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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Jun 17, 2013 - 08:40am PT
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I see folks still have problems understanding the change in climate change and how an average work.
Yup, Chief, focus on the reality.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 02:53pm PT
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There goes the neighborhood! I see the subjects mentioned in the video more as 'constants' and underplay what Man is doing to the planet. I think what is happening is more 'local' to our planet. It is very easy to bury this in videos like that. Of course there is natural fluctuation in many factors. The one big fluctuation happening that is NOT natural is the big increase of CO2, methane, and other gases. Even in the charts in the video, the increase is off the charts, yet it gets minor mention. Whatever variation is happening on the other planets is NOT human caused yet it is correlated as all in the same bucket. We are changing our planet to a mind boggling degree, supplanting natural forces. If the CO2 increases happened of their own accord we would be quite alarmed, but NO! Man cannot have that kind of influence! The oceans and melting poles are throwing a big loop into everything. Clearly, the warming on a geologic scale is minor and easy to be disrupted by the business as usual of the atmosphere and oceans. The trend is toward further warming of the oceans though. The oceans can really be seen as the main atmosphere of our planet - the real flywheel. The oceans have a high potential to hide what is happening, and it is easy for contrarians to muddle the developing science.
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Jun 17, 2013 - 03:03pm PT
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whore's shit
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 03:06pm PT
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I believe you mean the movie. We're just a little out of order - like the biosphere. I know, I checked some of your recent posts. :>)
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Jun 17, 2013 - 03:58pm PT
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Yes, the movie... where a 40% increase in CO2 (clearly the result of humans burning fossil fuels) is brushed over in favor of a huge government conspiracy to tinker with the Earth's magnetosphere in order to subdue the people and prevent the apocalypse.
Ed will correct me if I'm wrong...
Energy flux from solar winds, over a relatively small area (affected by the Earth's magnetosphere): ~70 uW m^-2 (0.00007 W m^-2)
Energy flux from shortwave radiation (not affected by the Earth's magnetosphere): ~600+ W m^-2
A 10% decline in the ability of the Earth's magnetosphere to stop radiation from solar winds over the last 150 years would be insignificant as far as the Earth's energy balance is concerned.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 04:14pm PT
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Watts Up With That is in the movie credits and the mention of cosmic rays and clouds is clearly Dr. Roy Spencer who has been discredited. The movie glances at so many subjects without covering them it is clear it is not meant to educate.
I want to make more clear what I said about heat hiding in the oceans. Clearly the oceans are heating but at the same time the polar ice caps are melting in a relative amount to that. That cold water obviously goes into the oceans and acts to cool them in. This acts like a negative feedback but long term what happens when the capacity of the ice to cool the oceans is gone? There is not much in the media about that balancing act. That is an hourglass that can poor for quite some time.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 04:21pm PT
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The polar landmass ice does not reside in the oceans as in a drink. It goes in after it melts. I am not speaking of sea-ice but of the vast quantities of continental ice (seemingly vast anyway!)
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Jun 17, 2013 - 04:24pm PT
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Polar ice and the oceans are not in thermal equilibrium... the ice and drink in your cocktail glass are pretty close. The cold water from the melting ice sinks, flows towards the equator, and is gradually heated by the warmer water along the way.
If your cocktail glass was 1,000 miles wide you would experience the same phenomenon... but probably wouldn't give a sh#t.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 04:33pm PT
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When people talk about heat lagging behind CO2 buildup this could be exactly what that looks like. You have CO2 buildup, you have ice to counter the heat buildup because of the CO2, but then when the ice is gone, the heat is there bigtime, with the corresponding lagging showing before. Clearly though, CO2 in the distant past was not man-caused.
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abrams
Sport climber
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Jun 17, 2013 - 04:35pm PT
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I am certain that the ice in my soda did not melt as fast today as it
did last year sitting at the same table in the food court.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 04:41pm PT
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Sorry, there's plenty of data showing you are wrong. You are speaking of Sea-ice in Antarctica, not continental ice. The sea-ice is increasing because the fresh water coming off the continental ice floats on top of the salt water and we all know fresh water freezes more easily than salt water, hence the increase in sea-ice with the same 'relative' temps.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Topic Author's Reply - Jun 17, 2013 - 05:24pm PT
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unbelievable,, we are BACK to this "stuff" again...
What's unbelievable Ron, is that you continuously prove yourself unable to understand the science behind climate change or the implications of a warming planet.
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Jun 17, 2013 - 05:28pm PT
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The reality behind the science: Humans have increased the CO2 in the atmosphere by over 40%. We need to reduce carbon emissions. Pretty fuking simple.
The overblown bullshit spewed ad nausea by the uneducated morans and attributed to science: read Ron's post.
Why no bitching and whining about the doom and gloom apocalypse video posted by Jim Cockram?
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Jun 17, 2013 - 05:39pm PT
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Jun 17, 2013 - 05:59pm PT
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^^ The Chief likes to start at 97 ^^
If you start at 96, you still get a large rise, so the UN Chief is right that it takes 30-40 years to see a trend break.
And of course, the last few years fit well with the long term trend.
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mountainlion
Trad climber
California
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Jun 17, 2013 - 06:02pm PT
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Ron you just can't help yourself can you??
what's with the polar bears screwin the brownies and thinning their blood comment as well as saying humans think it is good for humans to do...RACIST!!
Yes it is perfectly reasonable for a human to mate with another human of a different race diversity strengthens our species. In bears it has shown to be detrimental to thier health (thier skulls take on a slightly different shape and are not as strong...also thier coat/camoflage doesn't work as well).
I found it is easier to teach a pig to fly than for science to make it past your ear canals and into your brain but I must speak up when I see your blatant racism tarnish this thread. clean it up please.
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dirtbag
climber
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Jun 17, 2013 - 06:02pm PT
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^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Jun 17, 2013 - 06:03pm PT
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THE UN's climate change chief, Rajendra Pachauri, has acknowledged a 17-year pause in global temperature rises, confirmed recently by Britain's Met Office, but said it would need to last "30 to 40 years at least" to break the long-term global warming trend.
Dr Pachauri, the chairman of the UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, said that open discussion about controversial science and politically incorrect views was an essential part of tackling climate change.
It does not say temps have fallen. That being the case, if polar ice melt is accelerating while 'the rate of increase of warming' has stopped, the net effect of the dynamic is warming.
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