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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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It's telling that some stuck in their ways climbers view people going out with cams only racks as misguided or the product of graduating from sport climbs and not knowing any better. When in reality some expert climbers who have tons of experience with all kinds of pro make a conscience decision to leave the nuts behind for many climbs because they have good reasons to do so. That mentality of I know best and other people must know less than me is a good recipe for stagnation.
People who are way better and more experienced than me would take my nuts off the rack or show up without any nuts that got me thinking maybe I don't need nuts on every climb.
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MattB
Trad climber
Tucson
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Again, economics is one of my own considerations...
No feeling of betterment... maybe a little concern for safety or preparedness.
Just my preference, and my racking choice is easily swayed, with a healthy dose of looking up at what's above.
Cams are quicker to place, if you can't pick the right nut first try. Cleaning, definite win for cams.... except they don't self-clean the way nuts do!
Ha! Vv vv vv. I see what you are reading, but I mean grabbing a cam first vs. grabbing a nut first.... not giving up on a nut and trying a cam. I mean what I said, comma and all.... hmmm... not sure actually what you're reading, or how best to write what I mean...
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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Cams are quicker to place if you can't pick the right nut first try
That statement is kinda backwards.
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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I couldn't imagine climbing with just cams. Nuts, hexes, tri-cams and cams all have a place on my rack and nothing gives me a warm fuzzy like a solidly slotted nut.
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martygarrison
Trad climber
Washington DC
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I was a very early adopter of cams. I bought my first set of friends in the UK in what must have been 79. I had early rigid half size friend, wire bliss, some other early brands. By the time Aliens came out my rack was entirely cams with a small selection of six or so small wires (RP's) on my harness. I did get caught out a couple of times on Gritstone (London Wall) where the wavy nature of the cracks made cams not as optimal as chocks. I took a number of falls on cams, all types and can only remember one failing. I think that was because I may have stepped on it as I passed before I came off. Hard to say because I was pretty desperate at that point!
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Haven't placed a hex in quite a few years. Sure they work but too many protection options leads to too large of a rack.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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I doubt I've placed a hex this century. But I'm glad for the knowledge I gained placing them when they were the only game in town!
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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I can't say I'd ever leave the ground for something hard (for me) without a set of tiny micronuts (that's what she said) and a lowe-ball or two. Even in the tiniest seams I can sometimes get a good stack of micros that just might hold a real fall. There are places that cams just can't go.
Right tool for the right job....
But mostly cams now that my beloved Alien clones are back.
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Highgloss
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Just bolt the cracks then you just need some quick draws.
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teejaybee
Sport climber
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Just bolt the cracks then you just need some quick draws.
But then do we want to use alpine draws or dogbones? Nylon or dynema?
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Highgloss
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Ohh shoot to many choices!
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jstan
climber
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When cams first came out, Jim refused to use them. Said you could not trust them. Now he uses nothing but. Bloody flip flopper.
I completely trust the three cams I have. In my closet they aren't going to cause any problem at all.
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Pewf
climber
Gunnison, CO
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I climbed a few days at Arapiles this winter--I'd rather go with no cams there than a scanty nut selection. Had to beef up my working set before going, because after a few seasons locally it had shrunk to a biner of brass and handful of miscellaneous things in bigger sizes.
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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On two occasions I've held falls where red Camalots pulled right out of parallel basalt cracks, leaving nice skid tracks. Both times the leader was stopped by a nut. On one of those the leader, (now a productive trad climber and mountaineer in CO), ended up head-down 2-3 feet above the deck. Good thing he placed the stopper before the cam.
Cams are wonderful but as others here have said, different situations call for different pro.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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I saw james Joyce step on a pin and call it free. Then he and Aldous dropped some 'cid and followed Timothy Leary up a new thin crack protected entirely with ball nuts. None of the three ever touched a piton again.
Fakt!
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MattB
Trad climber
Tucson
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^ +1
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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BITD any respectable climber didn't have very many cams because he couldn't afford cams.
What I wanna know is how the modern generation of climber can afford this sh#t.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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What I wanna know is how the modern generation of climber can afford this sh#t.
Pro deals and cash strapped yuppies in over their heads.
Oh wait, that's how mymy generation gets by.....
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sDawg
climber
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Perhaps the OP has only climbed in one or two areas where the rock is all the same type, and perhaps they have never pushed their physical limits on a gear protected climb. Their experience is limited and they do not have the imagination to think of what climbers or circumstances that are different from what they've seen in the past might require. Blanket statements about gear requirements without mention of rock type, crack size, or most importantly the climber's goals are completely ass-backwards and incredibly misguided.
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