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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Jul 18, 2014 - 11:18am PT
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tgt, thanks for posting that in its entirety.
Yeah, I guess that's one reason why I'm a so-called Reagan Democrat.
Then again, I liked Jimmy Carter, too.
And as far as today goes, I'm grateful to the hilt my president is Obama, not Putin!
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crankster
Trad climber
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Jul 18, 2014 - 12:28pm PT
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President Reagan was actually fairly bright. Her husband, Ronnie, not so much.
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wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
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Jul 18, 2014 - 03:51pm PT
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Yep,she was a good potus.
They [abc news] are saying the truck carrying only 2 of 4 missles was filmed booking back to Russia from the area where fired.
Dead to rights,Russia and Putin have some answering to do.
That said,NATO warned commercial airlines to forgo flying over eastern Ukraine.
As Ron has said ,the airline has some fault in this.
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vlani
Trad climber
mountain view, ca
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:04pm PT
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It looks more and more like the airliner was a set up. Who actually shot it down is unclear, but less important. Unclear even was that a missile or a plane.
And even more unclear is who is the target of that set up. Rebels? Ukrainian president? Putin?
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:10pm PT
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Is that you klimmer?
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vlani
Trad climber
mountain view, ca
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:16pm PT
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Interestingly the twitter https://twitter.com/spainbuca that supposedly belongs to the spanish air traffic controller working in Ukraine does not exist anymore.
From what I understand using google translate yesterday he was talking about two fighter jets next to Malaysian Boeing 3 minutes before the crash, and about military appearing in control tower minutes after the crash, like they were waiting behind the doors. He was saying 'if they shut me down I still have put that out'.
He was a naive guy, I guess.
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Greg Barnes
climber
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:18pm PT
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Set up? Ha ha!
Ukrainian government would never risk shooting down anything which might have a Russian citizen on it - might as well hand Putin a "please invade us again" invitation on a gold platter. Besides the separatists probably don't even have large airplanes flying at high altitude (or any planes at all?).
Russians are almost certainly not incompetent enough to target a civilian airliner.
Which leaves the separatists, who also happen to control the territory, and happen to have successfully shot down a large high altitude Ukranian government plane recently.
Duh.
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vlani
Trad climber
mountain view, ca
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:25pm PT
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AN-26 is half the speed turboprop, cannot fly higher that 7500m. Much easier target.
Pobly no difference for the modern warfare though.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:28pm PT
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tioga wrote,
America-hating racist criminal Obama... Obama should burn in hell, he's in on every civilian killed in Eastern Ukraine...
omg! now suddenly all your last year's posts make sense!!
Hey, where's Daphne and whatevergirrl, maybe they can get their angst up over something that really matters. :)
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Capt.
climber
some eastside hovel
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:30pm PT
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Some of the people on this site just quite simply must be ignored. tioga is one. Sh!t, I didn't ingore.
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wilbeer
Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:33pm PT
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The fruitcakes are ready!
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:47pm PT
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The picture (they keep showing) of the toilet paper rolls (unrolled)
falling out of the sky near to the smoke plume tells
us something of how this Boeing 777 got ripped open at altitude.
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Jul 18, 2014 - 04:52pm PT
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Classy.
Good day to stop taking your meds huh?
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Jul 18, 2014 - 05:25pm PT
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Is it a full moon or something
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dirtbag
climber
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Jul 18, 2014 - 05:38pm PT
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Tioga, you crack me up. Thanks for the laugh!
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skcreidc
Social climber
SD, CA
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Jul 18, 2014 - 05:43pm PT
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Tioga, you are behaving like an azzHOLE. Jeeze dude, get a grip.
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Jul 18, 2014 - 05:49pm PT
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Did the voices in your head say they were
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jul 18, 2014 - 05:55pm PT
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Well all of you actually
Bwa Ha Ha Ha Ha! So, like most threads this has turned into the Revenge of the Delusional.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Jul 18, 2014 - 06:00pm PT
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Ron on page 1
Which makes Malaysian airliner company the true culprit here Great. Blame the victim. "Culprit" requires intent. Am I a culprit if I stupidly walk out into the street and get run over?
So why WAS the Malaysian airliner flying that route?
That's a very good question.
Some facts among the noise.
 Until very recently, approximately last week, the separatists only had shoulder fired AA missiles, commonly called ManPads. Max altitude about 3500 meters/11000 feet. Zero threat to an airliner at altitude.
On Monday, a Ukraine heavy transport was shot down flying at high altitude. Ukraine thought the separatists didn't have high altitude missiles and blamed Russia.
Unlike the US/Nato/Ukraine/Russia, the separatists are likely not connected with an integrated air defense network which is capable of determining (sometimes) the nature of that blip on the radar screen.
Whoever launched the missile yesterday had no way of knowing it was a civilian airliner. It was just blips on the radar screens.
Airlines have been flying over Afghanistan for years and still do. None have been shot down.
the IAOC had not closed the Ukraine air routes as they have now.
Russia had not closed the route MH17 was about to enter.
Remember the USS Vincennes and the Iranian airliner?
The attack took place in Iranian airspace, over Iran's territorial waters in the Persian Gulf, and on the flight's usual flight path. The aircraft, an Airbus A300 B2-203, was destroyed by SM-2MR surface-to-air missiles fired from the Vincennes. According to the United States Government, the crew incorrectly identified the Iranian Airbus A300 as an attacking F-14 Tomcat fighter (a plane made in the United States and operated at that time by only two forces worldwide, the United States Navy and the Islamic Republic of Iran Air Force). One of our most advanced anti-aircraft ships couldn't tell the difference between an Airbus at 14,000 feet and an F-14.
the airliner was transmitting an identification friend or foe code for a civilian aircraft, but Captain William C. Rogers III in an interview insisted that he believed the code alone did not mean the aircraft was non-hostile. Captain Rogers described the attack as a self-defense measure to save his ship and the lives of the crew. It's called the Fog Of War
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Braunini
Big Wall climber
cupertino
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Jul 18, 2014 - 06:00pm PT
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Hey guys, please stop commenting on this story, there were not enough Americans on board to have an opinion. Thanks in advance
Pinc, this is where you make a comment critical of the US government
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