Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
So Gobee, do you agree with Jan that most christians have moved beyond bible literalism?
|
|
Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
|
|
Here are some interesting stats on types of Christians according to /wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations_by_number_of_members
Catholicism - 1.2 billion
Protestantism - 670 million
Eastern Orthodoxy - 210 million
Oriental Orthodoxy - 75 million
Anglicanism - 82 million
Nontrinitarianism - 27 million
Nestorianism - 1 million
Of these, only a small part of Protestantism claims the Bible is the literal word of God. In fact, they and some of the non trinitarians are the only major branches of Christianity which even emphasize Bible interpretation over sacraments and ritual. Protestant belief and culture has traditionally dominated America but not the world. Even in the U.S. one out of 4 Christians is Roman Catholic.
In addition, Catholics and Eastern Orthodoxy have already declared that one can believe in their religion and evolution.
|
|
bc
climber
Prescott, AZ
|
|
Taking God out of schools wasn't about teachers reading from or "giving lip service to" the Bible in school. They never did back then. I never heard them. And my two older sisters and younger brother never did either. It was about not being allowed to bring a Bible to school, pray in school(I am talking about individually or in small groups before or after school). Or wear any "religious"(meaning Christian)clothing/jewelry. Or allowing campus clubs after school. Or write or give credit to, or speak of belief in God in a written or oral report. Among other things. And the humanistic/survival of the fittest/no absolute right or wrong darwinian Godless dogma that is increasingly preached, insisting there is no God!!
And viola. Welcome to America children. Don't forget your bulletproof vests/condoms and just remember to just say no to drugs and pornagraphy on the internet and perverts! And oh yea, gangs... Compared to the fifty's and sixty's, I'd say things have changed for the worst.
Classic religionist BS.
|
|
cintune
climber
the Moon and Antarctica
|
|
|
|
Gobee
Trad climber
Los Angeles
|
|
Isaiah 42:3, a bruised reed he will not break,
and a faintly burning wick he will not quench;
he will faithfully bring forth justice.
A diving accident in 1967 left Joni Eareckson Tada a quadriplegic in a wheelchair. Today, she is an internationally known mouth artist, a talented vocalist, a radio host, an author of 17 books and an advocate for disabled persons worldwide. In this audio story, you’ll meet Joni and hear how she struggled to accept God’s design in her paralysis. http://www.joniearecksontadastory.com/
Joni has done more then ten strong men, she is made perfect in weakness!
God shows His love is real in our weakness, and allows us to share His love with others that are weak!
I also know there are a lot of lessons to learn here, and before we get the keys to the New Heaven and New Earth, we need to trust Him, but it's coming none the less...
Daily Readings from the Life of Christ (vol.2) By John MacArthur http://www.gty.org/Radio/Archive
Jan,
My understanding of the Buddha is when he was growing up at home, his father did not want him to see anything that was not beautiful, not even a dead leaf. But one day outside he saw an old woman, sickness, and death and was shattered and thought his life was a lie, and knew that would befall him.
That was the start of his journey and he renounced all his worldly possessions...
Werner said that without the soul the body is toast,(something like that).
Well we don't take anything with us!
Paul in Phlippians 4:11-13, for I have learned in whatever situation I am to be content. I know how to be brought low, and I know how to abound. In any and every circumstance, I have learned the secret of facing plenty and hunger, abundance and need. I can do all things through him who strengthens me.
Jesus in Matthew 6:19-24, “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal, but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
“The eye is the lamp of the body. So, if your eye is healthy, your whole body will be full of light, but if your eye is bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light in you is darkness, how great is the darkness!
“No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money.
God, Jesus, and the Hole Spirit is our treasure! As well as Family, loved ones, friends, the whole world belongs to God, the devil is just a spoiler!
Matthew 16:26, For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world and forfeits his soul? Or what shall a man give in return for his soul?
in Matthew 23:37-39, “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you would not! See, your house is left to you desolate. For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”
For in God we trust in Faith, Hope, and Love, from where comes our help!
Jesus is the Way to the Father...that's a Christian
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
So, is that a yes or a no?
|
|
pedge
Trad climber
SW
|
|
Progress and evolution in religion, as in other things, does not necessarily mean that what has preceded was necessarily false. As I see it, one of the threads working its way through the old testament is a movement towards the recognition of articulated belief as idolatry, piggybacked on the concept of a single, omnipotent god. The faith towards which these teaching point requires, on the one hand, a rejection of any concept or articulation of the divine as our own idolatrous creation, and on the other, the recognition that in the weakness of our own limited human perspective, once cast from Eden, we need the crutch of those idols to focus our efforts to achieve faith so that we can leave them behind. There is a similar thread concerning our relationship with the institutions that frame and maintain the idols. The new testament, although not necessarily Jesus, seems to represent a regressive reaction to the more mystical and simultaneously intellectually oriented and less literal or dogmatic faith towards with these threads were moving.
From what I understand, simplistic literalism has been increasing with evangelical teachings and rhetoric that undo much of what had been previously accomplished. I don’t really understand what is going on. But who, aside from the most hateful and cynical, really benefits from convincing people that their faith is tied to factual beliefs that can be disproven by observational science? Sometimes it seems like there is a manipulative institutional intent in teaching outright and obvious lies about basic science or our not too distant history as it relates to religion. Those with a little intellectual curiosity will soon discover the lie and are more likely to leave the institution than to try to fight it over something so outrageous or pathetic, which makes it easier to maintain a compliant, obedient flock.
|
|
Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 7, 2010 - 12:09pm PT
|
As the original poster, I feel obliged to claim number 5000!
|
|
paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
|
|
All religion is a kind of idolatry in that religion employs metaphor (and what is metaphor if not "art"?) to describe the human need for reconciliation to existence and ultimately the end of that existence. In human thought the idea of "god" is the ultimate and perhaps most common metaphor...
to read it as anything else is to abandon reason.
|
|
Gobee
Trad climber
Los Angeles
|
|
"All religion is a kind of idolatry"
Exodus 20:3, “You shall have no other gods before me.
Psalm 6:17, I will give to the Lord the thanks due to his righteousness,
and I will sing praise to the name of the Lord, the Most High.
God is eternal, get used to it!
|
|
paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
|
|
How can anyone claim that god is eternal? Perhaps god is finite, perhaps god is just as confused about his existence as most humans, perhaps god is a bungler making mistakes left and right, how can anyone claim, reasonably, to know the character of god?
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
Perhaps god is finite, perhaps god is just as confused about his existence as most humans,
Perhaps means speculation.
Means you ultimately don't know.
Since you don't know and it's pure mental speculation then it's not science.
Just pure guessing. Ultimately worthless.
Perhaps I free soled the Pacific Ocean wall yesterday. Nobody saw.
Perhaps I'm right about my free soloing the Pacific Ocean wall yesterday .....
|
|
cintune
climber
the Moon and Antarctica
|
|
He's baaaaaack.
|
|
MH2
climber
|
|
We are back from the seaside and in a mood to look at what rectorsquid asks:
So step up to the plate, believers, and admit that you could be wrong because you are human and have ego and greed and all that other stuff that makes you a really bad resource for reliable information.
It is a reasonable request in the context of this thread because it brings up the difference between ideas based on a lot of evidence, such as evolution, as opposed to faith based on little to no evidence. It seems so reasonable to ask if believers have doubt. But what would a yes or no answer mean?
If someone says, "Yes, I am not sure that there is a God," then we don't need to look further.
But if someone says, "No, I have no doubt that there is a God," can we believe them? After all, they could have doubt but be unwilling to say so, but more basically they are making a statement about the workings of their own mind, and how closely can they examine those nuts and bolts?
Again, if a person states, "There is a God," we don't expect them to give evidence that would convince a skeptic. If they could we would have joined their church long ago.
But if a person says, "I believe that there is a God," we can conceive of being able to test that statement.
We don't want to rely on what a person says, because they might be wrong. We want to turn to the experimental epistemologist and his machine that reads minds. His session with Frank began when he held up a book and asked Frank what color it was. Frank, who had recently had a problem with his color vision corrected by his eye doctor, answered that the book seemed red to him. Frank was wrong.
The epistemologist was able to know what Frank didn't know because he had a machine that looked inside Frank's brain, whereas Frank was only aware of the surface conscious part of his brain.
Granted that there is no machine to read minds. But you can do a thought experiment about thought and take away something useful from it. And despite enormous obstacles to complete measurement of brain activity, you can be sure that even partial success would have big consequences. At the airport, for example.
So there is no need to ask people if they doubt their beliefs. Any statement they make about their beliefs is suspect until you get independent evidence. It isn't impossible that one of these days the functional MRI or other technology will look at a "doubt center" in the brain and find a small spike in activity there, even as the subject states, "I have perfect faith that God loves me."
Doubt is a part of curiosity. If there is a completely incurious person, perhaps there is a person with no doubts.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
If they could we would have joined their church long ago.
Joining a church will not help.
Science will.
To prove the existence of God is done in 2 different methods.
The ascending method and the descending method.
Modern science relies completely on the ascending method and will take them forever to come to the correct conclusion because ....
You can not challenge supremacy unless you are Supreme.
Otherwise supreme would fall under delusion. Material nature maintains it's ultimate supremacy to the gross physical material scientists.
They can not defeat material nature. Otherwise the desolution of the material body (death) would have been conquered long ago.
|
|
Gobee
Trad climber
Los Angeles
|
|
"How can anyone claim that god is eternal? Perhaps god is finite, perhaps god is just as confused about his existence as most humans, perhaps god is a bungler making mistakes left and right, how can anyone claim, reasonably, to know the character of god?"
Revelation 1:8, “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”
Deuteronomy 33:27, The eternal God is your dwelling place,
and underneath are the everlasting arms.
Deuteronomy 32:4, “The Rock, his work is perfect,
for all his ways are justice.
A God of faithfulness and without iniquity,
just and upright is he
Genesis 2:1-3, Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. And on the seventh day God finished his work that he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all his work that he had done. So God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, because on it God rested from all his work that he had done in creation.
A bungler, wouldn't have rested, there would be more to be done!
The Ancient of Days Reigns
Daniel 7:9-10, “As I looked,
thrones were placed,
and the Ancient of Days took his seat;
his clothing was white as snow,
and the hair of his head like pure wool;
his throne was fiery flames;
its wheels were burning fire.
A stream of fire issued
and came out from before him;
a thousand thousands served him,
and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him;
the court sat in judgment,
and the books were opened.
The Son of Man Is Given Dominion
Daniel 7:13-14, “I saw in the night visions,
and behold, with the clouds of heaven
there came one like a son of man,
and he came to the Ancient of Days
and was presented before him.
And to him was given dominion
and glory and a kingdom,
that all peoples, nations, and languages
should serve him;
his dominion is an everlasting dominion,
which shall not pass away,
and his kingdom one
that shall not be destroyed.
The Lord Answers Job
Job 38, Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind and said:
2 “Who is this that darkens counsel by words without knowledge?
3 Dress for action like a man;
I will question you, and you make it known to me.
4 “Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth?
Tell me, if you have understanding.
5 Who determined its measurements—surely you know!
Or who stretched the line upon it?
6 On what were its bases sunk,
or who laid its cornerstone,
7 when the morning stars sang together
and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
8 “Or who shut in the sea with doors
when it burst out from the womb,
9 when I made clouds its garment
and thick darkness its swaddling band,
10 and prescribed limits for it
and set bars and doors,
11 and said, ‘Thus far shall you come, and no farther,
and here shall your proud waves be stayed’?
12 “Have you commanded the morning since your days began,
and caused the dawn to know its place,
13 that it might take hold of the skirts of the earth,
and the wicked be shaken out of it?
14 It is changed like clay under the seal,
and its features stand out like a garment.
15 From the wicked their light is withheld,
and their uplifted arm is broken.
16 “Have you entered into the springs of the sea,
or walked in the recesses of the deep?
17 Have the gates of death been revealed to you,
or have you seen the gates of deep darkness?
18 Have you comprehended the expanse of the earth?
Declare, if you know all this.
19 “Where is the way to the dwelling of light,
and where is the place of darkness,
20 that you may take it to its territory
and that you may discern the paths to its home?
21 You know, for you were born then,
and the number of your days is great!
22 “Have you entered the storehouses of the snow,
or have you seen the storehouses of the hail,
23 which I have reserved for the time of trouble,
for the day of battle and war?
24 What is the way to the place where the light is distributed,
or where the east wind is scattered upon the earth?
25 “Who has cleft a channel for the torrents of rain
and a way for the thunderbolt,
26 to bring rain on a land where no man is,
on the desert in which there is no man,
27 to satisfy the waste and desolate land,
and to make the ground sprout with grass?
28 “Has the rain a father,
or who has begotten the drops of dew?
29 From whose womb did the ice come forth,
and who has given birth to the frost of heaven?
30 The waters become hard like stone,
and the face of the deep is frozen.
31 “Can you bind the chains of the Pleiades
or loose the cords of Orion?
32 Can you lead forth the Mazzaroth in their season,
or can you guide the Bear with its children?
33 Do you know the ordinances of the heavens?
Can you establish their rule on the earth?
34 “Can you lift up your voice to the clouds,
that a flood of waters may cover you?
35 Can you send forth lightnings, that they may go
and say to you, ‘Here we are’?
36 Who has put wisdom in the inward parts
or given understanding to the mind?
37 Who can number the clouds by wisdom?
Or who can tilt the waterskins of the heavens,
38 when the dust runs into a mass
and the clods stick fast together?
39 “Can you hunt the prey for the lion,
or satisfy the appetite of the young lions,
40 when they crouch in their dens
or lie in wait in their thicket?
41 Who provides for the raven its prey,
when its young ones cry to God for help,
and wander about for lack of food?
Job 39, “Do you know when the mountain goats give birth?
Do you observe the calving of the does?
2 Can you number the months that they fulfill,
and do you know the time when they give birth,
3 when they crouch, bring forth their offspring,
and are delivered of their young?
4 Their young ones become strong; they grow up in the open;
they go out and do not return to them.
5 “Who has let the wild donkey go free?
Who has loosed the bonds of the swift donkey,
6 to whom I have given the arid plain for his home
and the salt land for his dwelling place?
7 He scorns the tumult of the city;
he hears not the shouts of the driver.
8 He ranges the mountains as his pasture,
and he searches after every green thing.
9 “Is the wild ox willing to serve you?
Will he spend the night at your manger?
10 Can you bind him in the furrow with ropes,
or will he harrow the valleys after you?
11 Will you depend on him because his strength is great,
and will you leave to him your labor?
12 Do you have faith in him that he will return your grain
and gather it to your threshing floor?
13 “The wings of the ostrich wave proudly,
but are they the pinions and plumage of love?
14 For she leaves her eggs to the earth
and lets them be warmed on the ground,
15 forgetting that a foot may crush them
and that the wild beast may trample them.
16 She deals cruelly with her young, as if they were not hers;
though her labor be in vain, yet she has no fear,
17 because God has made her forget wisdom
and given her no share in understanding.
18 When she rouses herself to flee,
she laughs at the horse and his rider.
19 “Do you give the horse his might?
Do you clothe his neck with a mane?
20 Do you make him leap like the locust?
His majestic snorting is terrifying.
21 He paws in the valley and exults in his strength;
he goes out to meet the weapons.
22 He laughs at fear and is not dismayed;
he does not turn back from the sword.
23 Upon him rattle the quiver,
the flashing spear, and the javelin.
24 With fierceness and rage he swallows the ground;
he cannot stand still at the sound of the trumpet.
25 When the trumpet sounds, he says ‘Aha!’
He smells the battle from afar,
the thunder of the captains, and the shouting.
26 “Is it by your understanding that the hawk soars
and spreads his wings toward the south?
27 Is it at your command that the eagle mounts up
and makes his nest on high?
28 On the rock he dwells and makes his home,
on the rocky crag and stronghold.
29 From there he spies out the prey;
his eyes behold it from far away.
30 His young ones suck up blood,
and where the slain are, there is he.”
Job 40, And the Lord said to Job:
2 “Shall a faultfinder contend with the Almighty?
He who argues with God, let him answer it.”
Job Promises Silence
3 Then Job answered the Lord and said:
4 “Behold, I am of small account; what shall I answer you?
I lay my hand on my mouth.
5 I have spoken once, and I will not answer;
twice, but I will proceed no further.”
The Lord Challenges Job
6 Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind and said:
7 “Dress for action like a man;
I will question you, and you make it known to me.
8 Will you even put me in the wrong?
Will you condemn me that you may be in the right?
9 Have you an arm like God,
and can you thunder with a voice like his?
10 “Adorn yourself with majesty and dignity;
clothe yourself with glory and splendor.
11 Pour out the overflowings of your anger,
and look on everyone who is proud and abase him.
12 Look on everyone who is proud and bring him low
and tread down the wicked where they stand.
13 Hide them all in the dust together;
bind their faces in the world below.
14 Then will I also acknowledge to you
that your own right hand can save you.
15 “Behold, Behemoth, which I made as I made you;
he eats grass like an ox.
16 Behold, his strength in his loins,
and his power in the muscles of his belly.
17 He makes his tail stiff like a cedar;
the sinews of his thighs are knit together.
18 His bones are tubes of bronze,
his limbs like bars of iron.
19 “He is the first of the works of God;
let him who made him bring near his sword!
20 For the mountains yield food for him
where all the wild beasts play.
21 Under the lotus plants he lies,
in the shelter of the reeds and in the marsh.
22 For his shade the lotus trees cover him;
the willows of the brook surround him.
23 Behold, if the river is turbulent he is not frightened;
he is confident though Jordan rushes against his mouth.
24 Can one take him by his eyes,
or pierce his nose with a snare?
Job 41, “Can you draw out Leviathan with a fishhook
or press down his tongue with a cord?
2 Can you put a rope in his nose
or pierce his jaw with a hook?
3 Will he make many pleas to you?
Will he speak to you soft words?
4 Will he make a covenant with you
to take him for your servant forever?
5 Will you play with him as with a bird,
or will you put him on a leash for your girls?
6 Will traders bargain over him?
Will they divide him up among the merchants?
7 Can you fill his skin with harpoons
or his head with fishing spears?
8 Lay your hands on him;
remember the battle—you will not do it again!
9 Behold, the hope of a man is false;
he is laid low even at the sight of him.
10 No one is so fierce that he dares to stir him up.
Who then is he who can stand before me?
11 Who has first given to me, that I should repay him?
Whatever is under the whole heaven is mine.
12 “I will not keep silence concerning his limbs,
or his mighty strength, or his goodly frame.
13 Who can strip off his outer garment?
Who would come near him with a bridle?
14 Who can open the doors of his face?
Around his teeth is terror.
15 His back is made of rows of shields,
shut up closely as with a seal.
16 One is so near to another
that no air can come between them.
17 They are joined one to another;
they clasp each other and cannot be separated.
18 His sneezings flash forth light,
and his eyes are like the eyelids of the dawn.
19 Out of his mouth go flaming torches;
sparks of fire leap forth.
20 Out of his nostrils comes forth smoke,
as from a boiling pot and burning rushes.
21 His breath kindles coals,
and a flame comes forth from his mouth.
22 In his neck abides strength,
and terror dances before him.
23 The folds of his flesh stick together,
firmly cast on him and immovable.
24 His heart is hard as a stone,
hard as the lower millstone.
25 When he raises himself up the mighty are afraid;
at the crashing they are beside themselves.
26 Though the sword reaches him, it does not avail,
nor the spear, the dart, or the javelin.
27 He counts iron as straw,
and bronze as rotten wood.
28 The arrow cannot make him flee;
for him sling stones are turned to stubble.
29 Clubs are counted as stubble;
he laughs at the rattle of javelins.
30 His underparts are like sharp potsherds;
he spreads himself like a threshing sledge on the mire.
31 He makes the deep boil like a pot;
he makes the sea like a pot of ointment.
32 Behind him he leaves a shining wake;
one would think the deep to be white-haired.
33 On earth there is not his like,
a creature without fear.
34 He sees everything that is high;
he is king over all the sons of pride.”
Job's Confession and Repentance
Job 42, Then Job answered the Lord and said:
2 “I know that you can do all things,
and that no purpose of yours can be thwarted.
3 ‘Who is this that hides counsel without knowledge?’
Therefore I have uttered what I did not understand,
things too wonderful for me, which I did not know.
4 ‘Hear, and I will speak;
I will question you, and you make it known to me.’
5 I had heard of you by the hearing of the ear,
but now my eye sees you;
6 therefore I despise myself,
and repent in dust and ashes.”
|
|
paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
|
|
Deuteronomy 32:4, “The Rock, his work is perfect,
for all his ways are justice.
A God of faithfulness and without iniquity,
just and upright is he
Ha! Justice? Perfection? Tell it to a four year old kid with terminal cancer. If there is a god he's doing a piss poor job of running the universe!
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
I'm gathering Gobee is a committed biblical literalist.
|
|
bc
climber
Prescott, AZ
|
|
No, Gobee is literal biblical cut-n-paste-ist. And in his honor, I submit the following from the Dwindling In Unbelief blog.http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/
Biblical Justice: Everybody must get stoned
(To the tune of Bob Dylan's "Rainy Day Woman #12 & 35")
Well, they'll stone you if you touch the holy things.
Whosoever toucheth the mount shall be surely put to death. Exodus 19:13
They'll stone you if you take accursed things.
Achan ... took of the accursed thing. ... And all Israel stoned him with stones, and burned them with fire, after they had stoned them with stones. ... So the LORD turned from the fierceness of his anger. Joshua 7:1-26
They'll stone you if you if you curse or blaspheme.
And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him. Leviticus 24:16
They'll stone you if you're raped and do not scream.
If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24
But I would not feel so all alone. Everybody must get stoned.
Well, they'll stone you if you're an ox and gore a human.
If an ox gore a man or a woman, that they die: then the ox shall be surely stoned. Exodus 21:28
They'll stone you if you marry when not a virgin.
If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And the damsel's father shall say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city. ... But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:13-21
They'll stone you if you worship other gods.
If there be found among you ... that ... hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them ... Then shalt thou ... tone them with stones, till they die. Deuteronomy 17:2-5
If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers ... thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die. Deuteronomy 13:5-10
They'll stone you if you disobey your Pa.
If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother ... Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city ... And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard. And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die. Deuteronomy 21:18-21
But I would not feel so all alone. Everybody must get stoned.
They'll stone you if you if you're a wizard or a witch.
A man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death: they shall stone them with stones: their blood shall be upon them. Leviticus 20:27
They'll stone you if you give Molech your kids.
Whosoever ... giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones. Leviticus 20:2
They'll stone you if you if you're a sabbath breaker.
They found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. ... And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones.... And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses. Numbers 15:32-56
They'll stone you if you curse the dictator.
Thou didst blaspheme God and the king. And then carry him out, and stone him, that he may die. 1 Kings 21:10
But I would not feel so all alone. Everybody must get stoned.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!