Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
This thread has been locked
Messages 941 - 960 of total 2140 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Mark Force

Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:08pm PT
Thanks, Craig.

In reference to a previous claim that fascism in a left-leaning politic...

I don't mind people having a different opinion than mine. It's exciting to be convinced by compelling data and a sound argument to adopt a new and different viewpoint and understanding.

I do mind out and out bullsh#t. And, the acceptance of fake news, of not challenging news to have a foundation of fact, is a dangerous trend in our country.

Except for good natured and well executed sh#t talking....that's good bullshit there.
Craig Fry

Trad climber
So Cal.
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:09pm PT
EDIT


Donald Trump's 14 Characteristics of Fascism:

1.Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - "Make America Great Again!"


2.Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Donald's open sanctioning of torture


3.Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - Muslims or Mexicans take your pick.


4.Supremacy of the Military - Plans to spend more on the military


5.Rampant Sexism - Donald's sexism is a matter of public record


6.Controlled Mass Media - Donald is advocating being able to sue any media outlet that writes something bad about him.


7.Obsession with National Security - Donald has played the terrorism card over and over again.


8.Religion and Government are Intertwined - Donald frequently questions the faith of his opponents and has even had a fight with the Pope over faith.


9.Corporate Power is Protected - One look at Donald's economic plans will show you that.


10.Labor Power is Suppressed - Donald favors taking down the unions.


11.Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - In fairness Donald shows a lot of disdain these are just among them


12.Obsession with Crime and Punishment - A major part of his campaign


13.Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - Appointing family members and friends to cabinet positions


14.Fraudulent Elections - Donald may be directly involved with Russia and his party is frequently responsible for fraudulent elections and stealing voter's rights.


http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm
EdwardT

Trad climber
Retired
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:16pm PT
The qualities listed as being a sign of powerful nationalism, such as the prominent display of flags, patriotic slogans, pride in the military, demands for national unity, etc, are incredibly common to any country with a strong national identity. Indeed, you will find these qualities not only in Fascist regimes, but also in modern America, Mexico, much of Europe, many South American and African nations, Russia, China, Japan and numerous other first and third world countries. You will also find them in virtually all of the nations which stood opposed to Fascism in WWII. As such, this Warning Sign as written by Britt himself is completely useless in determining Fascism, as these “powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism” are generally more common than they are not in any nation with a flag.
guyman

Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:23pm PT
Crag Fry.... good to see you posting again. Welcome back.

Mark Force

Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:30pm PT
Craig, You took me wrong. I am genuinely thanking you for posting that material on fascism. It does conform to my understanding of that particular politic. See my post on the first paragraph from the Wiki on fascism.

The bullshit I was referring to wasn't yours.
Craig Fry

Trad climber
So Cal.
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:34pm PT
Is the U.S. a Fascist Society?
Fascism is a Political Economic Structure Which Serves Corporate Interests



By Danny Haiphong

Global Research, March 14, 2015
Most Americans are taught in school that fascism is a ruthless one party dictatorship, the most popular example being Nazi Germany. This is a misconception. Fascism is a political economy, not merely a political system that existed in one moment of history. Fascism, as defined by Black revolutionary and assassinated political prisoner George Jackson, is the complete control of the state by monopoly capital. Fascism is the last stage of capitalism in the heart of the US imperial center where the relationship between the state and corporation becomes indiscernible. A difficult, but necessary, task for the left in this period is to acknowledge that fascism is the system of rule in the United States.

The privatization of the public sector, de-unionization of the entire labor force, and violent austerity are the seeds of domestically grown fascism in the economic realm. Such fascist activity has brought about the rapid decline of political and economic conditions for the working class and the rapid accumulation of wealth and profit for the ruling class. Workers are doing more and more on the job for less and less pay. The jobless are either searching desperately for work or not searching at all. Shelters are overflowing and turning the homeless away. The US has 25 percent of the world’s prisoners despite only possessing 5 percent of the world’s population. Mass joblessness, poverty, imprisonment, and homelessness are material forces that breed fear and competition amongst the working class.

The paradox of fascism lies in its ability to sustain and grow in the midst of deteriorating conditions for the majority of the population. The racist foundation of this country is useful in this regard. The white working class steadfastly defends its privileges obtained from white imperial pillage of Black and indigenous people both here and abroad. The white ruling class maintains unity with the white working class because, although exploitation has heightened for everyone, Black and indigenous people (including undocumented immigrants) remain economically and socially oppressed to a much harsher degree than Whites. To ensure racism does not precipitate a radical struggle between white supremacy and Black freedom, the US ruling class has molded and trained a Black political class. This class of neo-colonial elites, with Barack Obama leading the way, works in the interests of fascism by protecting the rule of the white ruling class while teaching the entire Black community that Black faces in high imperial places is not only desired, but also worthy of staunch defense.

Furthermore, fascism relies on a racist enforcement arm to control the political direction of the oppressed. The expanded surveillance and military state that currently spies, detains, and wiretaps the 99 percent remains more dangerous and repressive for the Black community. The vast majority of wiretaps, police and vigilante murders, and stop-and-frisks happen to Black and brown people. So instead of joining forces with the Black community to build a powerful movement, exploited white Americans can still rely on the state to enforce racism on its behalf.

The US corporate media and education system provide the ideological chains of fascism. In this period, both systems serve as mouthpieces for US imperial ambitions, values, and behaviors. Fascism is normalized in the American mind through the inculcation of racism, individualism, and a depoliticized and inaccurate conception of history and politics. The US education system conditions the oppressed and oppressors into their positions in society. Black and indigenous youth attend factory schools that emphasize obedience to authority, which instills a dehumanized and subservient disposition for a future in low-wage work or prison. From K-12, Black working class youth are taught to “pledge allegiance” to the flag of genocide and colonialism in over-crowded, police-occupied, and privatized schools. White youth “pledge allegiance” in better-funded schools more capable of conditioning them into positions of power. However, all youth are taught a mythological version of US history that applauds white supremacy, colonialism, and capitalist development as “freedom” and “democracy.”

The corporate media, despite being far more monopolized than the US school system, provides a more diverse means of education. Corporations like CNN and the New York Times habitually lie about the facts of political events to protect the white ruling class and its institutions from accountability. Corporate hip-hop, music, and television entertainment compliment corporate news syndicates by doping the mind full of mindless garbage. It matters little if the media of choice is watching “Scandal”, listening to Nicki Minaj on the radio, or reading the Washington Post. The boardrooms of five corporations are manufacturing consent to the US fascist system. Malcolm X succinctly summarized the function of the corporate media when he said “if you are not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.”

http://www.globalresearch.ca/is-the-us-a-fascist-society-examining-the-existence-of-fascism-in-the-united-states/5377146

There is a certain percentage of fascist people in any population, including America (20-30%), they are your typical GOP voter. When these people get power, they promote fascism.

Almost all of these people are right wingers,
There is little or almost zero Fascism of the left, the very definition of a liberal is anti-fascist.
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:53pm PT
The 14 Characteristics of Fascism

Excellent post.




Look like this one was written for Dingus:

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2016/12/14/despite-being-taken-fact-case-against-russia-rests-insufficient-proof
dirtbag

climber
Dec 14, 2016 - 02:59pm PT
I think his connection with religion is tenuous but other than that he matches quite a few of those characteristics.

Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Dec 14, 2016 - 03:05pm PT
Dr. F: Nice to see your posts. Whatever got you banned (if that's what happened), please refrain, we need your intellect.
Craig Fry

Trad climber
So Cal.
Dec 14, 2016 - 03:12pm PT
I was never banned
I was tortured by deplorable bullies who will never be banned
so I took some time off

I can't deal with the deplorables,
I can't stand the way they treat others, it's deplorable

They are unredeemable
souls lost to fascism I guess
dirtbag

climber
Dec 14, 2016 - 03:58pm PT
Is that why it happened? The Bering land bridge?
dirtbag

climber
Dec 14, 2016 - 04:10pm PT
Gud one! Damned Russians!
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Dec 14, 2016 - 04:37pm PT
The Fascists and Nazis were leftists. That's why they threw the communists, socialists and labor leaders in the concentration camps first. That's why they fought on Franco's side in the Spanish civil war, because they're leftists.

Right.
Escopeta

Trad climber
Idaho
Dec 14, 2016 - 05:28pm PT
Hopefully you can control yourself this time.

Evidence to the contrary.....
wilbeer

Mountain climber
Terence Wilson greeneck alleghenys,ny,
Dec 14, 2016 - 05:36pm PT
You always have problems with definitions......lol
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Dec 14, 2016 - 07:50pm PT
“When I use a word,” Escopeta said in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” “The question is,” said Escopeta, “which is to be master – – that's all.”
nah000

climber
no/w/here
Dec 14, 2016 - 08:13pm PT
it seems to be a time of reconciliation, so i'll bite...

Esco wrote a few posted moons ago: "Do you think it will be different than the fascism our politicians have been pursuing for the last 30 years or so? Your comment would imply that fascism is new to our country, the liberals have been following much of the tenets of Mussolins fascism and Hitler's national socialism for some time now."

no disrespect intended, but maybe you should reread what i wrote, as i don't think i implied that fascism is new to the u.s. at all...

i was actually intending to imply exactly the opposite.

the only thing that has changed is that the lunch is now naked: the wife beater and sweat pants have been taken off...

anybody who thinks that fascism [ie. authoritarian nationalism] is new to the u.s. hasn't read a history of the c.i.a.'s violent and [long-term] destabilizing track record throughout almost all of the world [to name one of the more important examples]...

and anybody who thinks that obeezy was a respite from the u.s.' history of globalized fascism either doesn't a. understand the consensus meaning of fascism or b. doesn't understand that obeezy claims to get lists of people who he then, without any future required transparency and therefore any real accountability, chooses who should be murdered by remotely controlled drone [to name one of the more important examples]...

the main points that i disagree with in your comments are that you seem to be arguing that it is just liberals [when on a world stage, you are sorely mistaken] and that it has only been the past thirty years [it's been at least sixty: the c.i.a. was provably and violently undermining other nation's free will in central america, in the middle east and etc. in favour of american business interests from at least the mid 50s]



"A rose by any other name...... you know why you have to use the "neo" modifier right?"

yes. the neo was chosen intentionally.

what trump is subscribing to should not be considered "fascism" as the full and generally held definition [at least according to the sources i subscribe to] starts with a "system of government"

the u.s.' system of governance - as a whole - is not fascist.

there are some checks and balances.

and so maybe rather than neo-fascism, i should have gone with something like partial-fascism or maybe the more poetic embryonic-fascism...

regardless: yes. using fascism [at this point in the u.s.' history] without a modifier would be histrionic...



which is why i'm interested to see the american people's response to what must inevitably come down the pipe, when every single proposed member [to date] of the president elect's cabinet and inner circle is:
a. an incompetent noob who is only there due to their loyalty or donations
b. a billionaire who has helped trump's business interests in the past
c. a hard line authoritarian who thinks they know what is best for other humans
d. some combination of a. b. and/or c.



anybody who dismisses me as someone who is exaggerating for politically motivated effect isn't paying close enough attention.

if anything i'm trying to be somewhat open-minded.



but facts are sometimes a bitch.
JC Marin

Trad climber
CA
Dec 14, 2016 - 08:17pm PT
On the plus side...haven't heard about Benghazi for over a month.
nah000

climber
no/w/here
Dec 14, 2016 - 08:18pm PT
^^^^^

hahahahaha...

thanks for that...
nah000

climber
no/w/here
Dec 14, 2016 - 08:44pm PT
^^^^

you say tom-ah-toe...

i say tom-ay-toe.
Messages 941 - 960 of total 2140 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
 
Our Guidebooks
spacerCheck 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks

guidebook icon
Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Recent Route Beta