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skitch
climber
East of Heaven
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Nov 19, 2014 - 12:00pm PT
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Ellettsville IN
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MisterE
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
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Nov 19, 2014 - 01:39pm PT
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The open-shuts on Phoenix at the Lower Elbow Room are shot, the one on the right is worn so far through it has a sharp edge.
We were going to replace them, but the wife left for a month for her shows, so we probably won't get back down there until January.
Just a heads-up!
Erik
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Nov 19, 2014 - 04:07pm PT
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The hooks in those photos look like low grade, basic galvanized hardware.
If the issue is the rope and grit sawing through the hooks, one solution is to upgrade from low strength, low hardness steel to something better. As a general rule, a stronger steel is also a harder steel. Harder means the grit will have a harder time (get it?) in abrading it away.
A better quality, harder steel is also typically more resistant to corrosion. For example a 4130 (e.g., KBs, LAs and Angles) will corrode much slower than a 1060 high-carbon plain steel (4130 is Cro-Moly, and the Cro is the same stuff that goes into stainless steel).
One place to find grade 80, grade 100, grade 120 (stronger and harder) hooks is
http://www.mcmaster.com/#rigging-hooks/=uo3bda
click on SLING HOOKS WITH LATCH - FOR LIFTING to see a selection.
The hook shown AT THE LINK HERE appears to be much better for the 3/8" chain setup in those photos.
Look at the price: $55 - OUCH!!!!
The lower grade stuff, 100 and 80, is cheaper, but weaker and softer.
As they say: if you wanna play, you gotta pay
There is always some sort of trade-off between price and performance. It's an immutable law of economics that predates the spoken word.
McMaster is notorious for having everything, and charging two limbs for it, too. There must be a cheaper source for those grade 120 hooks. The key would be to find out which industry favors them and uses them, and then get in touch with their supplier.
EDIT:
The solution to this high grit, high friction wear problem is to introduce an aluminum clip through pulley insert into the mix. The same sort of insert that folks used to use made of plastic for crevasse rescue work but made out of metal.
I missed Steve's comment above the first time through.
If a suitable D-ring could be found, a roller would seem to be the ideal solution. I would suggest a hard steel (cro-moly) roller on a hard steel ring. The steel-on-steel abrasion for hardened steels is almost zero, even with some grit.
Theron Moses (TMoses) would know how to get the parts hardened, like when he has his Tomahawks heat treated. The roller might be as simple as cut-offs of heavy-wall cro-moly tubing, which is readily available in small quantities (like, say, from Aircraft Spruce).
You might even be able to fit a suitable piece of cro-moly tube stub onto those existing hooks, and it would behave as a pulley. Or, if it didn't rotate, at least the tube stub would wear, and be the replaceable component, with no value to a light-fingered climber.
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Howie Schwartz
climber
Bishop, CA
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:06am PT
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Hi Todd,
Thanks for putting your brain energy into revisiting this issue. It's great to have forums like this to toss ideas around before taking action. I like the concept you propose to get the community more involved in maintenance.
Seems to me that the the impetus for Shuts and Mussys for convenience/efficiency in the ORG has come from the local climbing population. The more frequently a climber goes to an area, the more convenience they seem to want. I know there have been ropes and racks stashed in the bottom of the Gorge for years by some of the most fanatical Gorge users who don't want to carry it all in and out every day. I don't have any judgment to pass on that, but my point is that I think us locals who impact the resource the most should bear the responsibility for maintaining the safety, longevity, and convenience of the venue for ourselves and everyone else. I think most people agree that Mussy's have been pretty nice to use in the Gorge and they are no doubt longer lasting than typical steel 'biners, but they still need to be replaced regularly. I don't see a practical way around that through anchor re-engineering, and I don't think the steel biner idea where everyone uses and replaces them freely will work, unfortunately, for reasons others have pointed out here.
I think the solution has to be to get local climbers to contribute, either with dollars or with a donation of time and effort. Visiting climbers would of course be encouraged to contribute as well. Maybe there could be an easily accessible online system of tracking or rating the condition of anchors so that folks could come to Eastside Sports, pick up the necessary equipment, and do maintenance. There is a Bishop Area Climber's Coalition and maybe they could host an annual fundraising event to cover costs of materials and labor. Maybe such an event could even involve doing most of that work. I think all of us would be willing to contribute in some way for the privilege of climbing in local, accessible sport climbing venues like ORG, especially if it were made easier and more convenient to do so. Maybe people could even be "paid" to do the work with discounts at Eastside Sports, subsidized by fundraising efforts?
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