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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Feb 24, 2014 - 12:01pm PT
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I'm a proud liberal.
A gun-owning, hunting, fishing, served in the military, worked for the military, employed, started working at 15, tax paying, never received public benefits, paid my own way, proud liberal.
I support EQUAL rights, not codified discrimination against gays, women, people of color or any other group. I support separation of church and state and intelligent gun controls like background checks, waiting periods, and mag capacity limits. I don't believe "corporations are people, my friends".
I believe there is, and will always be, a need for welfare and public assistance. I believe there will always be a group of lazy ass people leeching off the public...half desperately poor living in ghettos, the other half plutocrats living in mansions and buying our tax policy via lobbyists and politicians. I believe I'd rather pay taxes to keep the poor 1% in food and housing, than pay a lot more to keep them in prison once they steal and rob to get food or basic needs.
I believe substance abuse and addiction is a public health issue, not a criminal one and that prohibition enables black market gangsters. I believe that most, but not everything benefits from capitalism...there is no f*#king innovation in constructing actuarial tables, and thus a public option for health insurance should the minimum, though single payer would be better.
I believe Jamie Dimon, Hank Paulson, Lloyd Blanfein and their ilk should swing from the gallows or face the guillotine. I believe the cowards George Bush, Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, and Bill Kristol should be next after the bankers...except their arms and legs should go in the guillotine instead of their heads, so they can see what it's like for all the young soldiers permanently maimed in service of their vanity war, after those chickshit as#@&%es avoided service or straight up deserted when they had the chance to fight themselves.
I believe no child should go hungry in this country, regardless of how useless their parents might be. I believe 99% of people want to work, and that Mitt Romney's boys and Paris Hilton can lower thenmselves to drive a Porshe instead of a Bentley when their inheritance is taxed. I believe abortion is between a woman, her doctor, and her own beliefs or conscience, not some outsider and their imaginary sky-man. I believe freely available birth control is the best way to reduce abortions. I believe any theocrat whining about abortion should show me how many kids he's adopted or STFU.
I believe the modern GOP is controlled by their looniest fringe..the Plutocrats, Theorcrats, and BatshitoCrat xenophobes, in a way the left has not been in my lifetime. So yes, I am a proud liberal. Who has been right a hell of a lot more than I've been wrong.
The Tea-oh-P can go f*#k itself.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Feb 24, 2014 - 12:08pm PT
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drum circle full of liberals dropping acid again
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John M
climber
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:04pm PT
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great post elcap..
you too steve. Sorry if I jumped to conclusions.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:08pm PT
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ok, so let us now hear from some forum conservatives what they "oppose" in ElCap's post
must be lots of it...
ready, set, go!
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:12pm PT
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liberals are taking away the public lands
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ncrockclimber
climber
The Desert Oven
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:13pm PT
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+1000 for ElCap! Great Post! It should be reposted frequently as a rebuttal to the right-wing rants.
Cheers!
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:18pm PT
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liberals are taking away the public lands
really? prove your belief by presenting the differing legislations championed by, voted on,
and signed into law by both Democratic and Republican administrations that "take away public lands"
should not take too long for you as you have already examined the data prior to conclusion
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:19pm PT
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That is so spot on, EC. I'm going to share it, if you don't mind (if you prefer otherwise, I won't, though).
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philo
Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:20pm PT
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ECIYA, I wish I could shake your hand for so well and eloquently stating a clearer perspective of what so many of US agree about.
Now for the irrational, mouth breathing, science denying, knuckle dragging, corporate shills of the neoconservative, born again, tea bagging whitewing I give you this motivational meme as encouragement to keep trying desperately to hide from the truth.
You can do it.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:20pm PT
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hurry.... Norton has fallen and can't get up!
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:21pm PT
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I cant SIDE with either
really Ron, can't side with either"?
ElCap has presented what "liberals" want and believe to be true
I find it hard to believe that you personally would disagree with ElCap's above post
but I guess you do as you cannot make up your mind
so, can I invite you to at least tell us all the parts you don't agree with in his post?
why aren't you a liberal also, Ron?
I am, and damn proud of the principles I believe in
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wilbeer
Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
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Feb 24, 2014 - 05:29pm PT
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Great post Elcap!
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 06:02pm PT
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Pyro posts a picture of a guy on the ground and then says that I have fallen?
that all you got, Pyro?
guess so, because when challenged to back up your public lands statement you could not do it, so instead, like a third grader, your come back reply is to post an irrelevant picture
weak, gee can I assume you voted for Caribou Barbie to be one heartbeat away from being Commander in Chief of the US Armed Forces? yeah, I would put money on that
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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Feb 24, 2014 - 07:19pm PT
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Thanks, Elcap. . . for more eloquently putting what I tried to say.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Feb 24, 2014 - 09:17pm PT
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ok, so let us now hear from some forum conservatives what they "oppose" in ElCap's post
must be lots of it...
ready, set, go!
I hate to be picky, but El Cap's post purports to state what he believes. Such a post can be incorrect only if it misstates what he believes, even if the stated beliefs have no basis in fact. Although I haven't met El Cap personally, I have gleaned enough from his posts to have great confidence that what he says he believes, he believes. I therefore see no reason to "oppose" it.
I also have enough respect for his intellect to consider what he says. His are posts I always read, even if I disagree with many of his conclusions, and his trip reports are some of the best on ST.
If I thought it would serve a purpose, I would set forth my own beliefs, but anyone who cares has already read enough to know them. I just want to thank El Cap for setting forth his views in a way that is respectful, articulate and worthy of consideration, even by those of us who disagree.
John
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bigbird
climber
WA
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Feb 24, 2014 - 10:15pm PT
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Why are we even having this conversation on a climbing forum?
In any case the culture wars are largely over. Even Mitt Romney's former campaign advisor in Iowa admitted....
“Younger people want to move past the old arguments on the culture wars. Frankly, the culture wars are over and Republicans largely lost.”
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 10:30pm PT
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I've not done any research but have a wild guess that some liberal might have closed one of my favorite hangouts.
hey, its ok pyro...I understand
I just tend to take people seriously when they make definitive statements that are not true
,,in the present age of the internet when it takes only a few minutes to get the facts right
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 10:36pm PT
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If I thought it would serve a purpose, I would set forth my own beliefs, but anyone who cares has already read enough to know them.
yes JohnE, we know you consider yourself a conservative and voted for McCain and Romney
but my invitation was to ask forum conservatives, like you, to look carefully at ElCap's statement of what being a "liberal" means to him, and then state exactly what parts of it you oppose, because you know, opposing them liberals is largely what voting Repub is about
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Feb 24, 2014 - 11:07pm PT
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fatty be gone
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