The Offroad Van Hunt

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thebravecowboy

climber
The Good Places
Dec 12, 2016 - 12:36pm PT
which of your preferences do you want to scratch up on creosote and juniper? I know which I'd pick. But then not all people've got the good itch for the rough roads.
i'm gumby dammit

Sport climber
da ow
Dec 12, 2016 - 12:54pm PT
from http://whitefeather4x4conversions.com/faqs/
Q: Do you upgrade to off road tires?
A: Yes, the Dana’s front axle has about 36% more stopping power brakes than a stock Sprinter and requires a 17 inch wheel so we include 17 inch Michelin or BFG load range E tires with the conversion on steel or forged aluminum wheels.

Q: Can I have different tires installed?
A: Sprinters are sensitive to tire sidewall construction, their stability sensors like sturdy sidewalls which Michelin and BFG tires have.

Q: Can I have oversized tires installed as part of the conversion?
A: The Sprinter wheel wells won’t allow much of a tire size increase plus the sliding side cargo door will hit the right rear "door" if the tires are much wider or installed on the wrong backspace wheel. Our standard LT 245 tire keeps the speedometer correct and the ABS function correct.

I assume "door" is supposed to be tire
NutAgain!

Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Dec 12, 2016 - 01:11pm PT
Thanks Gumby - I came up with $60k because the website configurator was about $53k not including taxes and whatever else they tack on, and they seem to go for a premium if you take a very low miles used one. I haven't factored in whatever haggling/deal-making room there is for a new one. I updated my model with more optimistic mpg for Mercedes, and lower price.

Edit: Thanks for the Sprinter Whitefeather info... that data clarifies how much wiggle room for improving clearance. Econoline can be more aggressive, but the MB might be enough. The whitefeather conversion is a boatload of money, and results in more lift than the stock 4x4.

Definitely the stock 4x4 MB option is better resale value and larger addressable market of people interested vs. a customized Econoline. That said, we have no intention to sell in less than 20 years and would only get rid of it for some sort of financial disaster or family emergency. We'd be paying cash, not financing it.

Bravecowboy, I am a solid desert pinstripe dude, but that's not how I'll keep my marriage working so this vehicle would have to be cared for in a more gingerly fashion. So western sierra overly overgrown roads will be avoided but lots of open stuff on eastside and beyond. Maybe I could find some of those magnetic business signs to pile along the surfaces when I go through zones of creosote and yucca and black-banded rabbit brush scratching.

I don't think she'd look underneath the vehicle so I can still go over parallel track with tall sage in the middle.

tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Dec 12, 2016 - 03:22pm PT
Talked to a 4x4 sprinter family this fall. Thing looked pleanty high off the ground to me.; Certainly way more clearance than my Astro. they told me they were getting 20mpg. what is this about $200.00 oil changes? i have never owned a diesel? you can't change your own oil on a diesel?
the Fet

climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
Dec 12, 2016 - 03:55pm PT
I think you owe it to yourself to at least check out a truck camper before committing to van. There's lots of love for vans in the climber world but truck campers have some serious pluses (and some minuses too). I looked at vans and truck campers and ended up with a truck camper and I'm glad I went that route.

For two people a van is great.

For a family of 4, trying to live out of a van for a week or more is a recipe for driving each other crazy. My boys are 7 and 15 and it's already getting hectic in our truck camper.

Truck camper pros: you'll get much more for the money. I see people paying $40,000 plus for a van, for that kind of money you could get a really nice used truck + camper with way more room and amenities.
You can take the camper off and have a good 2nd vehicle.
Very capable off road in stock form.
Oil changes, repairs, maintenance can be done anywhere and are cheap. You may need to take of the camper so they can put it on a lift.
The camper can be a guest room at your house.
There's a lot more of them around vs. 4x4 vans, so it's much easier to find a good deal used. Even used 2wd Class B vans cost more for what you get IMO.
You don't have to spend a lot of time working on it and converting it. I see the appeal of building your own rig, it would be fun, but I don't have much spare time and I'd rather spend it doing adventures.
It's nice to have a heater, especially on ski trips. It's nice to have hot water for doing dishes. It's nice to have a ceiling fan which sucks the hot air out. There's lots of amenities, you get right off the bat with a truck camper, that can do without, but once you have them you really appreciate them.

Truck camper minuses: typically slower, worse handling and ride than a van. Some places may charge you more to park. Not as stealth. While driving you are in the cab (must get a crew cab for 4 people IMO) and can't sit a table and play games or otherwise take advantage of the room in back.

I love my camper. If it's raining, or I simply come down from a climb and want lunch, it's great to have a comfortable, relatively roomy place to hang out. Easily get stuff out of the fridge and make lunch. Go to the bathroom, etc.
kev

climber
A pile of dirt.
Dec 12, 2016 - 06:49pm PT
You asked what's involved in a bad ass conversion?

Here's a couple of videos...

[Click to View YouTube Video]

[Click to View YouTube Video]

Plus an awesome handling vid...

[Click to View YouTube Video]

And a 1 day conversion vid

[Click to View YouTube Video]
hooblie

climber
from out where the anecdotes roam
Dec 12, 2016 - 08:12pm PT
nutagain!, i can read past your screen name. you're not a yahoo. here's an exclusive:

you're just 9 hours west of here. there's a myriad of forks in the dirt roads, at any compass
heading and it's a wide horizon, plus a couple paved ones to williams, the south rim, and flagstaff. choose any long weekend, bring your kit, it's a cargo van (there's a passenger seat, has fuzzy paneling over insulated walls and ceiling, and not much else. couple 6' long toolboxes if you want) it's not for sale ... ever again, (thanks, Mike. it's perfect!) but i'll top it up and hand you the keys ... after a few days, you refill it (diesel) and leave a case of castrol GTX high-mileage 10W-30 (for other rigs.)

it's a quigley, comes with a few pinstripes, and i can rinse the mud.



a weekend test drive will help.
(928) sixthirtyfive oh-oh 69
early AMs, ask for hooblie

~~~~

afterwards, you can take the unconverted e250 out for a much less
cumbersome romp. maybe a locker rearend like pud's is about right
climbingcoastie

Ice climber
Wasilla, AK
Dec 12, 2016 - 09:23pm PT
Not sure if you're against Chevy, but haven't seen you mention a new Chevy/GMC with a Quigely conversion.

Quigely uses OEM parts off 4x4 trucks (for all makes) except for a couple machined parts that make the two compatible. So any mechanic can work on them.
i'm gumby dammit

Sport climber
da ow
Dec 12, 2016 - 10:36pm PT
Talked to a 4x4 sprinter family this fall. Thing looked pleanty high off the ground to me.; Certainly way more clearance than my Astro. they told me they were getting 20mpg. what is this about $200.00 oil changes? i have never owned a diesel? you can't change your own oil on a diesel?
They (or at least ours) take EXACTLY 9.5 quarts and they recommend high quality synthetic oil. So your looking at roughly $60 for the oil and then disposing of 9.5 quarts as well. Plus the filter, etc.
NutAgain!

Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Dec 12, 2016 - 10:50pm PT
Dayum Hooblie, that's a mighty fine offer!!! You got the hamster wheel a turnin' in my head and trying to figure out when I can make it happen with you. I'll follow up w/ you. Since I'm a Prius-drivin' wannabe, it's hard for me to know where the line is between what I really "need" to get where I want to go, vs. how much I am enslaved by the fantasy of bigger/more/gnarlier/go-fartherer.

And Kev, thanks for those ujoint vids. I checked out some of them too late one night last week, imagining my automotively ignorant self painting by numbers watching youtube vids figuring out how to do the work or making better buddies with a local mechanic... How to know I'm in over my head from the Ujoint FAQ:
Q. Does the conversion require any special tools?
A. Nothing specific. A 90 degree drill or plasma cutter will make the shackle sleeve install much easier. Welding is required.
Yeah. Plasma cutter. Do you have to be careful to not cross the beams?

In theory it all can be learned even by someone like me... the question is how much do I want to dedicate to learning it now, what else am I willing to give up to learn it, and how likely is my marriage to survive it? So I'd probably better not get the do-it-yourself kit for now. Maybe after building some credibility with finishing projects and dumping a few major life responsibilities ;)

But I am seriously investigating the Ujoint guy vs. AgileOffroad. Seems to be a major difference in approaches, with the Twin Traction Beam used by AgileOffroad and their tuning for high-speed offroad, vs. the straight axle approach of Ujoint. The Ujoint approach seems less complex, which would seem to indicate more bomber. But those Baja races of the AgileOffroad folks would probably lead to a bomber setup too. One alarm bell raised by the Ujoint vid: they disabled the Roll Stability Control from Ford which is not a street-Kosher thing to do, but they were showing high performance street driving (such as might be required for fast lane changes in Los Angeles freeway traffic).

Again, I appreciate the input from you all. I've always found it gratifying that the more I put myself out there with this community the more I get back.
Jaybro

Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
Dec 13, 2016 - 05:42am PT
For the "Trad Climber" the choice is clear!

labrat

Trad climber
Erik O. Auburn, CA
Dec 13, 2016 - 11:39am PT
The picture above is awesome in so many ways!
Yury

Mountain climber
T.O.
Jan 12, 2017 - 03:24pm PT
One more option:
http://bringatrailer.com/2017/01/11/ex-yellowstone-tour-bus-tracked-1993-chevrolet-sport-van/

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/P9YAAOSwopRYbQIf/s-l1600.jpg
ryanb

climber
Hamilton, MT
Jan 12, 2017 - 04:26pm PT
We have an awd gmc savana passenger van bought last year. We live in Montana so it's gotten a good snow / light off road test.

Ours is a late model ex canadian rental that came down over the border with 50k on it after the canadian dollar crashed, I've seen similar ones all around the north west.

Even with and no lift the thing is absolutely unstoppable in the snow with good tires (came with goodyear wrangler all terrain adventure pros in the stock size). We have about a foot of crusted upside down mank in the lowlands at the moment and it does fine in unplowed spots or breaking through snowplow berms into rural driveways.

The viscous awd does keep some power to the front ( a low percent ...25 or 30 i think) at all times which keeps it predictable for highway driving in variable slush or patchy ice.

Ours also has a rear auto locker ...the only time Its ever kicked in is the one time i did get somewhat stuck (front wheel in a ditch obscured by said berm). I was able to back out easily by spinning the tires a bit until the differential and locker did their thing.

Its fine for summer forest road use too but a little big for brushy trails or for turning around on really narrow spots etc. The short wheelbase compared to an equivalent double cab truck is nice. Ground clearance is fine but not outstanding, a lift and bigger tires would help this but haven't felt the need.

There are a couple of other folks with similar vans in the small town we live in but they've all stuck 4x4 stickers on theirs with or without the t-case swap. Also lots of threads on expedition portal's forums for these vans.

The back seats aren't great (no leg room, no head rest) and I do wish for a high roof sometimes. But there is enough room to sleep sideways with a bed at window height or lengthwise behind the second row seat.

NutAgain!

Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 12, 2017 - 04:47pm PT
^^ Looks like a great setup.

After much research and much discussions with wifey to make sure we are both happy, today we put down a deposit on a Sprinter 4x4 (normal roof 144" wheel base to get a pop-top later). Darn near need a college degree to go through all the options and dependencies for which packages you can build. In the past I've always just bought a "car" without paying attention to all the gismos and options. Somehow I went deep OCD on Sprinter details.

One annoying thing is it's close but not quite wide enough for me to sleep sideways, which makes the furniture layout more challenging. We looked at a company that makes fiberglass flares to pop out the windows a bit, but we want the windows all the way around (and not tiny claustrophobic windows). Wifey wants to pay for a professional build-out because she knows I'm big on vision and come up short on execution sometimes, especially with non-computer things... I'm hoping to sneak in some DIY work or at least closely managed outsourcing as part of the build-out. Adventures ahead!
NutAgain!

Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Jan 12, 2017 - 05:20pm PT
I won't have it until June to start tweaking it, but I'll be reviewing what you've done in more detail. I can see how getting into all the build details can become a hobby unto itself.
hooblie

climber
from out where the anecdotes roam
Jan 12, 2017 - 05:42pm PT
congratulations! those are some mighty handsome rigs, the centerpiece of a wonderful lifestyle ...
and two (or a bunch of) happy campers tucked inside ... outstanding. i admire your family ways
the Fet

climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
Jan 19, 2017 - 09:31pm PT
Some good ideas for a van build out here: http://www.reef.com/blog/van-life-cyrus-sutton-part-2.html
August West

Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
Jan 20, 2017 - 02:54pm PT
I wish we could import microvans into the US.

Dodge used to make them:

Has a truck style suspension. With the short wheel base and no bed hanging off the back, can do as well as a medium sized pickup. Can put bigger wheels on them than what is shown in this picture.

Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jan 20, 2017 - 03:07pm PT
How ya gonna entice that guard dog outta the back of that? If he's legit he ain't gonna go
for the tossed pork chop trick.
Oh, and lemme know where you can find a truck camper small enough for that thang. ;-)
Messages 41 - 60 of total 61 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
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