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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:39pm PT
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donini, bravecowboy, SLR & weege nail it.
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The Chief
climber
Lurkerville east of Goldenville
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:40pm PT
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I happen to think that dirtbikes, ATV's, snowmobiles, and even mountain bikes aren't great for the the fragile desert environments where they are commonly used
No, but I hear that you and so many others sure do enjoy the pleasure of driving them Sportsmobilesa and big old Dodge Vans etc all over the fragile desert environment around Indian Creek in order to paste all the white chalk on them walls and clip them drilled angles/drill five piece RAWLS place in that very fragile sandstone.
Good for you.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:43pm PT
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Chief....reading comprehension doesn't seem to be your strong suit. Read my whole post.
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The Chief
climber
Lurkerville east of Goldenville
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:48pm PT
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And Jim... you and that Sportsmobiles of your go to places that indeed disturb and damage the once pristine environment. That includes the entire area around Indian Creek etc.
Most if not all MX posters here are responsible folks that certainly only take their bikes to designated USFS/BLM OHV areas just as you do with your Sportsmobuile. No difference.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:49pm PT
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False equivalency arguments
Annoying as hell to the intelligent, unless you are the perpetrator simply intending to distract.
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micronut
Trad climber
Fresno/Clovis, ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 26, 2015 - 09:49pm PT
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Same weekend.
Two equally humbling and soul resting happy places.
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The Chief
climber
Lurkerville east of Goldenville
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:52pm PT
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False equivalency arguments
Elaborate.
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thebravecowboy
climber
The Good Places
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Aug 26, 2015 - 09:52pm PT
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Some lovers, some haters. Its all good.
Some 'tweeners too man.
They offer easier wayoutthere access, they are a bit problematic. Kinda sucks carrying a real rack on one.
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micronut
Trad climber
Fresno/Clovis, ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 26, 2015 - 09:56pm PT
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Good point Cowboy.
By the way. This thing is fully electric. I want one.
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micronut
Trad climber
Fresno/Clovis, ca
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 26, 2015 - 09:57pm PT
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Nice ride Originalpmac. Burly.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Aug 26, 2015 - 10:19pm PT
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Climbing impacts ≠ ORV impacts
To argue otherwise is to do so via a false equivalency argument.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Aug 26, 2015 - 10:38pm PT
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Just think if these folks got this outraged over the serious problems.
Have fun Micro..I've managed to get into enough messes with four wheels..lol
I'll stick with that..A man should know his boundaries. 2 wheels and me ..not a smart mix.
I do enjoy and appreciate your stoke though! Hope you will continue to share. Chief too
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limpingcrab
Trad climber
the middle of CA
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Aug 26, 2015 - 10:39pm PT
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Great for getting to caves.
Not great for tailgating.
Snowmobiles: Like dirtbikes that don't hurt to crash and don't tear up anyone's precious dirt!
Kinda bummed. My cousin and I had a deal where he got dirtbikes and I got snowmobiles and then we could share. He just sold both of his bikes and ruined our arrangement :(
Maybe I'll have to crash your party sometime Scott. Just be warned that I'm not good with the whole self control thing but I will pay for whatever I break!
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The Chief
climber
Lurkerville east of Goldenville
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Aug 26, 2015 - 10:43pm PT
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Sorry Apogee but ANY human impact on the environment is bad. To state one is the lesser of two evils is total hypocrisy at best. Especially if it is a USFS/BLM designated OHV area. Riding MXers is no different than drilling and placing bolts into any rock anywhere in order to appease one's hunger to partake in an adventure sport.
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hooblie
climber
from out where the anecdotes roam
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Aug 27, 2015 - 02:10am PT
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[Click to View YouTube Video]
to point a righteous finger at offroad rubber impact as a utilizer of HOW MUCH ASPHALT? spread far and wide through bulldozed gouges, bored tunnels, arching bridges and endlessly roaring cityscapes, not to mention airways of contrails and blinking lights scored ACROSS THE MILKY WAY and canals trenched from SEA TO SEA ... is some pretty profound irony indeed
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Aug 27, 2015 - 11:08am PT
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What's also funny is going to a motorsports forum and seeing the anti-Obama / enviro-nazi / tree-hugger this is America and I'm free to do whatever I want rants.
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The Chief
climber
Lurkerville east of Goldenville
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Aug 27, 2015 - 11:28am PT
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Even funnier FET, that is what America is all about. Having the Freedom to be diverse in thinking, believing and playing. That is how it has been for well over 250 years. And why so many have given their all so that it will remain so.
So I suggest you accept that. Cus that is how America and all the people in it, roll.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Aug 27, 2015 - 11:40am PT
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Yup, reminds me of:
"your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins"
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.
Of course the environment is a common good so it's more complex than that, but it's always interesting to see when people say my impact on / use of the environment is okay but yours isn't.
This is another situation that reminds me of smoking. I think people have the right to smoke if they want to but I don't want to inhale it. So keep it where it's allowed. But if I walk through a smoking area I'm not going to complain there's smoke there.
A little thread drift, but when those Westboro Baptist Church fools were protesting funerals I wanted to put my bike on a trailer point the exhaust right at them and wind the piss out of it. Hey if they are free to protest and disrespect a funeral then I'd be free to pollute them too! Then some Harley riders did pretty much that exact thing, except they just caused noise, I wanted to smoke em out too.
Edit to add: it's when people feel the need to step past logical boundaries that freedom ends though. The rants I see on motorsports forums are often when new regulations are put into place to protect resources or sensitive areas are closed, and some people think it's some disguised attempt to ruin their fun, or the regulations shouldn't apply to them. Of course not all regulations are useful or well thought out but for the most part they are there to protect those common goods that people may otherwise impact. A climbing example is Nesting raptor closures. Yes sometimes they close more than is necessary, but for the most part they are a sensible regulation designed to protect the ecosystem, but some climbers don't feel they should be limited at all and should be able to climb where they want and when they want.
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T2
climber
Cardiff by the sea
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Aug 27, 2015 - 11:46am PT
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I love my dirts bikes. They bring me as much pleasure as my gixxer, climbing, surfing or that skydiving does. I have one with a plate and one without.
I got no problems burning fossil fuel and shredding some dirt up for pleasure!!!!
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The Chief
climber
Lurkerville east of Goldenville
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Aug 27, 2015 - 12:04pm PT
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Hey Fet!
You definitely need to think about getting yourself some Guns, a badass KTM, and a 4X truck to haul them all and go on out to No Man's Land in the middle of nowhere desert and go blow a load, or two or three or.
You're wound up tighter than shet and will ONLY end up pathetically negative and fatass tired like good old Craig Fry. Sitting at that desk in the middle of the Concrete Cubelandville, staring at the computer whining about anything and everything and telling em all how fked up they all are cus they aint a Socialist.
You definitely are a prime candidate for doing some of this and can do so keeping to your guns on being.... Green and Clean!
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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