Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 561 - 580 of total 1004 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Sep 5, 2013 - 09:37am PT
I don't trust his [Obama's] competence ,his experience , or judgement in these matters.


So who's competence, experience, and judgement do you trust?

Romney?

McCain?

It's easy to be a critic, not so easy to name an alternative.


Delhi Dog

climber
Good Question...
Sep 5, 2013 - 10:11am PT
tough business all around, and fairly f*ckin complicated

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/05/world/middleeast/rockets-in-syrian-attack-carried-large-payload-of-gas-experts-say.html?ref=world

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/05/world/middleeast/brutality-of-syrian-rebels-pose-dilemma-in-west.html?ref=global-home&_r=0
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Sep 5, 2013 - 10:14am PT
It's easy to be a critic, not so easy to name an alternative.

That's because we don't have an alternative. You can vote for any candidate you want, as long as he/she is a corporate sponsored technocrat.

Rather than piss and moan about this, I'd suggest writing your senators and congressman about stopping this. How many times do you have to get burnt before you stop sticking your finger in the flame?
WBraun

climber
Sep 5, 2013 - 10:16am PT
Coming out from the NYT is all bullsh!t.

Stupid fools believe all the lies and propaganda by the mainstream media aligned with these lying aszholes running the world into the ground.

You people never ever learn from the past nor from the present and what to speak of the future.

Stupid lame brained zombies ......
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Sep 5, 2013 - 10:17am PT
BTDT Gary. And you correct. If each of our reps receives x amount of negatives to this new war, MAYBE, they will think twice.

Ive asked them all which side they support,, Ted Bundy, or Jeffrey Dahmer..And ive told them ill vote for no rep that tosses us into this,.

Our only bargaining power IS our votes. USE that as a threat to our reps.
couchmaster

climber
pdx
Sep 5, 2013 - 11:12am PT
As Werner says, you can google the most recent and obvious: Amber Lyon, CNN. Ex-CNN reporter Lyon claims that she had been directed by CNN to report selectively and falsely in order to sway public opinion, and that this was common practice at CNN.

The real question is what really occurred with the gas in Syria. You have to be skeptical when there is only 1 country upset about it enough to attack over it... the US in this case. I may believe Kerry's honesty more than anyone in the last admin, however, it's a large machine he is a cog in.....real real large. Lots of various interests in it. If ever there was a case where we need to slow down and re-evaluate our position instead of rushing right in and killing people and destroying things before doing a full investigation of all the facts: this is it.

In my humble opinion.

jghedge

climber
Sep 5, 2013 - 11:14am PT
We let the Syrians get away with gassing their own people, they'll start doing it to Israel.

Ever looked at a map? Jerusalem is as close to where those 400 kids were gassed to death (Damascus) as Vegas is to LA (about 300 miles).


It's a limited tactical strike, the primary purpose of which is to respond to the use of chemical weapons. Gassing civilian populations is legitimized as a valid method of warfare if nothing is done.

What if the Syrians started building death camps with gas chambers, and loading people into boxcars? Still cool with that? Well, how much difference, really, is there between that and just gassing them in the streets?

And this is happening 300 miles from Jerusalem? Get real.
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:24pm PT
It's a limited tactical strike, the primary purpose of which is to respond to the use of chemical weapons. Gassing civilian populations is legitimized as a valid method of warfare if nothing is done.

Do civilian populations prefer to be high explosive collateral damage? Blowing children into small pieces is a legitimate method of warfare?

Please advise.
Largo

Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:28pm PT
We let the Syrians get away with gassing their own people, they'll start doing it to Israel.
-

They start doing that on any kind of scale and they'll be eating an atom bomb. That's what makes this sketch.

JL
Delhi Dog

climber
Good Question...
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:32pm PT
"tough business all around, and fairly f*ckin complicated"

Thanks WB for proving my point.
What people get (and the story they build in their heads) is what is in the media. NYT is an example. And I chose two different stories being told.

Unless you are there or have connections that are not censored by the media/gov etc, the story remains that which is told and controlled to whatever degree.

Besides that, are you actually saying (WB) it ISN'T a tough business and not complicated.

Who's the f*#king idiot?

edit: sketch is right
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:34pm PT
They start doing that on any kind of scale and they'll be eating an atom bomb. That's what makes this sketch.

Now that's crazy talk; the Israelis are many things but stoopid isn't one
of them. They can easily annihilate the Syrian army within 48 hours. I
can assure you they have every major Syrian asset pin-pointed and targeted
with conventional weapons.

They would only use their nukes on the Iranians.
jghedge

climber
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:49pm PT

"Do civilian populations prefer to be high explosive collateral damage? Blowing children into small pieces is a legitimate method of warfare?"


It's a limited tactical strike, and it has to be done. I don't know how else you get around delegitimizing gassing people 300 miles from Jerusalem in this situation.
Chaz

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:52pm PT
Israel can take care of itself.

They've proven they can whip Syria and Egypt ( who actually has a professional army ) both simultaneously at the same time.

A limited tactical strike is just totally asinine. Assad needs to lose something personal ( like his own life, or the lives of his wife and 11-year-old son ) before he changes his ways. Unless Obama's prepared to do that, he should simply butt-out.

Just sinking Assad's navy or grounding his air force won't do it. He can survive that, and fight another day.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Sep 5, 2013 - 12:56pm PT
Good damm thing we had our civil war before chemical weapons eh? Otherwise some sob country around the globe would have decided to bomb Americans to help Americans.


That would have been the British, who did exactly that.

Thank God for the French. (but you don't have any gratitude for that, do you Rong?)
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Sep 5, 2013 - 01:01pm PT
They start doing that on any kind of scale and they'll be eating an atom bomb. That's what makes this sketch.



So we've laid out the extremes: Nothing, or nuclear attack.

Is there nothing inbetween?

Yes, a limited tactical attack, as is being contemplated, BEFORE it escalates.

Interestingly, a massive attack by Israel, as proposed above, seems to have NO potential for collateral casualties. How do the Israelis perform such magic?

Why is a pinpoint attack, so as to forestall the need for the massive attack or the nuclear attack, such a bad idea? It offends the sensibilities of the lovers of mass casualties?
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Sep 5, 2013 - 01:02pm PT
The Moslem world is setting up for it's analog of the 30 years war. Shia vs Sunni replacing Catholic vs Protestant.

Europe got this out of its system in the 15th century and settled into the concept of the nation state with the Peace of Westphalia. The very concept of the nation state is heretical to both sides in the present conflict.

Obama has been in the Sunni camp all along with his key advisor Valerie Jarrett having deep ties to the Muslim Brotherhood. Hilary's close confidante Huma Abedin, also with close ties to the Broderbund. This also explains the fiasco in Egypt. Now the Saudis are offering to foot the bill for this latest fools errand.

We are about to get embroiled in a religious conflict that has been going on since Mohamed's kids started squabbling immediately after his death.

The Machiavellian response would be to make sure both sides get just enough help so that neither side can achieve a definitive victory and that they both duke it out to exhaustion and bankruptcy.

The best option would be to finish Keystone and start a crash program of petroleum self sufficiency. Cut the House of Saud and all the rest loose. Combine this with a real red line declaring that if the family squabble spills out of the house the consequences will be terminal.
fluffy

Trad climber
Colorado
Sep 5, 2013 - 01:07pm PT
this is about getting rid of the chemicals. they could be used again on the Syrians by Assad, fall into the hands of the rebels (al Qaeda) or launched into Israel. could get real messy, real quick. what choice does Obama have than to try to keep any or all of these scenarios from happening?

air drop a million gas masks and leaflets and then fire tommahawks to surgically strike the weapons labs/depots/rocket launchers.

this isn't Iraq. comparisons to that war and it's fabricated justifications are misguided and self-serving with no basis in reality.
jghedge

climber
Sep 5, 2013 - 01:28pm PT


"The best option would be to finish Keystone and start a crash program of petroleum self sufficiency."


Keystone has nothing to do with domestic oil production. It's to get oil from Canada to the Gulf of Mexico, from where it goes to China. The pipeline to get it from Canada to here already exists. Keystone finishes the line from Oklahoma to the Gulf.

Turning North America into a resource colony for Communist China is probably the dumbest idea repubs have ever come up with - and that's saying something.



TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Sep 5, 2013 - 01:53pm PT
We could be a net oil exporter within 10 years with more reserves than the Saudis.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Sep 5, 2013 - 01:54pm PT
...and quite a lot of our groundwater tainted from fracking.
Messages 561 - 580 of total 1004 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews