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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 02:33am PT
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ken m says t*r ought to have complained to chrismac first, or perhaps have gone to the police. i have a little scientific experiment for him. google "teen porn", and then dial 9-1-1.
Tony, I appreciate what you are trying to say.
I just want to clarify that what I said was that an appropriate action was to complain to CM as a first step (which I don't know happened or not-but speaking generically). She chose the nuke route, but by my reading of the evidence of what occurred, she did not choose to complain to the ISP, nor call the police either of which she could have done, but did not.....and both of which most of us would have considered over the top.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 02:35am PT
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And boys, posting cheesecake photos is not in any way related to climbing, either. So if you are so profound in your purity of maintaining climbing only, you have no basis to support non-climbing photo work, either.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 02:52am PT
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Geeze... I go on vacation and look at this!
As you can see I have not been banned. Instead we were in Montana climbing ice, skiing, having the kid play in snow, you know... The stuff that this forum is suppose to be about.
Two... The Boob thread IS a joke. It is a distraction from the gun thread and yes I knew it would eventually get nuked because that is ST's nature. It's nothing to argue about, point fingers over, name call, etc.
Maybe we need to start a thread on Beer! No, no, NO! Dear lord I am not encouraging alcoholism or driving drunk, etc. Can a thread just be for fun, EVER?
Anastasia, I think your post trivializes what happened. At least two women were highly offended enough to quit, and at least several others were also highly offended and the outcome is not yet clear.
I'm not really aware of a thread that has had that effect.
I don't think that anyone questions your intent, but as they say, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
"The community" seems to be upset that members quit because they have been insulted and disrespected, and reduced to their sexual utility.
The import of your thread seemed to be that the value of women in a climbing community is as decoration and convenient sex objects.
I wonder if you'd find offense if a thread was posted whose import was blacks are valued in climbing as n*ggers....even if meant as over-the-top funny. Ha ha? I think you wouldn't.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 02:56am PT
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If I post a picture of a former GF, topless while climbing,should I call a lawyer or a massage therapist ?
I'm not sure what scum who do that should do. Personally, I view it as a sexual assault. I'd wonder why any woman would every trust someone who did that for anything, ever.
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Anastasia
climber
InLOVEwithAris.
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:09am PT
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First of all Ken... I was actually gone for eleven days in the mountains where everyone should be going "often." I was not here for the drama so I have no idea what the heck happened and honestly am glad since the subject matter was in humor. Seams that it doesn't matter if it is about guns, politics, bolts, boobs, etc. Seams ST Folks will beat each other up with anything.
Two... I did not trivialize, mistreat or name call anyone. I did not post anything rude or condescending, therefore I will not take responsibility for that. If someone did, it shows their idiocy.
Three... Yes, this drama is stupid. People who twist things into ugliness are stupid and yes... That is juvenile. If I had been around, I would have deleted the thread for Chris Mac myself.
Such silliness... Very astounding.
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Meow Now
Trad climber
Emerald City
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:09am PT
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Why did all those women click on a thread knowing its content would severely offend them? That is what I just can't wrap my head around. Drama! Oh, yes, boobs have never been shown on ST prior to Anastasia's thread. Time to move on from this nonsense bacause it's really not that big of a deal...
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:15am PT
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Great to hear, meow, that you will not be clicking on my thread celebrating female castration. It's so nice to know that you support anything that you don't want to know about.
I think that slavery can be fun, too. Sorry you won't be reading about it. The volunteer work I've done in trying to eradicate slavery is important, at least I think so. You don't, I guess, because by keeping it off your screen, for you, it doesn't exist.
Others don't take your view of what happens in a community, but it is large enough for those who care, and those who don't.
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Meow Now
Trad climber
Emerald City
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:16am PT
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Ken, please calm down. You need to breathe... The issue is in regards to a thread posted BOOBS... Period. Dont get off subject.
And Ken, please, stay away from European beaches. We all run around with no tops... I would not want you to have a nervous breakdown or anything while on vacation.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:22am PT
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Two... I did not trivialize, mistreat or name call anyone. I did not post anything rude or condescending, therefore I will not take responsibility for that. If someone did, it shows their idiocy.
Actually, Anastasia, I think you are trivializing.
You created a thread that went in a bad direction. It caused people to quit in a fashion that seems unprecedented.
You now state it wasn't your intent (which I believe), and that it's not your fault (which is mostly true), so it doesn't matter and isn't important. Even though there are hundreds of posts on the issue at this point.
That is the definition of trivializing.
triv·i·al·ize
/ˈtrivēəˌlīz/
Verb
Make (something) seem less important, significant, or complex than it really is
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Anastasia
climber
InLOVEwithAris.
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:23am PT
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Ken???
WTF is castration having to do with boobs? I don't get the connection and... Seriously, are topless female sunbathers needing to be saved from slavery?
Oh my gosh, am I being enslaved by my husband when I'm breast feeding my child? Really???
This has no logic. None... Actually kind of funny if you think about it.
You objectify women as being without free will, as being helpless victims.
I and my kind are not helpless, we are not victims and we have free will. If we choose to use our bodies for gains, what makes it different from a male body builder, a male model? Saying women are being victimized IS sexist.
Anyway... I'm done and yes... I'll stick to my original view, this is STUPID.
STUPID fights like this is what drive people away. Heck, I am just another woman being bashed. Are you guys targeting us gals or is this just part of the random STUPID.
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Meow Now
Trad climber
Emerald City
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:27am PT
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+++++2 for Anastasia...
Ken, You have some serious issues...don't know how else to define your lack of logic.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:36am PT
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Meow, my asthma is doing well this evening, thanks!
concrete thinking
Psychiatry Cognition that reflects experience, rather than abstraction, typical of those who are unable to generalize
You don't appear to understand the point of my post, which is in response to your post that "you don't understand".
I take it that you actually do understand, but are using that phraseology to avoid discussing the issue directly. People often do that when they feel inadequate to the task. I have no idea if that applies to you in this situation.
Maybe you don't understand. Why would someone take a look into a thread that upsets them, then take an action about it?
Because some people care how others are treated. some care how THEY are treated.
I appreciate that you aren't good with abstract thoughts, but how would you respond to a thread that had a title "Meow is sh*t?" Surely, there would be a bunch of upsetting stuff in there, and you are so mature as to ignore it. But not too many people would. By the way, I would not be tolerant of such a thread about you.
I hope this explains, in a clear fashion, why some people who belong to this community are somewhat intolerant to class disparagement of others in the community.
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Fletcher
Trad climber
The great state of advaita
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:39am PT
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Good lord, this has taken me two bowls of popcorn to read through!
Anastasia, love how you can cut directly through the crap and get to the gist of it all! Good on ya. Done with style and a healthy sense of humor (self and otherwise)! As always. :-)
Anyway, I just happened to come across a video that pretty much sums up (if that is possible) how these wacky threads seem to always end up:
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Hee hee!
Anastasia has expressed the key element: go do something outside (the weather or season is no excuse especially fer all you tough guys!), preferably for extended periods of time. And take a look in the mirror and have a good laugh. I do it all the time!
Love y'all all!
Eric
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:42am PT
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Ken M I would check with your doctor, you are definitely a candidate for TRT.
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Anastasia
climber
InLOVEwithAris.
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:44am PT
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So I am inadequate?
Now YOU are being condescending and exactly the kind of person you claim to be trying to save us from.
Don't try to twist this into something of "you don't get my higher thinking" or you must be avoiding the subject.
I simply got you beat.
AFS
P.S.
You really are being very rude. Plus by disrespecting my intelligence... Seriously, what kind of woman's rights activist are you if YOU can Treat Me, a Female like a small stupid child? Your treatment of ME again shows that you have no understanding of respecting others that you are preaching. Try it yourself... Heck, try it on me before expecting others to take your high and mighty preaching of being sensitive seriously.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:49am PT
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It's OK Ana, some people are really just crazy and you can't change them. 70 more years on this planet I don't suffer fools :) so for me its all sex, drugs and rock... well mostly just rock.*
*from a 5.10 ad :D
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John M
climber
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Jan 25, 2013 - 03:59am PT
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So I am inadequate?
I don't believe he was addressing you Anastasia. I believe he was addressing meow now. This post.
Why did all those women click on a thread knowing its content would severely offend them? That is what I just can't wrap my head around. Drama! Oh, yes, boobs have never been shown on ST prior to Anastasia's thread. Time to move on from this nonsense bacause it's really not that big of a deal...
Ken, it would be a good idea if you addressed your post to who you are responding to.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 04:00am PT
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Ken???
WTF is castration having to do with boobs? I don't get the connection and... Seriously, are topless female sunbathers needing to be saved from slavery?
Oh my gosh, am I being enslaved by my husband when I'm breast feeding my child? Really???
This has no logic. None... Actually kind of funny if you think about it.
You objectify women as being without free will, as being helpless victims.
I and my kind are not helpless, we are not victims and we have free will. If we choose to use our bodies for gains, what makes it different from a male body builder, a male model? Saying women are being victimized IS sexist.
Anastasia,
see my previous quote about "concrete thinking" in reference to abstract example. (that was NOT directed to you or what you were saying.)
I'm a white male. In my experiences, I've encountered women who like being called whores (who are not in that occupation), blacks that like being called n*ggers, jews that think it is funny being called kik*s, etc.
Does that give me license to refer to those groups that way? Does it excuse me from saying something when that is how those groups are referred to?
Am I victimizing women when I stand with women who object to being called whores? Am I victimizing blacks and jews when I stand with them against those who use those terms?
In this situation, I am standing with at least two women who were willing to give up their membership over what they perceived as treatment of women.
I'm not sure that I see how that victimizes you?
I don't know how you act when your friends are victimized, and attacked. I can't say that I can honestly call t*r and Lolli friends, having never met either. But they are members of a community to which I belong who I earnestly believe feel wronged. I have certainly seen both savaged in the aftermath. It is particularly hard to understand in the case of Lolli, who I"ve never seen say mean words to anyone, and made no fuss in this matter, but just quietly slipped away without so much as a statement. I stand with them.
My posts have basically been along the lines of explanation, interpretation, and thoughts about why people might take offense to the "boobs" thread. As a result, I've been rather aggressively reprimanded, as though I have no right to say anything.
I'm surprised that you make the argument that basically amounts to "being a man, you've no right to make statements about abuse of women". Well, if that's so, since you're not a child, you've no right to make a statement about child abuse...or about men, blacks, jews, or the poor. I doubt that you think that.
You are entitled to have your opinion about what consists of abuse and exploitation of women. However, you do not represent all women, and you do not have the right to dismiss the complaints of other women, simply because you are a woman.
You may choose not to stand with women who feel violated, and dismiss them (trivialize them), as is your right.
I stand with them.
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Anastasia
climber
InLOVEwithAris.
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Jan 25, 2013 - 04:06am PT
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How does that make it better? Claiming either I or someone else incapable of understanding. That isn't nice.
I think what we should do is BE NICE! You know, what five year olds are taught in kindergarten. Try it. Might Improve not only the forum, it will improve one's life.
You don't have to stand for this or that... How the heck did this get so twisted into some kind of political stance. Really sad... Throwing mud on each other for what? Really? This? Too bad that folks like killing nice fun things by making them ugly this way. All that arguing for such silly stuff and to keep it up! Wow... Astounding.
I'm done.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 04:15am PT
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You really are being very rude. Plus by disrespecting my intelligence... Seriously, what kind of woman's rights activist are you if YOU can Treat Me, a Female like a small stupid child? Your treatment of ME again shows that you have no understanding of respecting others that you are preaching. Try it yourself... Heck, try it on me before expecting others to take your high and mighty preaching of being sensitive seriously.
Anastasia, I'm not sure that I'm disrespecting your intelligence by pointing out that you have TOTALLY missed the point of my thread by using a type of common logic that leads you down a road of thinking that misinterprets what another is writing.
I'm the kind of women's rights activist that believes in treating women EQUALLY. That means you don't get treated politely, when you disrespect other members, such as t*r and Lolli. You get treated the same as would Ron. If, in the process of standing with them, I criticize you, you then take that as an attack on women? You are the appointed representative of all women, and any criticism of you is an attack on women generally?
Isn't that what you want? Equal treatment? Actually, I'm not sure that you can handle it. I'm not talking about "women", I'm talking about YOU. If you look around, Ron has had to endure FAR more worse language and verbiage from me, than you are getting.
John, I think I'd placed the name of the person I was addressing in each post, which I think is a good idea. Maybe you were pointing that out.....
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