Do you want The Needles to stay open?

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Ksolem

Trad climber

Monrovia, California

Sep 16, 2013 - 03:56pm PT

Is my time better spent signing up for the SSCA or emailing the USFS directly or something else?

Both. Send the OP an email and get on the SSCA member roster. It's free and we just need as many names a possible right now. Then fill out and submit the form I linked above. Maybe make a donation to the Access Fund?

Also there is an organization called the Giant Sequoia National Monument Association which was formed by a variety of user groups to influence the development of the new management plan. I recently joined this group (a $25.00 fee) and will attend their meetings with the goal of bringing awareness of the climbing in the Monument. I'd encourage other climbers to do the same. Their meetings (the next one is on 9-24-13) are attended by the District Ranger and the Forest Supervisor.

JEleazarian

Trad climber

Fresno CA

Sep 16, 2013 - 04:24pm PT

Incredible - in Europe or Canada we would have a climber hut.
One of the most beautiful places in North America in my opinion .

It reflects a different "wilderness" ethic, Riley. I'm sending in my name as soon as I get off this post.

John

jstn

Trad climber

monrovia, ca

Sep 16, 2013 - 04:40pm PT

Joined the SSCA.

Thanks for the heads up on this.

Clint Cummins

Trad climber

SF Bay area, CA

Sep 16, 2013 - 05:18pm PT

Thanks Patrick and Kris,

I joined the SSCA and sent the feedback form to the USFS.

21S05 = Needles Spring Road

pyro

Big Wall climber

Calabasas

Sep 16, 2013 - 05:28pm PT

needles is awesome!
sign me up!

Ken M

Mountain climber

Los Angeles, Ca

Sep 16, 2013 - 08:37pm PT

I am confused.

I have read through the documentation at the FS site, and 21s05 is specifically identified as one of the road LEAST likely to be decommissioned.

You can see it on the map here:

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5435209.pdf

Green are roads that are least likely at risk, red the most likely

21s05 is GREEN.

On top of that, the other roads are nowhere near the needles.

The other roads:

22s50-green
20s79-green
20s53a-does not appear to exist (or is not being evaluated)

What was this, a "bait and switch" designed to fool people into doing something? Is one of those roads the road to someone's private property?????

TGT

Social climber

So Cal

Sep 16, 2013 - 08:47pm PT

22s69 the Dome Rock Road
21s50 to 20s79 to 20s53a the access roads to Hermit Spire
21s50 to 20s71 to 20s81 the access roads to Trilogy (McIntyre Rock)
22s82 the access road from Johnsondale to Elephant Knob, Sentinel Peak, the K and L Wonder Bluffs, the lower Needles, Demon Dome and Merlin Dome.

ALL of those roads are the only access to those climbing areas!

There isn't any private property anywhere near any of them!

You are just demonstrating your ignorance of the area and it's history!

Clint Cummins

Trad climber

SF Bay area, CA

Sep 16, 2013 - 09:00pm PT

Ken,

20s53a-does not appear to exist (or is not being evaluated)

It is likely a typo - should be either 20S53 or 20S63 (to the Hermit) - I'm not sure which. Or maybe it's a spur from 20S53 which is not shown on the map.

The map is encouraging, with the long roads as green and the short spurs as yellow and red.
But still, they might eventually have to choose among the greens, so it seems helpful to vote for the greens that we want to use.

Ksolem

Trad climber

Monrovia, California

Sep 16, 2013 - 09:01pm PT

What was this, a "bait and switch" designed to fool people into doing something? Is one of those roads the road to someone's private property?????

Easy there Ken. The road has not been maintained at all for three years. Last fall two fluke T-Storms pretty much finished it off. The USFS has been letting roads go all over the country, and then waiting to see who, if anyone, squeals. These posts by Patrick and me are, with the counsel of The Access Fund, an effort to pull together climbers to make some noise about this and get noticed. The more the road deteriorates the more it will cost to repair.

FWIW there have already been some productive talks between the AF and District Ranger Stevens Which make it doubly important for climbers to present a unified front on this issue now.

Are you serious that you would accuse an esteemed area local like Patrick Paul of some "bait and switch" scheme? Do you think I am an accomplice to this scheme? And if you actually read the OP you'll see why the other roads at least need a mention. The Needles are not the only worthwhile crag in the area.

rincon

Trad climber

SoCal

Sep 16, 2013 - 09:07pm PT

The OP suggests that access to The Needles is in jeopardy, when in actuality, it isn't. It's a road maintenance issue.

TGT

Social climber

So Cal

Sep 16, 2013 - 09:14pm PT

At some point a permanently locked gate or a bulldozed berm will appear.

don't kid yourself!

Clint Cummins

Trad climber

SF Bay area, CA

Sep 16, 2013 - 09:16pm PT

Access is one of those words which can mean different things.
For example:

"accessible" to folks with standard vehicles

"accessible" to people with special vehicles or extra days to hike in

"illegal to access" = "closed" to everyone

21S05 is part of the standard "access" path which most people use.
The original post seemed pretty clear to me....

Ksolem

Trad climber

Monrovia, California

Sep 16, 2013 - 10:57pm PT

A good argument can be made that the road 21S05 actually benefits The Needles in terms of impact. It enables climbers to set up camp within day-hiking range of the rock. Of course adding a few miles to the approach will not keep all climbers away from the amazing Needles. But instead of car camping at the trail-head and day hiking to the crags, climbers will hike in and camp at The Needles, a pristine area which will not stand up well to this kind of use. The development of campsites and fire rings, and the problem of human waste will degrade this unique area.

Josh Higgins

Trad climber

San Diego

Sep 17, 2013 - 10:20am PT

I ran a lap on Romantic Warrior two days ago with some friends. It would be so sad to see access to the Needles impacted. I LOVE that place! I spread the word amongst friends, and notified the Allied Climbers of San Diego to spread the word as well!

Josh Higgins