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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado & Nepal
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Apr 20, 2019 - 04:32pm PT
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Unfortunately, RJ has told us on another thread that they do not have backups. Given the limitations of the system, the only way to delete something is to delete the author entirely so those threads are gone forever.
While I understand now thanks to RJ's many recent explanations, why they took the action they did, what I condemn is the fact that it was done without any previous warning so no one else could preserve those historic threads either. This has happened three times now in the past few years, each time with more draconian results. There is no guidance from management until a crisis is perceived and then without warning, to quote DMT, one of the participants eliminated, "the hammer of God comes down".
Personally I would have thought a warning followed by a three day grace period to download what we wanted would have been a much better way to handle it.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Outside the Asylum
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Apr 20, 2019 - 09:07pm PT
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Jan, I agree with you - a little notice would have helped, and been less draconian. An opportunity for people to copy/store important and useful threads. But that may not have been possible, perhaps due to a short fuse demand and/or settlement.
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WBraun
climber
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Apr 20, 2019 - 09:52pm PT
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No big loss at all.
Get a real life.
If you don't wake up soon you'll be in for a big surprise soon .....
You'll all come back devolved in your next lives as monkeys swinging from trees!
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Apr 20, 2019 - 09:59pm PT
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True that, WB.
Except I'm going to be the monkey swinging from your tree.
And we'll all be pissing on the urinal made of that guy with the animal nickname. Even trees!
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David Knopp
Trad climber
CA
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Apr 21, 2019 - 01:16pm PT
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Jonnyrig what do you mean? that we ignored the instructions, or failed to back up? Jus askin.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 22, 2019 - 05:12pm PT
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I regret not making pdf backups of more historical threads before they got destroyed. I talked about doing it. I encouraged others to do it. I intended to do it myself. But then I never quite got around to it.
Chris McNamara owns the servers. It's his right to delete things willy-nilly. I just wish we'd been given more warning before the historical threads were shredded.
But in all fairness, the handwriting was on the wall for around five years now. We knew the direction things were going.
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
moving thru
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Apr 22, 2019 - 05:34pm PT
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I think I kinda get what WBraun is saying.....but maybe not.
We can do everything we can to save, value and treasure the past, which is good, but life happens. Those things may vanish like the Notre Dame Cathedral and the many relics and works of art. So live today, that way when we lose the past we still have the most important thing, our life and living it.
Loosely interpreted. :)
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Don Lauria
Trad climber
Bishop, CA
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Apr 22, 2019 - 06:16pm PT
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With regard to jogill's comment:
All young climbers will eventually be old climbers. So we should make them aware that "it may be the latest" but it will become "old hat". So young climbers, "Have respect for your elders", as you will soon become one.
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Delhi Dog
climber
Good Question...
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Apr 23, 2019 - 06:06am PT
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Thought this was relevant to the discussion especially the take on the then-vs-now around the 4 min mark onward.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2019 - 01:49pm PT
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Just saw this...
RJ: The authors of historic climbing content posted on SuperTopo should please take steps to relocate it somewhere else soon since it cannot really be assured of long-term viability here. If we didn't realize that a month ago, or 7 years ago when Chris made the comment you refer to, we certainly realize it today. SuperTopo has just never been designed or resourced to provide a safe, sustainable home for climbing history content. I think that good intentions need to give way to the reality that climbing history, and the proper vetting and preservation of that climbing history, begs for more functionality and resources than SuperTopo is able to provide.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 28, 2019 - 01:54pm PT
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A post from Chris McNamara on February 10, 2012.
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=1747712&msg=1747712#msg1747712
Underlining added by me for emphasis. Otherwise, this is verbatim, but see the link for the full text.
What can I say? I guess people change. Priorities change. Old promises get forgotten.
Chris McNamara:
My Three Goals for SuperTopo Forum in 2012; what are yours?
Many thanks to everyone who contributed to the Improve SuperTopo 2012 Thread. That is, and will hopefully continue to be, a great place to post concrete, fix-it style improvements for the SuperTopo Forum.
Now here more generally is what I hope the SuperTopo Forum can achieve – the overall feel of the Taco.
1) Inspire, educate and humor each other
As I see it this is the whole point of the Forum; what the Forum is on its best days. There are a lot of amazing people here from wildly different backgrounds. It’s great how many different styles of information come forth, from people sharing wild winter ascents in the High Sierra to how to make the ultimate van conversion.
2) Preserve history
A lot of Historical Gold has been posted here from Yosemite, Colorado, Alaska and around the world. I love the fact that a web search for old climbing history often directs the searcher to the SuperTopo Forum. Best of all, many of the people who made that history post here! Some people have asked if this historical stuff is safe here. Answer: Yes. We have been around since 2000 (the Stone Age in climbing Forum time) and are not going anywhere. We have a business model learned from living in Camp 4: even with low income, you can always keep your expenses even lower. (And grab leftover pizza from the Curry Deck when necessary).
3) Have the most open home for discussion on the Internet
For good or bad, SuperTopo is the least moderated, least categorized, least divided up forum out there. One page, simple layout, post em' if ya got em' That is what people love and hate about the Forum, myself included.
...
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Dave
Mountain climber
the ANTI-fresno
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Apr 28, 2019 - 02:39pm PT
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So much for that... ^^^
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