solo aid anchors

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Rhodo-Router

Gym climber

Otto, NC

Aug 23, 2006 - 11:26am PT

It is possible to butterfly to the subsequent piece(s) in such a way that the load is equally shared by both the ground anchor and the subsequent piece. Takes some fiddling, certainly, but it it possible.

Toker Villain

Big Wall climber

Toquerville, Utah

Aug 23, 2006 - 01:31pm PT

Rhodo, why bother? It still raises the fall factor.

With slings one can "lower" the intermediate knots so that they are not immediately loaded but rather used as a backup.
Less fiddling and far better function.

imnotclever

climber

Aug 23, 2006 - 02:26pm PT

I'd bet he's a little more concerned with gound fall than FF2 in this case.

Jeffo

Trad climber

Virginia

Aug 23, 2006 - 02:52pm PT

Imnotclever....ground fall vs. factor 2 fall....hmmm....what to choose. How about NEITHER. If the first piece is only 8-10' off the deck, there's not enough rope stretch at that point to justify clove hitchin the first piece. And even if there was...build your anchor closer to the base of the climb rather than twenty feet away on a rock.

piquaclimber

Trad climber

Durango

Aug 23, 2006 - 04:27pm PT

Rhoto,

That's exactly what I did. Except that I used cloves instead of butterflies and I think I only cloved one or two pieces instead of a few. I pulled the stretch out of the rope and then tied the clove to the first piece so that there was already tension between the blob of rock and the first bolt and they would hopefully share the load to some degree.

I did this because
A) I didn't trust the rock blob or the first bolt enough to trust either one alone as my anchor.

B) The first pitch is a bolt ladder (albeit manky) and my next piece (and every other piece on the pitch) was not more than an arms reach away from the second or third steps. While this may not lesson the fall factor for the first few placements, it meant that they would be relatively short falls.

C) There are very few options for a rope solo anchor at the base of this route.

Imnotcleaver hit the nail on the head for what I was most worried about.

Brad

Here are the rest of the pictures if you're interested...

Prod

Social climber

Charlevoix, MI

Sep 4, 2008 - 09:26pm PT

Bump.

Good thread.

PTPP, That continous loop thing seems complex, what are the advantages to it? Please note I have only soloed 50' c1 kind of stuff.

Prod.

Captain...or Skully

Big Wall climber

up Yonder (the edge of Treason)

Sep 4, 2008 - 11:49pm PT

That's a perfectly GOOD 'blob' of rock there, boyo.....many desert anchors involve such, get used to it.......you did increase your fall factor with your 'pucker factor' antics....Good luck, & buy a Stratos........You may yet live.

Dr. Rock

Ice climber

Castle Rock

Sep 5, 2008 - 01:31am PT

Thanks for the bump, awesome thread.

Those Kilmster knots can be dialed in by using them for a while so that he webbing gets kind of a funk built up.

You know, a combination of sweat, dirt, pine sap, bonus jack residue from under the seat, vomit, urine, insect repellent, rat turds, bat guaca, you get me?

Then you can really "set" that knot a lot better than if it were virgin webbing.
And the set will not loosen from the rope jangling around.
There is a natural tendency for the knot to loosen over time if it's fresh nylon.

MisterE

Trad climber

My Inner Nut

Nov 22, 2008 - 11:01pm PT

Bump for a great knot from Ultrabiker, in case you missed it

healyje

Trad climber

Portland, Oregon

Nov 23, 2008 - 03:03am PT

The only way I'd even consider using that knot would be to first run the 'tail' loop through the other two before clipping it.

crossman04

Trad climber

san diego, ca

Apr 26, 2009 - 10:47am PT

This is a phenominal thread. Rare one on ST where i actually learned something and it wasn't just people rambling.

Studly

Trad climber

Apr 26, 2009 - 11:14am PT

Thanks for resurrecting this thread. Great info all around! and I learned something new, a equalizing figure 8. Now I got to go out and try it, sweet.

Steve Grossman

Trad climber

Seattle, WA

Apr 26, 2009 - 11:16am PT

No love for the clove hitch.....I simply don't get it. My system is too simple to describe here. LOL

Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber

Sprocketville

Apr 26, 2009 - 12:57pm PT

It's HiFi that hangs from bomber piece.

Not FiFi.
What the hell's a FiFi anyway?
A gay poodle from China?

SeanC

Trad climber

Redlands, CA

Apr 12, 2012 - 09:41pm PT

Bump for a great thread!

PTPP said...

You will also notice I put LONG "prusik" [really Klemheist] loops into the lead rope every thirty feet or so to take the weight of the lead rope so it doesn't slide back through your Grigri. You need to make these prusiks long so that if you fall, the rope stretch doesn't pull upward on the piece it's clipped to. This isn't really a problem, though, since the Klemheist is a one-way knot, and the lead rope slips through. This I *have* tested in falls!

The klemheist loops seem like a much safer alternative to cloving into bomber pieces, but if you are 100+ feet up a pitch wouldn't you need a VERY long loop (even longer than a double length sling) to ensure the rope stretch won't pull upward on the piece?