Florida stand Your ground law?

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Messages 1321 - 1340 of total 3216 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
rSin

Trad climber
calif
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:24pm PT
if youd done your research about the defense lawyers history you have a just stance as well
Riley Wyna

Trad climber
A crack near you
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:25pm PT
It's bullshit every kid talks about
Trust me

Does every kid deserve to get followed and shot now?

Or just kids that can be slandered enough to fit a gansta rap stereotype .. Lol

Besides ... How the hell did they even get these texts
Isn't this private ?
I mean u can't use a f*#king gun with blood in it that is found in a guys house if the cops don't attain that evidence legally
But u can introduce hacked stupid text messages ?
blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:28pm PT
I mean u can't use a f*#king gun with blood in it that is found in a guys house if the cops don't attain that evidence legally
But u can introduce hacked stupid text messages ?

I'm sure they weren't hacked--defense lawyers have rights to obtain evidence relevant to their client's alleged crime (as do civil litigants)--it's generally called "discovery," and engaging in that process is how lots of lawyers spend much of their time, trust me on that.
Riley Wyna

Trad climber
A crack near you
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:44pm PT
Well, how do you get private texts then?

Further more this stuff is bullshit

It hasn't been authenticated!
Another reason the judge didn't allow it ..
It could be just a bunch more made up sh#t


I hope this jury is paying attention
Do you know counting the DNA evidence
They now have Zimmerman lying at least 5 times?



Bharata

Mountain climber
Pune
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:47pm PT
Deceased was 4 inches taller that Zimmerman. Longer punch reach. Athletic person. No doubt ran faster. Yes he hunted Zimmerman and assaulted
and hit him. Jumped from bushes. Started fight. Zimmerman not guilty.

Credit: Bharata




rSin

Trad climber
calif
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:49pm PT
the bastards are closing

run with it this way riley

after being followed by a weird pasty and skinny white dude driving slow in a van

who suddenly jumps and and comes running up yelling police bullshit while wearing jeans and a tee shirt


aint a parent on either side of this argument which would advise their kids to put their hands up and stand quietly while the guy assaulting them calms down in hopes hes not a child molester or psycopath
blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:52pm PT
Well, how do you get private texts then?

You subpoena the phone carrier and/or have expert witnesses examine the phone (yes, they can defeat the password protection).

The investigators believed that Zimm's story was both substantially consistent with itself and with the evidence, so I'm not what "lies" you're referring too. I do recall they noted minor inconsistencies, but they understand that's normal. Someone who tells too perfectly consistent of a story is probably telling a rehearsed lie.

And remember the prosecutions's "star" witness (the obese young lady), who admitted lying repeatedly, under oath, in order to say what she thought Trayvon's parents wanted to hear.
So don't get too harsh on Zimm--ordinary people lie all the time when they perceive it to be in their interest.

That's it for me tonight, we'll see how the defense closing and the pros rebuttal turn out tomorrow.

aint a parent on either side of this argument which would advise their kids to put their hands up and stand quietly while the guy assaulting them calms down in hopes hes not a child molester or psycopath

Yeah, cuz short obese "white hispanic" non-athletes are grabbing 6' muscular, tatted out 17-year African-American fighters all the time to molest them.
rSin

Trad climber
calif
Jul 11, 2013 - 10:54pm PT
nice pussy ya got there blah
youd think you wouldnt need to depend on the state to keep it going
Riley Wyna

Trad climber
A crack near you
Jul 12, 2013 - 12:16am PT
and hit him. Jumped from bushes. Started fight. Zimmerman not guilty.


Ummm ... You show your ignorance here... Lol. I'd laugh if you were not so pathetic .
I guess you don't know yet that there were no bushes anywhere
And that zimmerman has had to admit to lying about this part if his story ...
Lol



Blah blah ...
The texts are ridiculous .. Come on
It's like a POS defense lawyer trying to admit a woman's past sexual history when she has been brutally raped and beaten by a psychopath .. Who was hiding in the bushes
Lol


Blah blah - cheers .. It is an interesting case ...I can usually nail an outcome
I have no clue here what they will decide ..
Jessguess

climber
Jul 12, 2013 - 08:06am PT
Riley, Riley ...

The reason you cant see the end is that your emotional response wont let you see the obvious. Zimmerman goes home, Trevon stays dead. You hate it, you think its unfair. That doesn't matter, killing is always unfair. Ask the dead how they feel about it.


The Judge is giving every decision, even ones that will result in grounds for retrial to the P. Why? Cause there will never be a retrial, Zimmerman goes free. The Judge knows this, the only chance the P. has is obviously insufficient.

Zimmerman never takes the stand, the prosecutor wiffles out and the jury, even laden with mothers and sob queens will turn him loose. It would be possible for a directed judgement for not having proven their case against the P. but for that judge.

Judge knows the end is near, and the D. has won. Or rather, the P. never had a case. Nobody will retry this case after Z. is acquitted, possibly by a hung jury.





I don't care who you are (unless you have a court order against you) its not illegal to follow someone around with the intention of seeing what the hell he is up to. It IS illegal to try and beat hell out of a guy for doing that. Even if Z. HAD broken lesser laws, its illegal to hold a man down and beat on him, that DOES place anybody sane in fear of their bodily safety, and defensive shooting IS permitted.

No matter how you like the answer, no matter how you squirm and point and scream racism, for a thousand years the white man has been the meanest, most deadly SOB on this planet. It has been made clear that you don't grow up to be a old black man if you spend a lot of time beating up on random whiteys, its a well known mistake.

You want to fight you find a big guy and bug hell out of him. Eventually you will have a fight. You try that sh#t on a little fat guy, hes never gonna want to fight, and he's going to try and kill you outright, make no mistake. Big guy doesn't fear a fight. Little guys do. Bank on it, its the little guy that has really deadly intent. And is probably better prepared.



What zimmerman did, far off the wall, but not illegal under the circumstances, and the Whiteman Legal System is not gonna punish Zimmerman for eliminating a thug practicing his art form on a otherwise unimpressive old fat moron. The WLS was designed to protect the status quo and enhance the prospects of fat old wealthy fools surviving well past their prime.

If the situation was reversed, Trevon would have spent decades in prison, most likely. But it is as it was.
rSin

Trad climber
calif
Jul 12, 2013 - 08:29am PT
if travon had had a gun in his belt, you stand your ground defenders would have been forced to call it a fair fight.

but since he only had soda and candy, hes the guilty?


ray-cyst......


skulking after travon might not have been illegal but it CERTAINLY gave a child EVERY REASON IN THE WORLD to believe that a dangerous predator was after him and EVERY JUSTIFICATION for defending himself from this bloated piece of anti-social racist dripping shit
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Jul 12, 2013 - 09:40am PT
I don't understand why Zimmerman can stand his ground, but Martin can't. You have to admit though, he looks real thuggish in that photo above.
Jessguess

climber
Jul 12, 2013 - 09:46am PT
Child?



CHILD?





Not trying to emotionally deflect an argument are you?

What do you tell a child to do if they get worried about a predator? Run away, run to an adult. TM did not run away. He did not behave as a child in fear.

Z. was not a predator, and was not mistaken as such. Ordinarily, when confronted by someone about where I am, I stop and answer them, like when a rancher finds me crossing a field. Things get handled, and we talk for a longer period. Then we part. This is a ordinary interaction. Z/T discussion never went past two sentences.

WHY and who first thought he could punch up the other at will, a fat older guy or a younger much taller and built kid?


Z was justified once he was being punched on the ground. Real life, not high school fistfights. Some people got no tolerance for fistfights. Some do, Z did not, and certainly is not required to risk having a deadly weapon acquired from his control by someone punching him up.

Nobody gives up control of a defensive sidearm in a fight. Thats why cops are told to not get in fights. You might lose your very temporary advantages.
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Jul 12, 2013 - 10:00am PT
I don't understand why Zimmerman can stand his ground, but Martin can't.

From the start "He looks like he is up to no good or on drugs or something?" Yeah, or something...

Martin did nothing and yet "These Assholes always get away." What Assholes ? Black Assholes ? Teenage Assholes ? Assholes in hoodies?

Zimmerman was told NOT to follow him. Zimmerman was NOT standing his ground, he was followin/chasing a teenager. If someone (not a cop) was chasing me, you bet your ass I'd run away and start throwing punches if they caught up to me.
blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
Jul 12, 2013 - 10:19am PT
From the start "He looks like he is up to no good or on drugs or something?" Yeah, or something...

He was on drugs--he was high on pot (but that evidence wasn't presented to the jury for apparently somewhat complicated strategic reasons).
The reset of your post presents the prosecution's version of events, but it's largely unproven conjecture. It is undisputed that Trayvon could have easily gone home after he noticed Zimm following him, but he chose not to.
I don't have any particular interest in going through all the evidence yet again at this stage, other than to note that your version is not an accurate summary of the actual evidence.
For example, to say that Zimm was "chasing"--you're just making that up. And if you'd really start punching someone just because they seemed to be following you and approached you and asked what you're doing--well, you wouldn't. That's not reasonable behavior--that's what a violent teenager does who wants to teach a "cracker" a lesson.
And even if you think Zimm's guilty, that's not enough to convict; you have to believe it "beyond a reasonable doubt."

I agree with Riley that it's really hard to have a feel for what the jury will do--I'm sure the defense is very afraid of the "compromise" verdict of manslaughter as wanting to "compromise" is human nature for most of us.
Elcapinyoazz

Social climber
Joshua Tree
Jul 12, 2013 - 10:43am PT
Zimmerman lied repeadtedly.

Lied about his past arrest record to police when questioned at the scene.
Lied about whether he'd been in a pre-trial diversion program in the past.
Lied about his finances during bond hearing.
Lied about surrendering his passport(s).

I have no opinion on how the verdict will go. But to say this guy isn't a proven, habitual liar is asinine and ridiculous.
Dr. Christ

Mountain climber
State of Mine
Jul 12, 2013 - 10:46am PT
He was on drugs--he was high on pot

And Zimmerman could tell that while following him in his car? Zimmerman didn't say he was high... he said he was "up to no good OR on drugs OR SOMETHING." You can assume EVERYONE is "up to no good" or "on drugs" or "something" and be correct 100% of the time. That doesn't give you the right to chase them down, confront them, and shoot them.

It is undisputed that Trayvon could have easily gone home after he noticed Zimm following him, but he chose not to.

If you were a teenager, being followed by someone in a car, and you wanted to get to home (the green box), what path would you take?



Zimmerman was NOT standing his ground. He was pursuing his victim. You are an idiot.
Riley Wyna

Trad climber
A crack near you
Jul 12, 2013 - 11:24am PT
Blah blah..
Ur factually wrong
He was not high
He had trace metabolites
In other words he had smoked some weed in the last 30 days ..
Wow ... Another reason to be killed.. Lol

If he had been high .. He would have had some weed on him..
Or u think he was just carrying on joint ?

Think man ...

Hard to believe how f*#ked up you guys are
Zimmerman is a liar and violent ..
And deranged .... History is in the kids side
Bharata

Mountain climber
Pune
Jul 12, 2013 - 11:30am PT
gangster get shot. Only fellow gangsters feel a loss. Citizens are relieved.

Credit: Bharata



blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
Jul 12, 2013 - 01:40pm PT
Zimmerman was NOT standing his ground. He was pursuing his victim. You are an idiot.

Maybe, but if you think that you have a right to attack someone because you perceive that he is following you and he asks you what you're doing, you just may wind up a dead idiot.

I could easily explain a fallacy that you appear to be under re: "stand your ground," but why bother, it's more fun to see you continue to make a fool of yourself.

OK everyone the case is in the jury's hands, doubt we'll hear anything today as the jury won't want to be perceived as acting rashly no matter what the verdict. Monday could be the big day. A hung jury wouldn't surprise me either--as the comments on this site show, people seem to have fairly polarized views that are only loosely tethered to the actual evidence.

If Zimm's convicted (entirely possible if not probable, especially in light of some of the judge's evidentiary rulings), we'll have to see how appeals shake out, but that could be years down the road and I doubt it'll merit much more than minor news even if a conviction is reversed.
If he's acquitted, that is realistically the end of it from a criminal law point of view. (The public defender pointed out that, theoretically, the federal government could bring a separate charge. While that's true in the abstract, I believe the federal investigation concluded there were no federal issues raised.)
Trayvon's family could bring a civil suit, which I think is likely (and that may happen even if Zimm's convicted, but it's hard to see what the point would be then.)
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