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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Do you really believe the divine
I think you loose me here.
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7SacredPools
Trad climber
Ontario, Canada
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As far as the cosmos is concerned, we humans are no more special than a chicken. We just imagine we are.
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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You did, but you are certainly in a long line of speculation on the matter, the Μοῖραι being only a beginning in the west.
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Flip Flop
climber
Earth Planet, Universe
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"Shallow men believe in luck. Strong men believe in cause and effect." Ralph W.E.
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TomCochrane
Trad climber
Cascade Mountains and Monterey Bay
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Most of us here have entrusted our lives to Boot Flake, even though it has no visible means of support and we all know it falls down every first day of April.
While standing on top of Dolt Tower I experienced a large rock fall that seemed about the right amount of mass for Boot Flake.
Straight across the valley on the North Face of Lower Cathedral Rock, a few of us entrusted our lives to a 300' flake that was central to success on the route, but with no visible means of support. That flake is now a large boulder field at the base of the wall and the wall has not been climbed since that happened following the third ascent.
Frank Sacherer and I climbed the El Cap Tree Direct by a route that has now fallen off into the boulder field at the base.
A key piece of the NFHD has fallen off.
The GP Apron has been thoroughly scoured by large rock falls.
We've all seen the pictures of the Waterfall Route and we've all walked under there to the East Ridge and other routes.
Yet Yosemite has some of the most solid pieces of rock around.
The concept of luck seems like a pretty weird idea
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larryhorton
Trad climber
NM
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No argument. This is great. The perspective of each entry perfectly reveals its level of residence. And each is perfect, fulfilling its portion of the journey.
Nice quote from Emerson, Flip Flop. I’ve never read Emerson and haven’t seen this quote. The saints would add to it: Soul accepts the perfection of cause and effect and the weight of its responsibility in the physical body, yet is already in the process of becoming first cause, never effect.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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That is correct Flip Flop and karma (like prayer) has zero relatiinship to cause and effect.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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The concept of luck seems like a pretty weird idea
Not to a few billion asians. La Femme’s office mate’s mum just died. The office mate is a
woman of science delivering quality health care daily. But NO WAY will she enter our house
during the 30 days after her mum passed.
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larryhorton
Trad climber
NM
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Tom, the depth of your perception and observations is priceless. Isn’t it interesting how we begin to see cycles of time near the end of our lives that weren’t previously visible? Just imagine the cycles that only reveal themselves in lengths of time beyond that of human life—and remain totally unknown to the human mind!
What you’ve seen in your lifetime are mere suggestions of ‘from dust to dust’, yet clearly point in that direction—the nature of the dual, lower worlds. And the value of your observation is that it comes from undeniable personal experience. It’s yours!
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larryhorton
Trad climber
NM
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Sin, a grossly distorted moralistic concept these days, was defined in ancient Greece as, “missing the mark”, a far more realistic description of missteps on the journey.
Karma IS cause and effect—an invariably precise and perfect, self-regulating system to keep the lower worlds and their denizens from flying apart. Every thought, feeling, word, and action is a cause put in motion. And it will have a precise effect. As mentioned above, just because we’re incapable of perceiving the extent of karma’s play doesn’t negate its existence. And the higher our vantage point, the more obvious this becomes.
Prayer, on the other hand, begs for a handout, and is a willy-nilly self-admission that the divine doesn’t already exist within each human being. But it perfectly serves most of humanity.
Maybe Jim will share with us what he thinks karma is.
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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and the reverend conjectured:
P(A|B)P(B)=P(B|A)P(A)
deal with it.
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larryhorton
Trad climber
NM
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I’ll bet it was grace, Moose.
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Don Paul
Gym climber
Denver CO
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Years ago I worked as a salesman. If you want to succeed in that profession you need to believe in statistics, not luck. If you make 50 phone calls a day, you're going to find a lot of customers. On the other hand if you ride an emotional rollercoaster and celebrate every sale and get depressed when someone hangs up on you, you won't.
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cornel
climber
Lake Tahoe, Nevada
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A peasant farmers single horse ran off one day. When the villagers heard they said what bad fortune.! The farmer replied serenely, perhaps. His horse returned 2 days later with 3 other horses. When the villagers heard they replied what good fortune! The farmer serenely stated, perhaps. The farmers 19 yr old son broke his leg leaving the farmer short handed. The villagers said what bad fortune! The farmer serenely replied, perhaps. The next day the Chinese Army came into the village looking for all able bodied young men. The villagers said Oh what good fortune your son not being taken by the army! The farmer serenely replied, perhaps..
The moral, cool calm collected rules the day. Good things can happen when we are not radiating fear, radiating thought. Seeing clearly the path forward. Certainly this is easier said than done. I try to nurture this attitude in stillness throughout my day. I found it especially beneficial in climbing, walls year round and skiing the backcountry. One can see the danger zone clearly and how to best negotiate it. Whether it’s how to do an A5 safely (no holes or enhancements either) or see that ski shoot with a boobytrap waiting.. pick another line.. the danger wherever it may lay can be seen. Sometimes it’s where you least expect it...
So far I have managed 45 yrs with only one broken ankle and a dislocated shoulder..
If I get the chop tomorrow I have not a single regret..
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OnsightOrGoHome
Trad climber
Fair Oaks
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I've always thought it odd when someone is injured, but survives what could have easily resulted in death, as being considered to have been "lucky". "He's lucky he only lost a leg and didn't die!"
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
ne'er–do–well
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The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.
~ Mark Twain
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larryhorton
Trad climber
NM
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To the devotee of food, who enjoys preparing a delicious and thoroughly life supporting breakfast for self and loved ones, it’s enough to start with a generous splash of olive oil and black mustard seeds in the wok. Maybe some cumin seed, as well. Place the wok over a moderate flame. When the mustard seeds begin to pop, it’s time to add onion, red bell pepper, and celery, and begin stirring. Still too early to put in the garlic, although it’s already chopped and ready, along with shiitake mushrooms, zucchini, and bok choy stems. At the proper time these will be added, so the garlic isn’t overcooked, and the mushrooms have had ample time to absorb all the delectable juices. The loving cook, of course, has already done his morning exercise, and is thoroughly connected to the inner Master, Who is unerringly guiding every move of His devoted student’s daily tasks—even though the disciple is blissed out, thinking only of the Master! Near the end, bok choy greens, maybe some spinach, and the separately braised chunks of lamb are tossed in until just before they’re limp, and it’s all ready to be placed on hot plates and delivered to it’s appreciative destination.
In a parallel universe, the Ed Cartoonies of the world are shouting, “Mustard seeds popping?!!”, bristling in outrage over such a simple and ‘primitive’ notion. They, instead, are getting out their digital thermometers, watches, and electronic devices to enter this important information into their databases. Some of them entertain such well developed minds that they can assemble and calculate all these numbers in their heads to determine the proper moment, via temperature (in centigrade) and time (24 hour time), to determine when to safely add other ingredients. And of course each step must be similarly analyzed and determined for success. Brilliant! Scientific!!!
In the meantime, the lovely, organic, extra-virgin, but overheated olive oil has charred the little mustard seeds to carbon and is transforming into a popping, sizzling, carcinogenic chemical whose stench and equally carcinogenic smoke is filling the house, sending hapless, hungry guests rushing outside for a breath of fresh air.
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TomCochrane
Trad climber
Cascade Mountains and Monterey Bay
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I've never been seriously injured while climbing.
But I could write a book just on amazing near misses and climbing routes that fell down or avalanched.
Also many amazing near misses while SCUBA diving, flying, ocean sailing, motorcycling on the highways, and twice being chased in the wilderness by riflemen.
My only serious injuries have been a broken elbow playing mandatory basketball in Boise High School PE class, being tossed out of the back seat of a Jeep rolled by L. Ron Hubbard's son Arthur as we drove up the hill to ski at Big Bear, and having my chute collapsed while I was still 20 feet up at Skydive Spaceland in Rosharon Texas.
Still healthy, still having fun ...
There is no logical material universe rational for how I could have survived all this.
Is this luck? ... that's not how I think of it ...
thankful and grateful
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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In a parallel universe, the Ed Cartoonies of the world are shouting, “Mustard seeds popping?!!”, bristling in outrage over such a simple and ‘primitive’ notion...
My aren't we a bit melodramatic.
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