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gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
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Aug 30, 2015 - 09:21pm PT
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could be, dmr, but theres no sense in drilling a 4" deep 3/8" hole to put a 5'16" diameter bolt into. The last thing you want with an anchor subject to multi directional stress is play between the bolt and the hole. If the anchoring portion is 4" deep and you have 1/16" play at the lip of the hole then you have substantial levering, which multiplies the shear stress i want to say 2(D x L) but not sure. Anyway, slop in the hole compounds stress and allows levering action on the anchor sleeve, so why would you use that style bolt? A good concrete or rock anchor is pounded in then tightened to pull up the sleeve and expand the maleable metal into the rock, cinching it tight, no wiggle. But to say it again, the technical part doesnt mean a thing when the bolts come out with 1/2 turn of the wrench and fingers.
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dmr
Social climber
Carlsbad, CA
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Aug 30, 2015 - 09:22pm PT
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These are above what I think is Too Little Too Late (from Ron's '91 topo). However, the orientation of the "hangers" are in the opposite direction. I think I remember a single rusty, threaded stud near the top of a vertical face with a few small knobs.
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mtwoodsonguide
Trad climber
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Aug 30, 2015 - 10:14pm PT
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ok Ron your right, no big deal, relax.
I wasn't questioning the location of the bolts, who put them in, or the quality of the installation. You made the statement "These bolts are ungraded" but I could faintly see markings in one of your pictures and they sure looked like Rawl to me.
Seeing the heads, we know the grade is 8.8 which is medium carbon steel quenched and tempered. Pretty equivalent to SAE grade 5. Min tensile strength is 116,000 psi vs. 120,000 psi for a SAE grade 5
Obviously they're metric....and now i am concerned as well. It ain't like you can pick up Metric SDS bits at home depot.
I was told they also replaced the bolt on Ricks Ramp? or Ricks slab? the 5.9 one just down hill from here, and a second bolt was added. If the bolts you removed were questionable these may be as well.
If there is any doubt the holes should be redrilled. A 1/2" SDS bit will eat up all the pieces still in the hole. I have stainless 1/2" bolts for anyone competent
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gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
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Aug 31, 2015 - 10:24am PT
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No prob woodson guy, you probably could have stopped short of crying slander but its all good :)
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gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
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Aug 31, 2015 - 10:36am PT
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Bobby, that crack is in a hidden corridor in the hippie hang area. As you head towards the switch back where the trail to .ca night starts, jump off the road to the right (east), wander north for a few yards and behold a wonderland of rock we never saw bitd. I would have been working those rocks like a fiend if I had known.
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gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
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Aug 31, 2015 - 10:43am PT
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Dmr, ppl were working an outrageous overhanging project in the direction of pull of those bolts, but they were responsible climbers. The chain link hangers require the bolt to protrude way above the lip of the hole such makes the whole anchor weaker, and slamming in that many makes no sense.
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Scattergun
Trad climber
Encinitas
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Aug 31, 2015 - 09:18pm PT
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Dear John Weinberg and Ron and all of you. I accept that there is, understatement, a lot of miss information and a lot of angry stuff. I just want to say sorry to all. I do not react well in angry situations where I am backed into a corner. And yes I have gotten a lot miss information about John Weinberg as a person that is untrue but which in turn has jaded my reactions. Moving forward, as I said in one of my statements on line, I won't chip any route, I was just angry and I meant that. I am sorry to John and this whole thing and am saying so publicly on Supor Topos in an attempt to make peace. I have given away the drill and will not bolt at all ever. We were naive and did not understand the complexity of this. I have sent John a personal email to confirm my desire to change this.
I will take back all of my reactions and actions now that I understand my role in this including my misunderstanding of John. I am willing to admit my stupid mistakes and change my opinions, truly, and you will see over time that I am a man of my word.
Roger
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Scattergun
Trad climber
Encinitas
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Aug 31, 2015 - 09:36pm PT
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Want to do what's right..........
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Scattergun
Trad climber
Encinitas
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Aug 31, 2015 - 09:46pm PT
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Still Really sorry for miss understanding things. I will be deleting my account now. Sorry again for this fire storm of stuff. Please. Happy Climbing and a public sorry to John Weinberg.
Last,
Roger
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thebravecowboy
climber
The Good Places
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Aug 31, 2015 - 09:51pm PT
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woodson 10d looks soft and the retrobolts sound safe
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Scattergun
Trad climber
Encinitas
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Aug 31, 2015 - 10:43pm PT
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Last post To Ron. Thanks for taking the bolts. I would have done it when it got cooler. Still sorry and I will try better. The world is a complex place.
Thanks,
Roger
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Aug 31, 2015 - 10:55pm PT
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We will forgive you if you upload a video of you eating a spider whole.
Just one, but has to be a big spider. This is where you really gotta step up to the plate. I think life is about making amends and moving on and you gotta eat the spider.
An orb weaver would be pretty cool. Might even get you a date.
Hit up Jaws next tuesday?
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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Jesus Scattergun, if you like climbing at Woodson you are more than welcome here. This thing is just the latest in a long line of Woodson kerfuffles that date back eons. Stay, hang, post awkward and embarrassing photos or yourself and others, and so on. It's what we do. Be still and chill. Don't be a, uh, you know, scatterbrain and ditch out just because you've been honored with a classic Woodson hazing. Grow a pair, sunnyjim!
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skcreidc
Social climber
SD, CA
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^^^^^^^Plus 1000 on that. Even though it's hard to tell sometimes, everyone makes mistakes. It's just part of human nature. Tradition is important in an area. Living in the U.S.A. this is easy to forget, but if you want to see some crazy proud tradition check out the bolt spacing and pro on the Bohemian sandstone.
Hope to run into each of you up there some day, incuding you Roger! It does seem to be cooling off now.
Chris
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Johannsolo
climber
Soul Cal
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Thank you Roger for standing up and taking responsibility. It shows you are trying to do the right thing. Your anonymous cigar smoking buddy, who filled you full of lies and half truths is the one we should be worried about. You're alright in my book and I look foreword to seeing you and climbing with you up at Suicide, Woodson, or anywhere anytime.
John Weinberg
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gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
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Hey Roger, you have proven your character in my book, we all make mistakes, and everyone deserves a second chance, especially if they have the balls to man up like you have. Dont hang your head, you deserve respect for your honesty and humility. It never was personal with me, i just got ticked off when you started the crazy talk about chipping and such, but even that doesnt give me the right to lob random insults, and i apologize for that.
Dont delete your account, no need to beat yourself up. You can have those hangers if you want. Email me at ronamick000@gmail.com (those are zeroes).
Peace
did you really give your drill away? I would of bought it from you. If you still have it, I know of a few unclimbed lines (i chopped a trail to them) that only need an anchor to go. We can put in a couple tr bolts and get you some real FAs. Get ahold of me.
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deepnet
Boulder climber
San Diego
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All is good again!
Thank's Roger!
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gonamok
climber
dont make me come over there
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Oh bBOOb, boulder 13 from a sit start? No duh, the thing is 7 feet tall, if that, theres no way to NOT sit start.
And that aint s hit nigga, back in 79 me and michael paul did The Nose from a sit start. No sh#t beemis, you can look it up.
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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