Poor Little Joey

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Messages 21 - 40 of total 351 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
donini

Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
Oct 21, 2013 - 11:13am PT
Yo folks, it's a public forum.......sticks and stones and all that. It the OP deleted it fine, that's his perogative.....anything else has a wisp of censorship.
PSP also PP

Trad climber
Berkeley
Oct 21, 2013 - 11:33am PT
The dude apologized, paid a fine to the Forest Service, is doing community service and planting trees, and has done his best to apologize and make things right short of magically repairing the tree. Certainly what he did wasn't right at all, and I'm not condoning it, but to continue excoriating a guy with such vehemence, all because you like the ugly, spiteful flavor of bringing someone down and watching them fall, is somewhat monstrous and grotesque, if not just pathetic. (But that's what this forum is, right? Despite the above message from Chris Mc.)




What was the fine? Where is he doing community service ? how long? what is it?

What is truly monstrous and grotesque is chopping down a juniper for a silly ass mini sport route.

As part of the climbing community I want to know it isn't covered up and white washed. The thread is probably very embarrassing for the perpetrators; they should be embarrassed and ashamed. IMO if the fine is less than $10,000 it isn't enough. The fine should be made public so other potential tree hackers know there is money involved . Money seems to motivate people.
all in jim

climber
Oct 21, 2013 - 11:59am PT
It's good that thread is gone for the reason that an innocent man's name was prominent in the title. Ethan didn't chop the tree, yet he was dragged into the flames as if he had.
RtM

climber
DHS
Oct 21, 2013 - 12:24pm PT
Disappointed to say the least, that Supertopo decided to help in concealing this very important topic from public view.

I have to assume now that Supertopo.com, the owners of Supertopo.com, as well as the sponsors of Supertopo.com consider the incident to be an acceptable practice in the sport.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 21, 2013 - 12:29pm PT
you know what they say about assumptions..
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HBRKRNH
Oct 21, 2013 - 12:38pm PT
perhaps his "route" should be pulled,,bolts chopped , holes filled. Fruits of the crime should never be left. That is what the Judge used to tell me.

Shouldnt be hard to do, just aid it in yur third/forth steps lol!
Ain't no flatlander

climber
Oct 21, 2013 - 12:46pm PT
All In Jim, your buddy Ethan Pringle is just as guilty as the chopper. He was there, he condoned the action, and he refuses to even admit it was a "mistake." Kinder lies in his apology but Pringle doesn't even have the balls to answer. Pathetic.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 21, 2013 - 12:49pm PT
Is there an 'ethical' thread on ST that doesn't devolve into bolt-chopping chest-thumping at some point?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HBRKRNH
Oct 21, 2013 - 12:58pm PT
kunlun_shan

Mountain climber
SF, CA
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:03pm PT
1st post "Trad Larry", it'd be nice to see some evidence of the last 3 parts of your statement, "The dude apologized, paid a fine to the Forest Service, is doing community service and planting trees".

Otherwise, imo, Joe Kinder is still clued as far as respect for nature. Time to write some sponsors. They need to spend this money on educating their climbers, not sponsoring kiddie spray.
John M

climber
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:04pm PT
Disappointed to say the least, that Supertopo decided to help in concealing this very important topic from public view.

Supertopo did not decide to conceal anything. The forum is set up so that if the Original poster deletes his/her post, then the thread can not be posted to anymore. Billygoat was the origninal poster. He/she deleted their first post. It was not a decision of the management.

From this thread..

http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=2051471&tn=100


Seasonal affective disorder... We all get a bit grumpy when the days get short. People seemed psyched to have a whipping boy.

Please speak for yourself Greg. Not everyone on that thread was grumpy. There are certainly a lot of grumpy people on this forum, but there were also a lot of reasonable posts and opinions that I agree with. That doesn't mean that I am grumpy. The guy screwed up. I tend to think his partner shares some blame as he likely knew the guy was going to chop the tree. I also think that his apology was lame. Do I want to hang him for that? Nope.. but he does need to learn how to treat the wilderness if he is going to remain an ambassador for the climbing community. So no.. I don't have a pitchfork out, but I will be paying attention. If that makes me grumpy in your opinion, then I hope that you never have to learn the hard way that when you don't hold someone accountable for their actions, then many often go on to repeat their behavior. Not that I believe that this guy will cut another juniper down. At least not in the West, but he does need to learn the distinctions and understand that there is a difference.

isnt it more accurate to say his sponsors paid his fine?

No.. if they had paid it and paid him his full contract, then yes. but otherwise no.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:07pm PT
You guys are fuking pathetic.

Same old sh#t... a younger climber makes a mistake and you old fuks refuse to accept his apology as sincere because the words he typed didn't meet your standards. Sure he sprays like a rainbird and may come off as insincere, arrogant, and self absorbed... so fuking what... that is the world you/we left us/them. I'll bet my left nut you came off the same way to 50 year old geezers when you were in your 20's.

As the wise elders of our sport, what have you done to educate the younger generations of climber? That's what I thought.
NinjaChimp

climber
someplace in-between
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:08pm PT
Translation, "to hell with reasonable points, you've never posted here!"
donini

Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:15pm PT
mechrist....if a 50 year old is a geezer you better put me in the freezer. Better yet, I think i'll head down to Arizona for some fun in the sun.
Fluoride

Trad climber
West Los Angeles, CA/Joshua Tree
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:19pm PT
"a younger climber makes a mistake"

Mechrist, the guy is almost 30 and has been around climbing for awhile. Certainly not a teenage noob unaware of nature.

He's been around long enough to have known that chopping centuries old trees for the sake of putting up a new climb is not cool. But he knows that now.

This is more about the fact that this story is trying to be whitewashed from the web altogether. Does is not seem weird to you that not only was the original thread nuked but it's now locked so it can't be added to? Just doesn't make sense.

Wade - you hit the nail on the head with your post.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HBRKRNH
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:19pm PT
Wes your funny.. "that is the world we left him in"?>?>?


BULLSHYT boyeeee. We left a world of routes with as little sign of our passing as we could. From fixed gear to cleaning. GET that straight mmmmK?


Now Joey comes along with his five foot bolting lopping trees out of the way as he pleases. An exact OPPOSITE of "save the rock" themes of the 70s early 80s. And LYING in an "apology" is harldy an "apology" -just a list of piss poor excuses.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:21pm PT
So what do you guys want?

What is the acceptable amount of blood-letting to satisfy your thirst?
raymond phule

climber
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:24pm PT

Raymond that some of here called out here to be an arrogant, narcissistic mess of a statement and that those commenting negatively to it on his blog had their comments erased so everything came out as positive and glowing towards his "apology" on it?

I just read some posts on the last two pages a short time the thread where deleted and his apology. I found many posts just ridiculous and it seemed like a mob trying to burn him on the stake. This thread show the same.

I really doubt that he could have written an apology that the mob would have liked.

harryhotdog

Social climber
north vancouver, B.C.
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:24pm PT
Not everyone here wants to beat on Joe, He apologized and I'm sure he regrets his decision to cut that tree,but the main reason for getting this out in the open is to educate people so it doesn't happen again. Is there something wrong with that? It turns a negative event into a positive event.
HighTraverse

Trad climber
Bay Area
Oct 21, 2013 - 01:27pm PT
Climbers have been cutting down trees at various crags around the world for last 40 years, all before there was Instagram, and most of you are none the wiser.
BS and False Equivalence. Particularly in the United States and especially in California.
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