NorCal pot farmers - YOU SUCK BIG TIME !!!!!!

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Jebus H Bomz

climber
Reno, Nuh VAAAA duh
Dec 28, 2012 - 01:21pm PT
That's how I read it too, Brandon.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Dec 28, 2012 - 01:23pm PT
The article in question, from LA Times:

Such raids have become commonplace in California, part of a costly, frustrating campaign to eradicate ever-bigger, more destructive marijuana farms and dismantle the shadowy groups that are creating them.

Pot cultivated on public lands surged in the last decade, a side effect of the medical cannabis boom. In 2001, several hundred thousand plants were seized in the state. By 2010, authorities pulled up a record 7.4 million plants, mostly on public land.

Law enforcement long called these grows on public land "cartel grows," and hoped to work from the busts in the forest up the drug hierarchy, maybe all the way to the Sinaloa Cartel or the Zetas.

But after years of raids and work with informants and wiretaps, agents realize the operations seemed to be run by independent groups of Mexican nationals, often using undocumented fieldworkers from their home regions.

Tommy Lanier, director of the National Marijuana Initiative, part of the Office of National Drug Control Policy, said there was scant evidence that the cartels exerted much control over marijuana growing in the national forests.

"Based on our intelligence, which includes thousands of cellphone numbers and wiretaps, we haven't been able to connect anyone to a major cartel," he said.

Lanier said authorities have long mislabeled marijuana grown on public land as "cartel grows" because Mexican nationals are arrested in the majority of cases, and the narrative of fighting drug cartels helps them secure federal funding.

He doesn't rule out that some of the cash flowing south of the border makes its way to members of those groups. He just doesn't believe they are actively directing activities up here.

"We've had undercover agents at the highest level of these groups, breaking bread and drinking tequila," says Roy Giorgi, commander of the Mountain and Valley Marijuana Investigation Team, a multi-agency organization headquartered in Sacramento. "Even at their most comfortable, the leaders never said, 'Hey, we're working for the Zetas.' "

In Giorgi's jurisdiction, the majority of the people arrested or investigated are originally from the state of Michoacan, where marijuana growing and immigration to the U.S. are entrenched.

Take it up with them, Ron.

DMT
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Dec 28, 2012 - 01:30pm PT
I know a way to dramatically increase solar efficiency for pot growing... move the plants back outside ya morons! Lol.

With legal pot, the central valley will tromp indoor grows back to the super specialists they once were.

On a simple scale of solar economy, if legalized, pot growing will return to the out of doors from whence it came!

Unless you live in some rainy shithole hahahahahaha!

DMT
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Reno, Nuh VAAAA duh
Dec 28, 2012 - 01:31pm PT
Man, reading the OP article more. If half of that's true, enjoy sucking down your unfiltered karmic retribution, brah. I guess it's easy for me, I got off the herb recently, but this is big time disgusting. Concerned pot heads need to start demanding more accountability.

Dingus wrote:

With legal pot, the central valley will tromp indoor grows back to the super specialists they once were.

Yeah buddy. The already cultivated Central Valley would become the weed basket of the world.
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Dec 28, 2012 - 01:37pm PT
I sleep easy not only from the sweet medicine, but also knowing who grew it.

In the last year I've made a conscious decision to buy primarily from growers I know.

Less mold spores, better product, peace of mind knowing that my money is going into a friends hiding space, rather than Mexico or abroad.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Dec 28, 2012 - 02:07pm PT
The central valley is already a failing agricultural system. No need to add to the water stress, over irrigation, and erosion by mass producing weed. Just make it like home brewing... you can grow your own and give away an ounce for Christmas... you just can't legally sell it.

Problem solved.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Dec 28, 2012 - 02:08pm PT
Well there you go.

Lol.

DMT
Tobia

Social climber
Denial
Dec 29, 2012 - 11:18am PT
The Klamath Basin has been getting trashed by one means or another since the white man first laid his eyes on it.

I just finished a book, River of Renewal: Myth & History In The Klamath Basin by Stephen Most. From gold mining (which I am guilty of), overfishing, hydroelectric dams and irrigation both the wildlife and people have suffered. The book was published in 2006 and ended on a positive note with people coming together to make changes to restore the natural balance of the area.

Cannabis growers weren't mentioned in the book, probably due to the smaller number of growers and their impact on the environment being hidden with their crops.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Dec 29, 2012 - 02:13pm PT
Less mold spores, better product, peace of mind knowing that my money is going into a friends hiding space, rather than Mexico or abroad.

And how do imagine that is accomplished?

Why do you think knowing the person who grows your weed means that you know HOW they grow your weed?
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Dec 29, 2012 - 02:16pm PT
^ uh, cuz you help cut it from the plant, trim it up, and know they have a similar desire for quality products as you do? Same reason people prefer homegrown, vine ripened tomatoes over store bought choss shipped from Mexico.
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Dec 29, 2012 - 02:39pm PT
If it were legal and regulated, each grow would be under environmental protection laws just like any other industry. It is against the law to dump these chemicals even if you are a goat farmer.

If it is regulated, and the grow sites are known, then it is pretty damn easy to construct a criminal case under local, state, and federal law. That is what my wife does for a living.

It is a simple thing to go for legalization. Just like Alcohol, which ruins more lives in a year than weed will in a lifetime.

First, our prisons are full of a small category of offenders: drugs, including weed, mental illness, which is now the defacto mental hospital of this day, and other non-violent crimes.

If you are caught with weed without a tax stamp on it, then that means it is from an illegal grow, such as Mexico, and you will get a massive fine. Enough to send you to the poor house.

If we can increase the domestic supply of Marijuana, then it will hurt the profits of the ungodly brutal Mexican Cartels.

All weed should come from a "born in the USA" card on it.

To finish this up, I was watching "Gangland" on TV the other night late and those gang members, even in prison, are lost causes for society. If any of them straighten their lives out, fine. If they get three strikes, we need to ship them to something like Devil's Island and stop wasting money paying for them.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Dec 29, 2012 - 02:45pm PT
Base...You are a smart man...But Moundhouse would be more appropriate than Devil's island....RJ
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Dec 29, 2012 - 02:46pm PT
Ship them to Australia
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Dec 29, 2012 - 02:47pm PT
John, I know how it's grown.
drewsky

climber
Seattle
Dec 29, 2012 - 03:33pm PT
One thing that seems to have been mentioned here but not given proper air time is that the considerable environmental damage of today is not going to magically cease if pot is legalized. In fact, if the legalization bill is something to the effect of big indoor grow-ops getting the green light, then what's to stop a Philip Morris or an RJ Reynolds (with Monsanto providing seeds) stepping in to dominate the industry? I doubt whether those companies could care less about the environment.

Growing pot indoors in CA makes no sense whatsoever given the amount of sun available; I've seen one energy equivalence estimate of 55 gallons of diesel fuel per pound grown indoors (I will admit that I can't verify the source other than to say that it was from an informational pamphlet). I suppose in a municipal grid (as opposed to giant diesel generators helicoptered into the woods) the electricity isn't all from such a filthy source, but still represents significant power usage in a place where the sun shines for free much of the year. Indoor obviously doesn't eliminate the environmental impact of water usage or chemical runoff, although it may concentrate the impact in less wild areas than do the asshats who grow on public land, be they cartel-related or other assorted criminals. Growing it sustainably and organically, outdoors, if more widely practiced, would be a great solution but it probably requires more effort and no one out for a quick buck is going to care enough to invest their time.

The industry obviously has to change and I'm pretty sure that the old guard of cottage industry growers will be disenfranchised regardless. With the market flooded it seems, unfortunately, the perfect time for large-scale state (or federal, eventually? yeesh) run operations to centralize the production and I really don't think this is a viable solution either (and many of those operations are indoor as well, which is even more wasteful). Would it be better to have everyone grow their own and dissolve the industry? I have no idea relative to the impact on power and water usage not to mention the use of fertilizer. Would there be fewer 10-ton stashes of garbage in sensitive forest and river lands? Maybe. Would it be better to have centralized production for the dispensaries and allow people to grow their own, like with ordinary produce?

I think someone said it upstream, but unfortunately (for those whose livelihoods depend on it) the only way to curtail some of the insanity in Northern CA is to remove the financial incentive somehow. I think it would probably be for the better, ultimately, but it might really screw everything up in that region. Tough call, but obviously something is going to change in the next decade, maybe sooner.

PS: I just read Base104's post a little more carefully and wholeheartedly agree, although I wish industry regulation were a little more reliable a tool and doubt that it would be a panacea in this case either.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Dec 29, 2012 - 08:09pm PT
One thing that seems to have been mentioned here but not given proper air time is that the considerable environmental damage of today is not going to magically cease if pot is legalized. In fact, if the legalization bill is something to the effect of big indoor grow-ops getting the green light, then what's to stop a Philip Morris or an RJ Reynolds (with Monsanto providing seeds) stepping in to dominate the industry? I doubt whether those companies could care less about the environment.

Oh, not true when they are regulated.

When you have a relative few larger operations, it is easy to monitor what they are doing. When you have a hundred thousand small operations located who knows where, it is nearly impossible.

When you create appropriate disincentives, you will have an impact.

For example, you wonder what would happen if confiscation of land were to happen, where environmental crimes occurred?
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Dec 29, 2012 - 08:13pm PT
It should be considerably cheaper to cultivate marijuana on land that is reasonably flat, with access to transportation, water, power, and people/employees. The main economic reason that they grow in the foothills and mountains is to reduce the likelihood/expense of being arrested, raided, or robbed, hence the acceptance of the increased variable costs. Take those risks away, and most growing will happen in flatter places - just like real regulation of automatic, semi-automatic and assault weapons, it may take a few years to be noticeable, but it will be. Even though the land may cost a bit more.
Tami

Social climber
Canada
Dec 29, 2012 - 08:39pm PT
Anders aren't you Mister Obvious :-)
Ricky D

Trad climber
Sierra Westside
Dec 29, 2012 - 09:10pm PT
Allow me to interject a little reality into this discussion on growing.

Outdoor - yes, the sun is "free" and the land is good and your weed will indeed grow big and full as Ma Nature intended. Unfortunately, what also delights in this paradise are bugs and thingies. Grow outdoors and your weed will ALWAYS be contaminated with insects, mold and fungi.

Two spotted and Black spotted mites from hell, springtails, Botrytis gray mold, Fusarium wilt, aphids, whiteflies - any number of things will absolutely infest any dense bud structure grown in the wild.

Not a big deal if your target buyers are 19 y/o frat boys - but if you are growing for true medical users with compromised immune systems - do you really want to infect them with this variety of potential pathogens?

There is a saying in the biz - "Dirt is Dirty".

Because of this is why I choose to grow indoors in a controlled environment under HID lights in a controlled Hydroponic environment.

I create and control my universe - I command the lights to shine or not, I feed with specific compounds tailored to the needs of the plant during each cycle of it's life. I give it the air it needs but only after filtering it to block spores and flying critters. I monitor and control the temperature for it's benefit. I use organic compounds such as rosemary oil and kelp extract to bolster it's immune system.

I harvest when it tells me to, trim by hand, dry in a humidity controlled room, cure in sterile glass jars and finally, have each run lab tested for the quality of it's inherent value as well as to confirm the absence of foreign materials and contaminants.

There is a difference in approaches to the creation of this product. On one hand, you can take the industrial path, on the other - you can be the whacky heirloom tomato guy at the Farmer's Market.

To equate it to the wine business - you can be a Gallo or you can be a Bien Nacido.



prickle

Gym climber
globe,az
Dec 29, 2012 - 09:14pm PT
Oh, not true when they are regulated.

When you have a relative few larger operations, it is easy to monitor what they are doing. When you have a hundred thousand small operations located who knows where, it is nearly impossible.

When you create appropriate disincentives, you will have an impact.

For example, you wonder what would happen if confiscation of land were to happen, where environmental crimes occurred?

disincentives LOL thats funny..what a fine like BP got?

If you are monsanto you just have the laws changed to your liking.
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