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donald perry
Trad climber
kearny, NJ
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Just for the record, my chipping was not that big a deal, and it was a long time ago. I pried a rotten piece of a flake out of a crack with the pointy end of a piton hammer, and hit it a couple of times, it was not a project getting it out. That whole part of the cliff was all loose rock, no one was interested in it then, and no one is really very too interested in it now. I was just trying to find some interesting feature I would not kill myself on for the bottom pitch. There were tons of loose junk on it. There was a sh#t load of loose junk that came off there, chipping off all kinds of things on the way down with clouds of smoke. That's what we did in those days, dumped all the loose rocks off the cliff. One block even took out a tree.
Bragg on the other hand would leave loose rocks all over the place, like on Enduro Man for example. Mike Burlingame led the second ascent, knocked them off, and just sat down on the block.
As for Scary Area, I literally almost died on it. I assumed I could handle it when I got to the, what looks like a bucket, but it is rounded, there is no bucket there, and then you have to move right. And by the time I did that I was in a entirely different place, where if I fell I would hit the ground from even further up with no way to reverse the move. [There is a slope there on the hill.] I was pretty upset about it, it haunted me, at the time I felt something had to be done so no one would get killed. Today I would not have done the same thing. The good news is the first ascent party caved in and put a decent bolt there. Before then there was only a thin sheet metal piece of sh#t, I don't think it would have held the fall even if you could suck in the rope.
When constructing responses to my posts, keep in mind that my intent is to edit my writings when I find errors and shortcomings, but not to cast things in a different light. My posts will change when I realize I have posted something that can be easily misunderstood or not originally intended. Not everyone it going to meticulously follow through a whole thread further down to find the “correct” interpretation. However, I do realize that the thread needs an apology when there are significant changes. This is one of the reasons primarily, why I believe the supertopo.com thread configuration is highly superior over gunks.com.
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Rickster
Trad climber
Pine Bush,NY
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Oct 15, 2013 - 09:47am PT
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Geez Don, by the looks of it, if anyone has been bouldering there, they've kept it pretty quiet, you know.. low profile ..... so far. Then you visit, post up photos and such ASAP. If the PIPC didn't have any issue with boulderers as opposed to their traditional regulations against other forms of roped, trad, and sport climbing, that could change with this kind of attention.
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donald perry
Trad climber
kearny, NJ
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Oct 15, 2013 - 02:23pm PT
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Maybe that could be the reason why the person who originally posted the movie did it anonymously, because they could be blamed for causing more potential problems then the chiseler.
However, at this point I think that the movie that started this thread was taken on PIPC property so the cat is out of the bag, right? Although I will admit that this seems to be much worse than what that movie depicts and I am not sure just how extensive it is yet. I have to back there and find out.
But as far as I and other people like me are concerned they are drilling on our property and we don't like it. The point is that the drilling needs to stop, I think that this is more important than us climbing. Those holes will be there forever, we will only be here for another 30 or 40 years.
What would you do if you caught them drilling? Beg them to stop or call the police?
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Mar 16, 2016 - 01:47pm PT
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ONE MOR' TIME,
I LIKE THE POST #604 BETTER than THE POST #603 !
I can't find the Hammered & Chiseled Video anymore . Does anyone know where to find IT?
http://www.dpmclimbing.com/climbing-videos/watch/hammered-and-chiseled
[Click to View YouTube Video]
https://www.reddit.com/r/climbing/comments/18zept/pro_climber_ivan_greene_caught_on_tape_chipping/
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Ivan could crush it regardless of his lack of ethical standing
xzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxzxz
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Published on Nov 6, 2015
Old video of me (Isaac Palatt) repeating Ivan Greene's "Chubbers" aka "The Malibu Roof," at Malibu Creek State Park, CA. Date of ascent: 03/07/2012. To go on the record about this one, this boulder does not get climbed very often, but it has been called both V11 and V12. Apparently an intermediate left hand undercling that was grabbed before the pinch has broken, but I'm not sure how much of a difference that makes to the difficulty, as I climbed it post-break. To me, it felt like solid V11, on par with the likes of "Lolita" (Priest Draw, AZ), "Ex-Patriot" (Black Mt., CA), "Loaded Direct" (Hueco Tanks), etc. This is a re-upload for my archives. Original video thanks to Dara B: http://vimeo.com/38147143
UNDERSTASND I CANNOT TOLERATE THE CUR, AND WISH ID LET HIM AUGER IN WHEN HE WAS A LOST AND HOPELESS AT 16
SO BAMBOO, I HOPE YOU ARE BEING FACETIOUS !
V V V V V ( & yeah that link won't play anymore)
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bamboo
Trad climber
pike co
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Mar 18, 2016 - 02:07pm PT
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definitely facetious gnome!!!
I just played the link here---I'm unsure of why it won't work for you?!
IMO he's a self centered vandal!!!
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donald perry
Trad climber
kearny, NJ
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Oct 30, 2016 - 04:56pm PT
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"I can't find the Hammered & Chiseled Video anymore . Does anyone know where to find IT?"
I believe Ivan Greene is not chipping anymore, he forgot about it so I think it would be a nice gesture if we could forget about it. Nobody's perfect, and perhaps when the rock keeps breaking under your fingertips eventually you feel you need to do a little chipping to bring things back to the way they were so you can send again or use some epoxy to put the flake back.
BTW, I posted some photos of big rocks drilled out to make hand holds in NY and no one said a thing about that.
There is a few flakes on my climbs that may pop, and if the climb disappears I may epoxy them back, or I may put some epoxy behind the flakes so they just stay there.
But I do not think it is a good idea for people to do anything without consulting with the other climbers about it first.
Ivan Greene is probably one of the greatest climbers of all time, I would be more interested to see some more videos of him climbing then talking about his chiseling under some rock no one can find.
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Donald,
Sorry I missed your post.
I did catch your recent posts, to the data base. great stuff!
I hope you will post some of the those super white rock pictures here with
a description of some of those lines or at least that One . . . .
What a penultimate route maybe a write up about all of the years of dedication,
Your son has done you proud!
As for the Chipping video, I want to make sure that it is understood that my
opinions of Ivan mirror yours.
Yes, I posted videos of him
Because He IS That Good a climber.
He is one great climber. A Natural,
And that he did not touch rock till he was 17 is also To his credit.
I understand, the steep divide and think it needs to be repeated.
Some of It was a creative effort to make worthy and very hard (v10& up) problems go.
He did remove some big holds. . . .to keep the grades very high, ....
My hope is that I and Ivan are still old fiends like you! (& me I hope?)
quartzite IN the bones.
Friends too I'm sure, but I've never been to Pudge Knuckle's Coffee shop in Brooklyn
and have not seen you or Ivan in at least a decade.
Are you watching this unfold ? It has a familiar ring to it,
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/chipped-holds-vandalism-on-lower-little-cottonwood-boulders/112280330#a_112287452
My thoughts; some bitter old dude may have not liked all the new crew of 12 year olds
hiking his high water marks, but who knows
So it is . . . . So it goes. . Same as it ever was...
The Canyons beyond Salt Lake City, Ferguson,Logan and Big & little
Have some very good stone.
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couchmaster
climber
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I read some of this upthread that I must have missed 3 years back, in particular, the Larrys comment: "Healyj likes to make up his own ethics. Like putting bolted anchors in the middle of a crack pitch and gluing loose holds on 5.7s.
I personally know you to be a good dude, but this is unfair Larry. Like comparing apples and squirrels. The bolted anchor was advised by the authorities and would spare a tree and the glued holds were not even the same planet of discourse. The holds Healyj glued were:
1st) Existing rock that was working loose. Not added on.
2nd) Failure of which would have both radically changed the route dramatically for the worse and possibly resulted in a free soloist fatality if it pulled off at the wrong time.
3rd) Unanimously and consensus agreed to by almost all that glue would be a good thing in this single application.
4th) Near perfectly installed so that it is all but invisible. The loose hold is stabilized and you'd never know it unless you were told.
Call him an as#@&%e for lots of other things, but for the glue in particular, he should get our thanks. I climbed that route a few days back, and had forgotten about the glue to stabilize the key holds a few years or so ago.
Thanks!!!!!!!! (said now so I don't forget)
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Escopeta
Trad climber
Idaho
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Holy Crap. Are we rationalizing glued holds and retro-bolts now?
1st) Existing rock that was working loose. Not added on.
<Uh, that's what happens in the real world. In fact, that process is what created your little climb in the first place. How does that make it less offensive?>
2nd) Failure of which would have both radically changed the route dramatically for the worse and possibly resulted in a free soloist fatality if it pulled off at the wrong time.
<Oh no! Heaven forbid a climb change through natural causes. And ANY f*#king flake on the planet will kill a soloist if pulled off at the wrong time. I think Loose Lady has changed over time, maybe I should glue some sh#t to it and add a bolt or two. For safeties sake. Is that really the rationalization you are going to use? Let's make it safer for everyone - Woot Woot. >
3rd) Unanimously and consensus agreed to by almost all that glue would be a good thing in this single application.
<Echo chambers have a way of validating preconceived notions.....>
4th) Near perfectly installed so that it is all but invisible. The loose hold is stabilized and you'd never know it unless you were told.
<So, by that standard, if Ivan Green had done a better, more aesthetically pleasing job of chipping holds it would have been ok? Good grief. >
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