SeaClimb
climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:35am PT
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Joseph said:
Fabulous accomplishments, but the ratings were developed for adult males with adult male strength-to-weight ratios, not ratios which likely run quite significantly higher than that.
Response:
This is a typical response...blah blah blah she has an advantage blah blah blah...
I could point out that her technique is FLAWLESS compared to 99% of adults, including YOU(Drew has spent a fair bit of time climbing with her and is no slouch in that department. I could also point out that she's about 4'-8" tall. I might also point out that she's been training HARD for more than half a decade with high level coaches...
I think that "we" the older generation are being faced with a revolution in the sport and that is that.
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moosedrool
Trad climber
Fremont
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:37am PT
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Although very impressive, achievements in a gym or on bolted sport routs are just circus tricks. Alpine/trad climbing is something very, very different. Just because Ashima is using rock for her gymnastics, doesn't mean she is a climber, yet. IMHO.
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SeaClimb
climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:38am PT
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Riley said:
"Yea, I wanna see her climb supercrack & see how that goes.
Many don't even bother with 5.10 & 5.11 anymore it seems. 5.12 is the new 5.8 for kids these days. Virtually none of these little phenoms seem to give two turds about pluggin gear, baggin peaks, or suffering either, WTF?!
Difficulty &/or grades is the endgame for the next generation it would appear.
Amazing stuff they are doing, I'd love to see these little kids crushing in person.
edit: good point below Jim, the kids are unstoppable"
Uhhh you might not be that informed as to what these kids can do with cracks and they can plug gear as well as or better than 90% of adults.
Just sayin'...
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:41am PT
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Alpine/trad climbing is something very, very different.
What does that have to do with anything? Seriously. Who is saying otherwise?
You bro's need to get your Test levels checked. Little girl has you all clawing at myths like an old Sensei teaching his dragon nonsense bullshit to wide eyed kids...
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SeaClimb
climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:42am PT
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The fact that a little girl did something amazing and people are grasping at negativities speaks volumes about the inner monologue that must play inside your head.
opinions are like as#@&%es, everyone has them and they all stink.
Ashima is a bad mother f*#ker. You don't have to like sport climbing, you don't have to like the mentality that high-end athletics brings, hell you don't even have to like the f*#king Red.
Whether it is rock climbing or tennis, this little girl did something amazing. Just appreciate it. Doesn't cost you anything to be decent.
^^^This
SPOT ON!!!!
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:44am PT
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Ummm. There's nothing wrong with the ratings. Turns out, being small and thin is the most ideal body shape for climbing very very hard routes and boulders.
Ratings are body shape (hand size) dependent for crack climbs of course, but thats not relevant to Ashimas climbing (yet).
I'll try one more time.
I am sure there are boulder problems and routes where a say, 6' guy has to do a good lunge to get from hold to hold, and it's about V2 or V3 for that guy. If the little girl can't do that route, can the 6' guy say it's V12 or whatever, since it shut down a V-double-digit climber?
(To make this concrete, consider the route "Take That, Katie Brown," although that's apparently a very hard route by any standard. No crack involved.)
It's not just cracks that are size dependent. And I agree (and it's obvious) that "being small and thin is the most ideal body shape for climbing very very hard routes," but only most of the time.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:47am PT
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So when does she dress up for a beauty pageant? I don't know, on one hand fair play to her, but on the other hand, why can't we let kids be kids instead of pushing them. I am not saying this young lady was being pushed, but it happens a lot by parents.
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Alpamayo
Trad climber
Chapel Hill, NC
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:51am PT
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Yeah, I don't get it...the TR's here get nothing but positive comments for another average ascent of Dana or some routine aid ascent of another grade V trade route (don't get me wrong, I think those things are awesome too)...but climbing that actually takes more than average talent and dedication gets bashed. Strong work.
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SeaClimb
climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:54am PT
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"Jesus Christ this thread is full of sh*t bags.
There's a girl. She's 11. She's strong.
Not suffering through 10a doesn't make her cool?
No, it makes you an out of shape, no technique slob. (unless it's OW, then suffering may occur.)
I don't get why so many sh*theads on this forum bag on people who climb 5.15 / vHARD. "No skill" "no suffering" "plug gear" for f*cks sake. Everyone has different interests.
Bouldering."
^^^^ AWESOME
Folks...you should maybe attend a youth comp one of these days and get a look at what's happening...its sick in an awesome way...
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SeaClimb
climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:58am PT
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moosedrool says:
"Although very impressive, achievements in a gym or on bolted sport routs are just circus tricks. Alpine/trad climbing is something very, very different. Just because Ashima is using rock for her gymnastics, doesn't mean she is a climber, yet. IMHO. "
and i suppose a high level FIS J1 or J2 slalom, GS, or downhiller is really not that great of a skier cuz he ain't shreddin' the backcountry, eh? More just circus tricks
Blahblahblah...
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Oct 30, 2012 - 10:59am PT
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^^^^^^^^^^^
Oh definately.. racers usually suck
Racers like ice
They don't have a magazine called ICE do they? No it's called POWDER
hehe haven't dusted that old rant off for a while :)
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:01am PT
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Blablah
I agree with you completely, we all have strengths.
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SeaClimb
climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:03am PT
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Oh dammit...
wrong link...sorry 'bout that! !-)
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:06am PT
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Different strokes for different folks.
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10b4me
Ice climber
dingy room at the Happy boulders hotel
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:08am PT
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I hope this little gal gets a good mentor to teach here the ropes of trad because if you can climb 14c and you cant get up classics like Astroman or the Rostrum that to me would be sad.
+ 1
but, as someone already posted. there are signs of burnout.
she may never have the chance to climb the said classics
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:10am PT
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"classics"
F*cking christ. If Mirko can do it, Ashima can.
She's having fun pushing her limits on Bolts.
She's probably still not comfortable with getting up high.
She's 11. Bolts are plenty safe for her.
SIGNS OF BURNOUT??
ARE YOU KIDDING ME? What is wrong with you people?
She sends two 14c's in 7 days, and you guys say there are "signs of burning out" ? ? ? ? WHAT THE Hell.
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Baggins
Boulder climber
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:20am PT
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I am sure there are boulder problems and routes where a say, 6' guy has to do a good lunge to get from hold to hold, and it's about V2 or V3 for that guy. If the little girl can't do that route, can the 6' guy say it's V12 or whatever, since it shut down a V-double-digit climber?
Agreed. Thats a microcosm, important for the difficulty a boulder problem, and sometimes for particular routes with acute cruxes. The beauty of rock of course is that it allows many differently shaped people to climb, sometimes using totally different sequences with different holds.
But in general, being small and thin doesnt alter the difficulty of a route. On average. Climbing has a great inbuilt counterbalance effect that generally keeps things even - e.g. small reach corresponds with small hands to make small intermediate dimples into usable holds. It doesnt create an unfair advantage, unless you think that being the most ideal shape to climb is somehow unfair and the ratings shouldnt apply to these people in the same way.
Im sorry to have got involved in a grade debate.. the bottom line is take grades with a pinch of salt - but not a spoonful!!
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:21am PT
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The grade debates here can't compare to 8a.nu's debates. And none of those guys talk about how cool struggling up 5.10 is on a public forum.
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michaeld
Sport climber
Sacramento
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Oct 30, 2012 - 11:24am PT
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Also, Adam Ondra just flashed Southern Smoke Direct. That's the hardest flash EVER. And he rated it easier than it's graded. (graded 9a+/15a, he thinks 9a/14d)
But it wasn't struggling up a 5.10 so it's not cool. Or takes and skill. And it's not climbing.
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