Missing friend in Mammoth Lakes area

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Messages 1821 - 1840 of total 2381 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
WBraun

climber
Sep 19, 2013 - 10:02pm PT
So far ...

Still nothing. Nada, zero.

The guy vanished into thin air.

No one has a clue where he really went ultimately.

Still, .... just tons of guesses .......
zBrown

Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
Sep 19, 2013 - 11:41pm PT
Without quibbling on methodology this seems a very large number.

An astounding 2,300 Americans are reported missing every day, including both adults and children.


http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/forensics/americas_missing/2.html

Ŗ ő ō T « H

Boulder climber
extraordinaire
Sep 20, 2013 - 12:01am PT
I never tell anybody where I'm going, but I figure my car being parked in a certain place would tip them off, if I was dead or whatever nearby.
pacarockhound

Social climber
Escondido CA
Sep 20, 2013 - 01:53am PT
Kenish and ZBrown


You now have me thinking about missing persons data bases....I hope Matt is on all of them.

Found the info about number of Missing Persons and details about searches interesting. Thanks for sharing that ZBrown.
Todd Quinn

Trad climber
Oceanside, CA
Sep 20, 2013 - 02:34am PT
Morales information/

Harv you rock, ctadlock thank you. Thank you for putting in the time on the ground. The information from the Morales suggests he is a non climber. I donít believe Matt would have gone into detail with a non climber about his route

Rather, Matt may have just shared a picture from the book of where he was going? Chapter twelve can be broken down to full page or half page photography. It is a shame the Morales didnít come forward sooner. Memories fade but in this example it was borderline criminal not to come forward sooner. Maybe they can make up time and try to further help the Greene Family.

Donít beat me up, but hypnosis can help people remember the past. Itís legit sh#t.

Hope everyone on this site is doing well.

Book: The High Sierra Peaks, Passes, Trails 3rd Edition By Secor
LAhiker

Social climber
Los Angeles
Sep 20, 2013 - 03:01am PT
Ctadlock, thanks to you and yours for searching and reporting.

HighTraverse, thanks for your thoughts -- I'm glad we can consider those areas searched.

Pacarockhound, thanks for sending the flyer to those Chambers of Commerce and for contacting Harv Galic.

SplitPants, welcome back! I appreciate all the work, skill, and good sense you've brought to this search.

Supermama, thanks for your efforts -- good to hear about the fundraiser.

And thanks to everyone else for your effort and ideas! I hope we have a break in this case soon, or at least can get a little more info from the emails, Morales family, etc....
tdg119

Social climber
Northampton, PA
Sep 20, 2013 - 06:20am PT
Interesting missing persons info.

Morales has access to the scanned missing chaper of the books hanks o SplitPants and jeg and her husband have been working with him over the phone to see what he remembers.

I need to touch base with the PA detective to see if he received case files and is willing to start pulling the records requested.

I'm not opposed to some of the SAR methods proposed. I will gladly look into Paul Dostie more if someone can scrounge up a way to get a hold of him. I've found little, though admittedly haven't tried social media because I access a lot from my work PC.
Dan Watson

climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
Sep 20, 2013 - 10:57am PT
Paul Dostie has been retired for several years and his dog, Buster, is a cadaver dog. He will have the same problem as SAR. Without a specific location to search, he won't know where to go. But, I will try to get hold of him today and refer him to this site to see if he can help.
kenish

Gym climber
Orange County, CA
Sep 20, 2013 - 11:55am PT
It is a shame the Morales didnít come forward sooner. Memories fade but in this example it was borderline criminal not to come forward sooner. Maybe they can make up time and try to further help the Greene Family.

With all due respect, that's a pretty harsh judgment of Morales. They are probably not climbers as you commented. He learned of Matt's disappearance via a relative (Silva) who saw the FB page. FYI, I didn't hear about Matt until mid-August, via the Mammoth Times website in preparation for a trip to the area. Nobody else in our group of 8 were aware of it. A few LA news stations carried the story in late August as a 30-second blurb. It was lucky that Morales knew about it at all.

Morales voluntarily came forward in late August. Factually, the first 3-4 weeks of the delay were caused by Matt not being missed, then SAR and law enforcement being unable to mobilize due to lack of information. It is a shame Morales couldn't come forward sooner but it wasn't an unwillingness.

My $.02 worth.
LAhiker

Social climber
Los Angeles
Sep 20, 2013 - 01:25pm PT
Tiffany, Iím glad Jill and John are working with Arnold Morales, his family, and the book!

Jill and John -- you probably know about this, but I have a few suggestions based on cognitive psychology (my field). Caveat: I'm not a professional interviewer or investigator;the police may also have suggestions. Here goes anyway...

Of course, it's helpful to establish a rapport -- you probably have already done so. Discussing Mr. Morales's camping trip, what family members were present, and how he met Matt can help both establish rapport and provide retrieval cues for the information we're trying to get. Your caring for Matt can help you connect.

Maybe it will all come back to him when he sees the pages -- maybe it already has. If not, it may help memory to recreate as much as possible the conditions under which Matt showed Arnold the book and to bring to mind what was going on then. If you could be there in person, for instance, and if Matt showed Arnold the book while they were sitting at a picnic table, one could sit at a table with Arnold and as many as possible of any family members who were present that day in July. One could ask Arnold where Mattís campsite was in relation to the table, and about when he showed Matt the book Ė what day was it, what time, where did Matt sit, etc. Then you could ask him what Matt did when he presented the book (or the pages? were the pages already removed from the book?) and ask him to remember the conversation and actions in detail.

In all of us, memory isnít just playback Ė it involves reconstruction and can be influenced by suggestion. So to get accurate info itís important to avoid asking "leading" questions that imply a particular answer -- open-ended questions are good, especially at first.

Given that youíre doing this over the phone (and depending on how much time Arnold has, of course), you could ask him to talk about how he met Matt, where were their campsites, who in the family spoke with him, did they hang out together and what did they do (did they share any food, etc.). And then you could do what I suggested above, except through verbal descriptions on the phone instead of in person. In doing so, if you notice that Mr. Morales tends to think of things in a particular way -- for instance, visually, spatially, or verbally -- it might be good to go with that. (This last point is no big deal -- most people think of things in a variety of ways -- it's just that he might happen to focus on different things than you do.)
LAhiker

Social climber
Los Angeles
Sep 20, 2013 - 01:48pm PT
I agree with Kenish that one shouldnít judge the Morales family, as they appear to have learned of Mattís disappearance much later than it occurred. Todd may be frustrated because, like Tiffany, he tried to contact them via Facebook, with no response. (Thank you, Todd for your efforts in that regard, and for familiarizing yourself with the Secor pages.)

A number of things were against those attempts: The two family members who ďlikedĒ the Find Matthew Greene page may have turned off notifications. Facebook doesnít inform you of other comments people make in reply to the same post, only of replies to your own comment. Whether in your own feed or on another page, it's very hard to find comments on posts long ago. Emails sent through FB to someone who isn't a FB friend go to their "otherĒ email box, which many people donít even know exists. So it can be very frustrating trying to reach people through FB.

Also, there was some caution in contacting family members directly (for instance, by tracking them down in Bakersfield) because one didnít want to scare them away and because they might have been witnesses in a criminal investigation.

Now that the police have said itís okay for Tiffany, Jill, and John to contact them directly, maybe they can make some headway...
Dan Watson

climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
Sep 20, 2013 - 06:08pm PT
I just spoke with Paul Dostie who responded to an e-mail I sent this morning. Buster, his cadaver dog, is now 10 years old and only has 3 legs. So his ability to search is limited as to distance. He can't go miles and miles anymore, but if he can get somewhere with a reasonably high likelihood of catching a scent, he can help. I explained to Paul the many possible areas Matthew could be. He has not had to look at this website, but will later today and then decide if he believes he can be of assistance to the search.
SplitPants

Social climber
LA
Sep 20, 2013 - 06:36pm PT
Chief Watson,
Thanks a bunch for reaching out to Paul Dostie! Would be great if Buster could help out:)
LAhiker

Social climber
Los Angeles
Sep 20, 2013 - 06:51pm PT
Chief Watson,

I also want to thank you for following up with Paul Dostie. Even if Buster canít help at this point, Dostie sounds like an excellent detective. Maybe he has some insights or could help in some other way.
pacarockhound

Social climber
Escondido CA
Sep 21, 2013 - 02:29am PT
I was looking at photos by David Husted whose beautiful photos cyduke posted a week or so ago and contacted him though facebook climbing groups. He responded:


I'm headed up the North Fork of the San Joaquin River for a shot at Rodgers Peak here next week. I'll keep an eye out for the blue hat and/or Nepal Extreme Mtn Boots.

I'm kind of curious how well this area just west of the Clyde Minarets has been searched, especially towards the back of the lake by the glacier. http://hikenhi.smugmug.com/.../i-FRkvp84/A

The Alpine Lake

hikenhi.smugmug.com

This is a small un-named alpine Lake that's west of the Clyde Minaret. This smal...
pacarockhound

Social climber
Escondido CA
Sep 21, 2013 - 02:43am PT
from David Husted also-----just posted this 9/20 on find mattgreene facebook page under post about Dean:

I ran into this guy on August 28th along the Shadow Creek Trail at Ediza Lake. He's got the right idea searching the glaciers along the Minarets. I'm pretty sure that there's a glacier up there that has clues about Mathew.
Supermama

Social climber
pa
Sep 21, 2013 - 11:43am PT
Tiffany and Ron...Any luck with the Hotmail account? Sorry the school account didn't turn up any information. I tried.

Dan...thanks for all you are doing!

Everyone...We have a whole school full of children and staff as well as his friends and family who are missing him greatly. I realize the odds are not in his favor, however, think of how you would feel if this was your son, brother, teacher, coworker or friend who went missing. Would you give up?

Keep the faith and let's carry on with the search...

Split Pants...any word from the boots to ground team?

supermama
zBrown

Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
Sep 21, 2013 - 11:53am PT
From the link above, with U.S. population of 312 million, it appears that each of us has a one in about 135,000 chance of being reported missing today.


James Wilcox

Trad climber
Goleta/Virginia Lakes
Sep 21, 2013 - 01:48pm PT
At this point, I'd think that offering a decent reward, as opposed to hiring a search team, would make more financial sense. With so little known facts the odds of a hired team producing ne leads isn't all that high, whereas with a reward you only have to pay if there's results. And a decent reward could get a lot of local people motivated to hike into the suspect areas.

Nice of Dan to contact Mr. Dotsie. Eastside rock just tears up a dog's paws quickly(vet wrap and booties are standard equipment in our packs), and with the limitations on his dog I just don't see him making it to Ritter Range. But usually SAR dog people know other ones, so maybe he knows other trained teams who could help.
tdg119

Social climber
Northampton, PA
Sep 21, 2013 - 07:48pm PT
James - my fear in posting a reward is that people who are not qualified to be in the mountains will try to look and be another liability or loss. Last thing I want is someone getting injured, lost, or worse.

PA detective wants to talk Tuesday.

Jill/John still going over what Morales has shared. When we have a good handle on it, we'll share for the whole group.

Matt is still very much on the forefront of my thoughts. I've heard I should let it go but I just can't yet. Too many raw emotions at the moment to say much more, but please all accept my heartfelt gratitude for sticking with me through this.

PS, just saw on a webcam it's snowing on Mammoth Mountain. :(
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