fix to p4 this way. But it was way relaxed, and i was humping loads up to the base at the same time.

If you climb this variation start for the trip, you will have done the crux in the first 2 pitches. Nothing on the trip is even close in difficulty as the stuff in Lost In America or Virginia.

All the fixed gear tested fine, and felt solid, though i agree with chris, if some piece goes, you could sail for a while -- alot of air beneath you.

    ricardo
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 26, 2004 - 08:21pm PT
ricard - that's a very good summation. It actually did bring back lost memories :-). P2 + P3 link because you come into Virginia P2 from L in A - is that correct? (trying to remember).

Toss in a fun variation - do the 2nd pitch on L in A before deciding to sissy out and bail to the trip. If I remember anything from that climb it was the arrow/blade? pounded straight up into a crack near the end - yummy and fun. Or hell, just don't be a sissy at all and do L in A.
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Oct 26, 2004 - 08:55pm PT
The Lost In America to Virginia to P4 of The Trip start is becoming more popular - I saw at least one party do it just before the storm hit.

Lost In America is quite a nice route, actually, and deserves to be climbed more often. It was my 23rd El Cap route and 7th solo. Evidently I didn't find it too hard because I graded it NTB, with no DFU sections. I also managed to climb it quite fast [for me] spending only seven days on the wall. In comparison I spent twelve nights soloing Zed-Em and eight soloing The Shortest Straw.

I had no clue as to where the 5.8R climbing was supposedly up and right of 5 - I climbed straight up which was kinda scary. I found the 11th pitch - Fly or Die - to be pretty good value. I placed 3 heads, and whipped when a bat hook popped. People on the ground later told me they heard me scream when I fell!

One Monday morning [16/6/03] I was entirely alone on the SE face of El Cap, definitely a first. The day before, the Hubers flew by on nearby Zodiac setting one of their record speed ascents.

I remember P12 - The Place of Dead Roads - was pretty long-ass and involved, and took rather long to lead and clean. I placed 16 pins,and actually had to leave a #3 LA which I couldn't clean after breaking two crabs on my funkness.

If you're looking for a gentle intro to old school A4, Lost In America would be your route. I've got my detailed Dr. Piton Super-Duper Beta, so if anyone's interested, drop me a line and I'd be happy to pass it on to you.

Cheers,

Pete
Brick

Social climber
SF, CA
Oct 26, 2004 - 09:14pm PT
"Pete, I really, really like you. Be my man?"

Brick

Social climber
SF, CA
Oct 26, 2004 - 09:23pm PT
Mid 40ís single woman in Canada seeks mid 40ís single Canadian man, er Wall Doctor. Must be adventurous, sensitive and able to meet all my carnal needs.



sorry for the thread highjack. ...you may now resume the spray-fest....
NeverSurfaced

Trad climber
Someplace F*#ked!
Oct 26, 2004 - 09:55pm PT
Jesus Christ Brick! You're honked-up.
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 26, 2004 - 09:57pm PT
WAIT!!! Brick is using old material! We've seen this before in posts gone bye, no!?!?!?
Brick

Social climber
SF, CA
Oct 26, 2004 - 10:00pm PT
nature, nature, nature, the Brickster would NEVER recycle. This these goods are fresh. virgin, even...
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Oct 26, 2004 - 10:22pm PT
... but she is kinda cute ...
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2004 - 12:59am PT
Ivo described Lost In America as the chossiest route on el cap ..

that is probably enough to keep me off of it for a bit .. (that and the fact that i've yet to break into hard aid on el cap)

    ricardo
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Oct 27, 2004 - 01:29am PT
Ha! I had an interesting conversation with Ivo:

Me: "I think I used up my Fear Quota on Bermuda Dunes -- I'm looking for a route to solo that's a little easier. Lost In America sounds about right."

Ivo: "You vill be scared....."

Me: "Nah, it should be pretty mellow...."

Ivo: "You vill be scared." [then he turns his back and walks away]






Ivo was right.

Besides, Ricardo, I thought we decided Sunkist was your next solo?
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2004 - 01:59am PT
Oh well .. so much for keeping only informative posts on this thread ..

uhh -- my next solo ... uhh .. umm ... emmm .. wheew -- good thing i dont have vacation until next year .. probably ZM
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 27, 2004 - 09:27am PT
Gee, this thread took a turn for the worse now didn't it? Funny how that happens around here. (I deleted two of my offending posts).
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2004 - 01:43pm PT
pete brings out the "best" in people .. specially when he hijacks a thread to let everyone else know what routes he's climbed and how many days he spent on each one ..

    ricardo
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 27, 2004 - 02:28pm PT
no really, is that where we took a left turn to Albuquerque?
big wall paul

Trad climber
tahoe, CA
Oct 27, 2004 - 04:15pm PT
this thread is all over the place... but here's this because I still think it's funny:
I've never done the first 4 pitches on the trip because: I was 'beach combing' the base of el cap one day when I heard yells from a guy up on the Trip. He had climbed the 4th pitch, his partner followed and got so wigged out he bailed. So the guy up there was yelling at me, asking me if I'd like to join him. I said sure and ran back down, bought a portaledge with my unemployment money (960$ a month goes a long way on a climber budget), hiked back up and jugged his ropes. He had tied together his lead line and haul line, but that only made it 30' from the ground, so he had this skinny short lower-out line attached. I jugged up all that (and I remember jugging the skinny rope to be very scary [was it 6mm?]), we did one pitch before dark where I promptly performed a faux-pas by dropping a small bag, which happened to contain half his food. I offered to give him half my food, but he insisted to rap, which we did and we returned the next morning and finished the route over the next few days.
Oh, we saw a green foam lizard glued to the 6th belay. Has anyone seen this? It was in '97.
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 27, 2004 - 05:00pm PT
Santa Fe is nice too, I think I'll take a left.

Back in 1992 we were heading up to make The Trip our second big wall. The skunks, bears, black widows and scorpions that haunted us the night before we were to blast were not the only things that freaked us out and made us bail. The fifth was to be mine. A party on it was leading the 5th and he nailed everything out from the (one at the time) chicken bolt. About 8 pins out a piece pulled and he zippered all the nails. He took this huge ride while we watched. My stomach went into my throat. We bailed and did WF Leaning tower. Best part there is that we had a "Trip supply" (lots) of beer.

Right turn back on to topic, anyone?
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Oct 27, 2004 - 05:27pm PT
The lizard was at the top of 7, not 6, and he was still there in May, 2001.
ricardo

Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2004 - 05:32pm PT
no lizard in 2004 ..

.. i had an inspiration to go buy an inflatable godzilla doll, and rig him up as my belayer .. and leave him attached to one of the belays .. (perhaps even inflate him using the RUN_FLAT stuff you can use on road tires) .. but i was too lazy to go through with it ..

i'm sure its been done anyways .. i think it was chris mac that did the first ascent with an inflatable Guinness .. so it would not be very original ..

    ricardo
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Oct 28, 2004 - 12:20am PT
Did you say "inflatable"?

{sigh}
nature

climber
Flagstaff, AZ
Oct 28, 2004 - 11:35am PT
Inflatable things might not be original but certainly the type of "beasty" you bring can be. Who out there had ever thought of bringing Rolphin The Dolphin up? That one is all mine. Good thing we didn't have velcro gloves - Rolphy avoided any "abuse".
ricardo

Gym climber
San Francisco, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 14, 2005 - 07:01pm PT
hey pete ..

are you still planning to abuse "Eve the Sheep" on the ranch anytime soon...

'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Feb 14, 2005 - 07:28pm PT
Eva, dude. Eva the Party Ewe.

She still sits in her plastic bag. {sigh} We had planned to have a big sheep inflation party, and doggon if I didn't fall off and fracture me ankle on Day 1 of my Six-Week Holiday. However last Monday I got "unscrewed" - all metal has been removed from my ankle. I'm in a plaster cast [again! sheesh] til this Friday, until the incisions have healed.

As for Eva and the Ranch, I'm still waiting to see if Chad is interested in a rematch. Have you heard from him? He got a new job, I know. He seems to have disappeared. I never supposed him to be "satisfied" having climbed El Cap only once, but you never know. I hope to climb with him again. We shall see...

Ha! Reminds me of the time I climbed El Cap for the first time in 1988 via The Nose - my then-wife honestly believed that I would retire from climbing, having reached my long-sought-after goal. One post-divorce renaissance and twenty-six El Cap routes later, she couldn't have been more wrong.

Baaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!
Sewellymon

Social climber
.....in a single wide......
Feb 14, 2005 - 08:12pm PT
pete, u still dating the gal in the pictures that Brick posted earlier in the thread?
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
Feb 14, 2005 - 08:26pm PT
Absolutely! What a hottie, eh? Guess who I'm spending Valentine's Day with?
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