Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 04:42pm PT
|
“We don’t have to do it”
Hence the rub.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:12pm PT
|
you always go off mb
You always dodge, Ed, while pretending to be expert on ALL topics. Your responses dodged my points in all respects.
Just one example: You totally switch gears on YOUR usage of "dumping" from upthread. You start by referring to it in the illegal sense of a company dumping rather than correctly and ecologically-soundly processing it. Then I respond that THAT sort of dumping is illegal, unnecessary, and ridiculous. Then you change it up to refer to ALL forms of sewage disposal.
Dodge and fail.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:14pm PT
|
Humans are causing this recent extinction event
And ridiculous hyperbole like that is why the lib take on this issue is not credible, and it's why you cannot be taken seriously as an expert on all topics.
Wow... extinction event. Just wow.
Religious fervor is exactly the way to describe it.
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:17pm PT
|
Moose ,you are not a hypocrite.
I am really tired of that moniker,if you are interested in change ,you are helping the efforts.
Not everyone can do this,but,it is not rocket science.
Say you live in Ithaca ,New York,I am sorry ,but ,you have no choice in your energy supplier,the county mandates renewable power,voted by the people and you do not have to have solar panels on your house because the local grid is powered by solar fields and windmills.
They are shutting down their coal burning plant ,January 1st.
Big party that nite in town.
MB1 ,just wtf do you call your effen EXTENDED hyperblow,ffs.
|
|
Splater
climber
Grey Matter
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:17pm PT
|
The attempt to correctly price ... GHGs is one way to affect the nature of energy production.
This is a bit of a straw-man.
1. You don't even know what a strawman is.
Charging people for their external costs is quite logical.
2. And there have been numerous studies of those costs, despite MB's typical nonsense claims otherwise.
Charging for GHGs is indeed only an interim step.
3. Mandates are plausible in the very long run but like Ed said highly disruptive if you expect them to work. In order to work you have to outlaw existing combustion devices, not just new ones. That means not just rules on new vehicles, but just as quickly banning existing vehicles, and fossil fuel furnaces.
4. A schedule of increasing Revenue neutral taxes is actually much easier for people to adjust to.
5. Expecting much results from individual unilateral voluntary actions is not realistic. That won't make a significant dent in GHGs. People respond to market conditions, such as the fact that fuel is quite cheap. That's why so few people buy hybrids.
|
|
Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:18pm PT
|
I disagree whole heartedly with whatever MadBolter said
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:21pm PT
|
Yeah,no kidding,one must wonder if he is funded.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:25pm PT
|
Ahh, the typical lib dog-pile, right on time. No substantive responses, but "disagree with whatever" right on cue. At least Ed tries.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:27pm PT
|
So, does your "whatever" include me saying that liberals need to seek consensus among even deniers on the common ground that DOES exist regarding the need to get the US off of fossil fuels? Or does "being right" still trump all in your little minds?
|
|
TLP
climber
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:30pm PT
|
Mad, there is indeed an extinction event ongoing; in terms of magnitude, in the same ballpark as other previous ones that are referred to using that same term. It is not hyperbole at all. A large part of it is just from habitat destruction by humans, but climate change contributes to it too, and probably will be a larger contributing factor in the (relatively near) future.
That's just the objective science of it, not religious fervor at all. Don't shriek about hyperbole that is just the basic facts as widely, probably universally, acknowledged by the scientists who are knowledgeable about the subject.
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:37pm PT
|
“At least Ed tries”
Why would I want to “try” with someone like you ?
Really.
You called my scientific belief religion.
Just what the phuck are you driven by.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:38pm PT
|
^^^ BS
I guess that because you libs IDENTIFY as witnessing an extinction event, that makes it real.
Global history does not sustain the claim. Sorry.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:40pm PT
|
Why would I want to “try” with someone like you ?
Precisely why other than this post I don't respond to you.
Many of the libs on these threads are die-hard, drunk-on-the-Kool-Aid wannabe "thinkers." Truly cultish thinking.
But, see, you are going to HAVE to deal with people that do not agree with you, IF you actually care to make progress on this issue. Or, as I've been saying, you can die in your superior attitude, knowing that as the world burns, you were "right."
LOL
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:41pm PT
|
So you believe it is all SUSTAINABLE
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:44pm PT
|
Just what the phuck are you driven by.
Significant back-edit there.
I'll answer that. I'm driven by seeing something actually get DONE, and you libs with your typical attitude and cherry-picked "science" are NOT getting it done!
I'm driven to point out exactly why you can't get the traction you think you deserve, and it's because you REFUSE to get out of your little echo chamber and be truly strategic and open-minded in your approach to those that don't agree with you.
I WANT the US off of fossil fuels asap! And that is NOT going to happen as long as the current sort of lib "thinking" and "dialog" prevails.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:48pm PT
|
You called my scientific belief religion.
Wow, so you basically back-edited your entire post to make it say completely different things than what I originally responded to.
Okay, yes, you have a belief. But it is NOT scientific. Even the amount of temperature increase predicted to occur by 2100 if things continue at the present rate will not have the Earth as warm as it has been during MANY of its epochs, and tremendous speciation occurs during warming trends.
So, "extinction event" is at best a difficult claim to sustain, verging on ridiculous.
And the lib belief in "all bad... ALL BAAADDDDD!" literally is stated with religious fervor.
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:52pm PT
|
Well ,folks,you all see this display right here.
Plenty of people are concerned about CC.
It is these kinds of interactions that turn people off of the subject allowing said denier/stockholder/investers to have an upper hand in the so called “discussion”.
Hypocrisy.
Reminds me of the Chief.
I do not have to be right ,but , I have worked hard in my life to get where I am , I back science and fact.
Believe who you want.
|
|
madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Denver, CO
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:55pm PT
|
It is these kinds of interactions that turn people off of the subject allowing said denier/stockholder/investers to have an upper hand in the so called “discussion”.
Yes, but what you're not getting your narrow mind to encompass is that it's YOUR side that needs to win the debate. And YOUR approach isn't getting it done.
'Nuff said. I tire of it. I've said what I care to say.
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 05:58pm PT
|
By the way MB, I have a degree in Geology from SUNY and am currently enrolled in Cornell’s Environmental Engineering program.
The answer is coming.
|
|
wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
|
|
|
Nov 25, 2018 - 06:00pm PT
|
I am not religious, but thank the lord
This is a back edit, just like the two sentences earlier,that bothered the guy who mounts walls and walls of text.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!