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madbolter1

Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
Mar 24, 2017 - 07:14pm PT
remove health insurance for 20 million Americans

If you want to call a $6,000 per year per person annual deductible "insurance," I can only laugh. The people that are so "poor" that this is the only "insurance" they can afford (even with subsidies) are the very people that are unable to pay such an annual deductible. They are EXACTLY as uninsured as they were before in actual practical effect (except for the tiny percentage that employ the plan for a catastrophic illness). THE difference is that they must now pay at least some small premium AND come up with what it actually costs to go to the doctor within the range of a deductible they will never meet.

Ironically, Obumblecare hit the poor with a double-whammy! But, you know, call it "insurance" if you please.

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/15/us/politics/many-say-high-deductibles-make-their-health-law-insurance-all-but-useless.html?_r=0

Someday you'll tumble to the FACT that the Dems had ALL power for a couple of years, just as the Rebumblecons now have, and the BEST "reform" you could muster up was Obumblecare, which handed even the POOR to the insurance companies on a silver platter.
madbolter1

Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
Mar 24, 2017 - 07:22pm PT
I don't care if i can't afford health insurance

Actually, I DO care that pre-Obumblecare my company could afford to provide "Cadillac" plans to our employees. But when overnight our premiums went up by 40.02% for a "new" plan that was double the deductible, double the co-pay, and an HMO rather than PPO plan, we could no longer afford to do so.

Thanks to your determination to "spread the wealth around," you ONLY succeeded in screwing the middle class, small business, AND the very poor you thought you were "helping."

It would be hilarious what a cluster-fvck this was, except that it's the greatest tragedy of our time. And now the monster basically CANNOT be slain, even though pretty much everybody hates it.

You moaned the the Rebumblecons had "no plan," but I say: FAR better to do nothing than to make a bad situation worse.

See, unlike you, I believe in having a government that does almost nothing! I don't want it fighting wars of conquest, engaging in black ops, invading the tiniest details of American lives, etc., etc., ad nauseum! It was constitutionally granted a VERY few things to do, and it has basically punted on all of them. Instead, it does countless things it has no business doing, it does badly, and it does without any real accountability. Meanwhile, it hands ALL of us to the mega-corps on a silver platter.

But YOU prefer to cherry-pick some partisan fantasy of "success" to justify your entirely partisan thinking: Repubs; BAD! Dems: GOOD!

BOTH parties are cut from the same cloth.
Fritz

Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
Mar 24, 2017 - 07:49pm PT
If you haven't noticed, these amendments to "TRUMPCARE" that were added yesterday to please the most conservative Republicans, caused a backlash, that likely led to "TRUMPCARE" being withdrawn from a vote.


The proposal is to eliminate ten essential benefits that, according to the Affordable Care Act, must be offered as part of any insurance plan. Those benefits are:
•Outpatient care without a hospital admission, known as ambulatory patient services
•Emergency services
•Hospitalization
•Pregnancy, maternity, and newborn care
•Mental health and substance use disorder services, including counseling and psychotherapy
•Prescription drugs
•Rehabilitative and habilitative services and devices, which help people with injuries and disabilities to recover
•Laboratory services
•Preventive care, wellness services, and chronic disease management
•Pediatric services, including oral and vision care for children

In other words, all potential benefits of health insurance, like covering hospitalization and prescription drugs, gone in favor of some sort of ridiculous a la carte system where men don't have to pay for maternity benefits but women would have to pay for men's boner pills if they wanted prescription drug coverage. Apparently men don't have anything to do with pregnancy, either.

This is Paul Ryan's nirvana right here, and apparently it's enough to get the Freedom Caucus on board.
monolith

climber
state of being
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:01pm PT
They were trying to eliminate those items from being REQUIRED for insurance policies, not ELIMINATED. In other words, an insurer could offer all, some, or none if they wanted.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:02pm PT
Trump , Ryan , and McConnel's next fiasco , " Tax reform " will benefit the rich and not the middle class as Donny had promised in his campaign... Shocking...
monolith

climber
state of being
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:09pm PT
Trump is already doing what he can to undermine the ACA by relaxing enforcement of the individual mandate, stop advertising for signups, and halting some subsidies.

http://www.sfgate.com/health/article/GOP-health-law-repeal-thwarted-but-11026796.php
WBraun

climber
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:17pm PT
SCARY .... OH yeah!!!

You guys are scary fer sure!

You guys have Trump embedded in your tiny brains 24/7 365 days a year after year .....
10b4me

Mountain climber
Retired
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:28pm PT
We dodged a huge bullet in that Trump is completely incompetent.

It also shows that Ryan is incompetent. He is suppose to be the guy who gets things done. The enforcer so to speak.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:29pm PT
Part of Trump's brilliant plan. He knew it would not pass, therefore, he will let Obummercare implode on it's own and then get everything he wanted to pass.

I see. So what you are finally conceding is that when Trump ran stating he had a plan that was "so much less expensive, that covers everyone, with much better benefits"



---you concede that he actually had no plan, that he was lying to you and the rest of America, and he pulled a huge con.

Also, there is language in Obummercare that refers to a "as the HHS secretary sees fit", etc. Well the current HHS has the power to gut Obummercare on his own based on this language that gives him broad powers to implement changes.

OH! So now you say, in contrast to your first sentence, he will NOT allow it to "implode on it's own". You are saying that he will order it to be SABOTAGED.

A gov't official that sets out to sabotage an official gov't law. Where is THAT in the Constitution? Will he write out this order in Russian???
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:39pm PT
I thought Trump loved his rust belt blue collar workers...He lied.. Throw Hitlerlarry in jail...
dirtbag

climber
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:41pm PT
It also shows that Ryan is incompetent. He is suppose to be the guy who gets things done. The enforcer so to speak.

It does, but I doubt that party could pass anything substantial. They are so divided. Boehner also failed to unite the party, too, and was likewise beholden to the extremists. They just aren't suited for governing.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:42pm PT
[quote]Speaking of talking out of orifices, you just demonstrated it.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/7-obamacare-failures-that-have-hurt-americans-2016-03-24[/quote]

Jody, you understand so little of what you are speaking about.

Last week, Speaker Ryan CHEERED when he heard that his new option would result in millions losing insurance, explaining that means they exercised their CHOICE in not signing up.

Now, you list AS YOUR NUMBER ONE HARM, that not enough people signed up was the BIGGEST HARM inflicted on Americans. What happened to FREEDOM, and CHOICE, and LIBERTY, as espoused by the Speaker? That is the biggest harm of Obamacare to Americans, not enough signed up????????????
dirtbag

climber
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:44pm PT
A gov't official that sets out to sabotage an official gov't law. Where is THAT in the Constitution? Will he write out this order in Russian???

There are many passive and not so passive ways to kill something: enact bad administrative rules, do no more than the bare minimum, fail to fund parts of it, etc. However, they now own whatever problems arise.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Mar 24, 2017 - 08:54pm PT
kingtut is demonstrating what is so pathetic about the liberals way of thinking. They can't even comprehend people helping the needy WITHOUT THE GOVERNMENT! The government is the only one in the mindset capable of helping the needy. If an individual wants to help WITHOUT GOVERNMENTAL INTERFERENCE...then the libs accuse them of hating the poor and being "fake" Christians. This inability to separate government involvement in helping the needy shows how mentally blind they are.

You demonstrate the GOP approach to governing: fantasy.

We don't have to go back a hundred years, to look at what was happening in our country, when we had no social safety net. We don't have to make up an imaginary situation: we had the exact situation you pine for, when there was little to no gov't support of the poor, only charity.

You should try reading "Grapes of Wrath" by John Steinbeck and published in 1939. The book won the National Book Award and Pulitzer Prize, and it was cited prominently when Steinbeck was awarded the Nobel Prize in 1962.

Starvation was a common fate in America, back when "America was Great", particularly among the elderly, who could not afford food and heat.

That was reality. And while such things happen, they are not anywhere near the common outcome that occurs in your fantasy land.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Mar 24, 2017 - 09:03pm PT
They need to just repeal without replacement. Let the market sort it out. There would be a period of pain before improvement.

Healthcare is a basic human right. Meaning, anyone who wants it has the right to seek it by there own means, not by government mandate.

I like that, Rick. then they can confirm that they were lying to their supporters, all along, ESPECIALLY since it appears to affect their supporters more than anyone else.

Does "by their own means" include using their vote to elect officials that will enact gov't facilitate healthcare?

So you must oppose the gov't mandate that requires the gov't to provide healthcare to veterans???

And a requirement for Worker's compensation healthcare?
Winemaker

Sport climber
Yakima, WA
Mar 24, 2017 - 09:08pm PT
Yep, a race to the bottom. Those were the types of useless policies that were being sold before the ACA. As well as no coverage for 'pre-existing' conditions and a cap on dollar costs for the insured. Sweet.

Let's get real, health insurance is NOT a free market item subject to the 'magic' of the market. If you don't purchase it you can die. Not much choice there.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Mar 24, 2017 - 09:11pm PT
A cooperative model with direct individual and employer payments to networks comprised of GP's, specialists, pharmaceuticals and hospitals would be a good working model. Cut out the middlemen and excessive regulations to just pay for healthcare.


This is rational, but as someone who actually managed a network of as many as 1,000 doctors and other providers, let me tell you that it is far more complex than most would think. Over 90% of such organizations went under in Ca. But it bears considerable thought.
Winemaker

Sport climber
Yakima, WA
Mar 24, 2017 - 09:14pm PT
They're on top of it:
Basketball fans tonight in several Republican-adjacent TV markets are enjoying a series of ads, prematurely bought by the American Action Network PAC, inviting viewers to call their representatives to thank them for repealing Obamacare today—something that did not happen.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Mar 24, 2017 - 09:19pm PT
The government should spend the time/effort/money it would spend on single-payer to instead actually DO the anti-trust enforcement it DOES have a constitutional duty to accomplish.

So you think it is better for American's health to take tax dollars and spend them on ATTORNEYS rather than DOCTORS?

yeah, what could go wrong?
WBraun

climber
Mar 24, 2017 - 09:20pm PT
The basic need of humanity is health care.

it should be free to everyone.

Instead you people made the world where everyone gets sick from the crap you've created.

You fools are clueless to the real needs of humanity.

Health care should never be in hands of stoopid politards, capitalists and gross materialists.

They are idiots.

Instead, you clowns only make people sicker, then kill them with drugs and then kill them with debt.

Your modern medicine is a sham.

First, you make everyone sick and then you kill them with drugs and debt.

You've done nothing but created the "The House of Pain" for humainty in general .....

Messages 41 - 60 of total 101 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
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