Classic Ice Primer- Chouinard Catalog 1968

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 581 - 597 of total 597 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Topic Author's Reply - Dec 11, 2016 - 12:21pm PT
Tis the Season...
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 14, 2018 - 06:24pm PT
The ice back east must be epic this season.
Fritz

Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
Jan 14, 2018 - 06:28pm PT
Steve! Thanks again for creating this fine thread.

Even though those greedy arseholes at Photobucket have caused a lot of the historic photos on it to be lost, it's still great reading for any climber historian, or a climber looking for some great stories.
Mark Force

Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
Jan 15, 2018 - 05:44am PT
I love my new BD Snaggletooth crampons.


But, those old Chouinard rigid crampons work better for French technique on neve and alpine ice because of the vertical points under the arch that we donít enjoy with the new style crampons - awesome as they are. Itís fun to play around with those old style crampons on glacier ice to see what they do in their element.
Brian in SLC

Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
Jan 15, 2018 - 12:42pm PT
The ice back east must be epic this season.

Epic in a bad way?

Late coming in (again). Warm temp's prior to xmas had nearly no ice except up high (although the Black Dike was gettin' done a bunch).

Then, way too cold.

Then, way too warm (again).

Too warm then too cold. Not good for building big, climbable ice flows.

(Was in Maine over the xmas/new years holidaze...left the ice tools at home...froze my butt off skiing instead).
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 15, 2018 - 12:52pm PT
Three Burrs syndrome...

The notion of slipping out of a crampon while flatfooting is simply horrific!
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Jan 15, 2018 - 05:03pm PT
ya, the ice sucks here. omega was done yesterday and today. we had the lake to ourselfs. two of our friends were way left of us...
Credit: tradmanclimbs
Credit: tradmanclimbs
Credit: tradmanclimbs
Credit: tradmanclimbs
Credit: tradmanclimbs
AP

Trad climber
Calgary
Jan 15, 2018 - 05:32pm PT
Ice daggers! When ice climbers were REAL MEN.
Warthogs were great for cleaning ice out of screws but useless as pro
Fritz

Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
Jan 15, 2018 - 05:54pm PT
Ap! Re your mention!
Warthogs were great for cleaning ice out of screws but useless as pro


I loved Warthogs back in the 1970's, because I could be in a panic-shituation & just pound them into the ice, vs having to calmly screw in a screw. And of course, you remember the problem with having to stick those 70's Salewa ice-screws down your shirt to melt the ice-core out of them, if they were too cold to poke the ice out of them with a tool?

Mountain Magazine published a fairly comprehensive ice-screw/warthog test around 1978. It proved that Warthogs would not hold much of a fall, even if correctly placed in solid water ice. After that, Salewa & Chouinard quit selling Warthogs.

Sigh. I'm sure there's still a market for them.

My Salewa Warthog on the Chouinard Route, N. Face Mt. Fay in August 1978.

Credit: Fritz
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 15, 2018 - 06:21pm PT
I liked Snargs for that very situation.
Something to ease the mind while you got something better...
Fritz

Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
Jan 15, 2018 - 08:13pm PT
Steve: I always thought you just planted your Chouinard ice axe for security, while you pounded in a Warthog. A friend with good camera gear took this photo of me on a waterfall up Icicle Creek, near Leavenworth WA, late winter 1974.

Credit: Fritz

It was an easy lead, so I didn't place much pro, but then again, it was 1974, and I was so much younger then.

Credit: Fritz

Roots

Mountain climber
Redmond, Oregon
Jan 16, 2018 - 10:15am PT
Sweet! Ouray end of next month for me. Woot!
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Jan 16, 2018 - 03:26pm PT
Snarg placed in frozen turf on FA of A Beer Or A Beer 1985??
Credit: tradmanclimbs
Credit: tradmanclimbs
norm larson

climber
wilson, wyoming
Jan 16, 2018 - 04:09pm PT
A snarg story for you. In the late 70ís I worked at Teton Mountaineering in Jackson. One day Mike Lowe came in with a new pound in tube for ice pro to show us. He left one with us to try. Being the eager young gun I took it out as my secret weapon next time I went to climb ice. Winter in the Tetons used to be cold, really cold, and of course I thought that was the best time to climb ice. I pounded the sh#t out of that tube thinking how great it was to not have to use two hands to screw in a salewa screw. Great until a chunk about half the size of a refridgerator exploded around that tube.
Figurered it would be better in warmer conditions so tried it on the next route. It went in like a breeze and I felt pretty crafty.
Trouble was they had a flare to the tube, wider at the back to ease cleaning the core, but it caused the tube to back it self our slowly so by the time I was 15 feet above it it was half way out and still oozing out. These were the smooth sided prototype before the snarg had threads.
I later put it in a vice to squeeze it into a parallel tube and used it somewhere in South America for a rappel anchor never to be seen again.
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Jan 16, 2018 - 04:34pm PT
they either fixed themslefs permanently or the fell out when you climbed past them. I have a few that I use to hold the windows open in the cabin....
Winter of 81-82 in Jackson Hole it was routinly 44 to 56 below farenheight.. saw cars with frozen radiators... gave up on my car for about 3 weeks. the day it finally went above freezeing in febuary a bunch of us from the Richmond Hotel flop house (right across the street from the Outlaw Motel) were out in the parking lot with camp stoves under our oil pans trying to get our rigs started... It was so cold that you could burn your lungs and your whisky could freeze solid just walking the 2 blocks home from the buss stop. Missed the last buss back from the village a few times (waylaid at the Moose) and almost froze to death hitching home after midnight...
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 16, 2018 - 05:38pm PT
YOW! Good case for driving a VW BITD even with little chance of heat on the inside. Even gas freezes eventually. LOL
That was the weird thing about Snargs, easy in but not so easy out with those fine threads. Lowe even made one with no threads at all for placing vertically in back of column tops.
The second generation fat ones definitely worked better. Best not to fall...I remember getting a call from Scott Decapio after his partner ripped three screws in late season Banff ice stopping just short of the ground. "Tell your partner that he's a lucky man, but he already knows that".
Mark Force

Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
Jan 16, 2018 - 05:55pm PT
Mountain Technology WartHog Turf Screw
https://www.needlesports.com/4131/products/mountain-technology-warthog-turf-screw.aspx

Credit: Mark Force

"Just about the only thing for frozen turf belays. Drive in, screw out.

The Warthog was originally designed as an ice screw but there are much better ice screws available these days and it is no longer recommended for this purpose. However they are still a very useful part of the winter climber's armoury as they are one of the few devices suitable for providing protection in frozen turf.

Warthogs should be considered as marginal equipment to be used only when there is no other option. Due to the immeasurable nature of the matrix they are placed in the best that can be said about them is that they are not as safe as most other forms of protection but that they can be safer than no protection at all.

Obviously if a rock or solid ice belay is available then use it, don't rely on a marginal frozen turf belay. However, there may be occasions when there is no rock or solid ice belay available, a typical example might be at the top of a climb where, having overcome a difficult cornice, you are faced with a vast sloping or flat area of solidly frozen but featureless terrain with nothing obvious to belay to at all. Our recommendation would be to go as far back from the edge as you can, if possible getting over the far side of any slight hump you can find. Drive the point and shaft of Warthog vertically into solidly frozen turf by hitting it with an ice hammer until the base of the eye is in contact with the ground. Use two Warthogs if possible, spaced at least one metre apart and one on each rope, and also back everything up with anything else you have to hand such as ice hooks and the pick of your ice axe or hammer. Take a sitting stance between the Warthog(s) and the edge of the cliff, but well back from any cornice, and improve the stance by digging a hole in the snow to brace your feet against if possible. Clip your rope(s) into the Warthog(s) and other devices forming the belay using karabiners and clove hitches and make sure that the tension on all aspects of the belay is as equal as possible. Finally, keep the rope to your climbing partner tight at all times and instruct them not to fall off under any circumstances!

For belays and running belays mid route, as much of the above as is possible should be applied and any possible more solid runner placement above the Warthog should be utilised as soon as it is encountered.

To remove the Warthog from frozen turf, insert the pick of your ice axe through the eye and use it to turn the Warthog anti-clockwise to loosen it, then lift it out.

After use, store in a dry place where it will not go rusty. Warthogs are made of high quality steel and should last you many years of winter climbing as long as you don't try and hammer them into rock, as you will probably bend the point. We suggest retiring them after ten years, or sooner if they show signs of damage that is more than cosmetic."
Messages 581 - 597 of total 597 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews