I Like the Atheist Life (OT)

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The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 12:33am PT
But the de-emphasis of good works by many Christian sects is tragic...especially in a grief stricken world so obviously in need of kindness and benevolence.

Agreed.

No one is exalted by good works alone.

Also tragic. Good works alone should be enough. The most kind, benevolent, and generous Muslims, Pagans, Buddhists, Shintoists, Taoists, Shamanists, Christians, and atheists in all the world should be fully and equally rewarded for their actions.
WBraun

climber
Oct 5, 2012 - 12:40am PT
So that's why you do it, eh.

For a reward ......
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Oct 5, 2012 - 12:44am PT
who knew the light at the end of the tunnel was a carrot on a stick?
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 12:55am PT
So that's why you do it, eh.

For a reward ......

Oh, come on... You can do better than that.

Feeling good is a "reward". Feeling like a decent human being is a "reward". Knowing that someone I care about is happier or safer is a "reward".

Check out recent neuroscience research on the internal payoff of altruism.

So-called "selfless" acts are in reality some of the most selfish acts possible. People do them because it makes them feel better -- about themselves, about the state of the world, etc.
splitter

Trad climber
Hodad, surfing the galactic plane
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:02am PT
It (good works) is done out of love for mankind (& for love of God/He loves mankind, gave His only begotten son for men) not for salvation or for a reward.

edit: good works are not "de-emphasis[ed]". on the contrary, they are why we are here. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." they are just not relied upon/dependant for eternal salvation.
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:05am PT
It (good works) is done out of love for mankind, not for salvation or for a reward.

The reward is the knowledge that mankind is better off as a result of the good works.

That is a very real reward.
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:08am PT
Feeling good is a "reward".


Feeling good can be achieved by dopamine release in the brain, a chemical process that can happen after an intense workout, sex or watching cartoons.

Feeling like a decent human being is a "reward".
The Ego can be reconstructed many ways, doubtfully as a reward... rather the unique way in which our neurons fire and record information.

Knowing that someone I care about is happier or safer is a "reward".

Oxytocin is another chemical our brain releases when around children or loved ones to keep us from harming them, thus our species could develop communities and raise our rather frail (by the animal kingdom) babies without eating them.


So maybe not rewards, all those ;D
WBraun

climber
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:13am PT
So violence is not good works?

So violence is not kindness?
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:13am PT
Feeling good is a "reward".

Feeling good can be achieved by dopamine release in the brain, a chemical process that can happen after an intense workout, sex or watching cartoons.

Feeling like a decent human being is a "reward".

The Ego can be reconstructed many ways, doubtfully as a reward... rather the unique way in which our neurons fire and record information.

Knowing that someone I care about is happier or safer is a "reward".

Oxytocin is another chemical our brain releases when around children or loved ones to keep us from harming them, thus our species could develop communities and raise our rather frail (by the animal kingdom) babies without eating them.


So maybe not rewards, all those ;D


Ah, but you missed the point entirely.

They are rewards indeed. The reward is the mood-enhancing properties.

The firing of our neurons and the chemicals of our various receptors determine our good feeling.

Feeling good is the reward.
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:16am PT
True, because all those chemicals are biological constructs to allow our genetics to pass on and reward us!
WBraun

climber
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:20am PT
So you're all selfish do gooders?

Ya all do sh!t so ya can feel good ultimately for yourselves.

Do good ers .....
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:20am PT
True, because all those chemicals are biological constructs to allow our genetics to pass on and reward us!

Agreed...

Neuroscience research suggests that this is why (or partly why) our brains perceive them as "rewards" -- as survival mechanisms, to motivate us toward particular behaviors that enhance survival of the species.
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:23am PT
So violence is not good works?

So violence is not kindness?

Who says?

Self-defense is violence. Isn't it also kindness and good works toward oneself?
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:26am PT
So you're all selfish do gooders?

Ya all do sh!t so ya can feel good ultimately for yourselves.

Do good ers .....

Who's "you"?

Why do you do sh#t? So you can feel bad?

The answer to your questions is "Nope".

But I think you already know that...
splitter

Trad climber
Hodad, surfing the galactic plane
Oct 5, 2012 - 01:27am PT
edit: Oops, posted on wrong thread! lol

deleted it and posted on the "cat" thread!

I'll just leave this here since it is "800" cuz nobody likes to post the last post before it turns over, eh?
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Oct 5, 2012 - 02:40am PT
DoGooders

Take heed that you do not do your charitable deeds before men, to be seen by them. Otherwise you have no reward from your father in heaven. Therefore when you do a charitable deed do not sound a trumpet before you as the Hypocritiesdo in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory from men. Assuredly I say to you they have their reward. But when you do a charitable deed do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, that your charitable deed may be in secret and your father who sees in secret will Himself reward you openly. Teachings by Jesus

Jus Help'in
BB
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 03:19am PT
Don't do good things that can be seen by people?

If it helps someone, then it's not a secret, right?

That's not much help.
splitter

Trad climber
Hodad, surfing the galactic plane
Oct 5, 2012 - 04:57am PT
Sttzo - the point is to not do good works to solely impress men/people (make yourself look good, or for personal gain or ego)). It would be very self indulgent and defeat the purpose, as far as a spiritual/ Christian perspective is concerned. That is what JC is refering to in Blueblocr's quote/paraphrase!

edit: Delhi Dog - Sorry, but, i have been staying away, just got pulled into answering some questions directed toward "xtians" from your buds this evening! Otherwise, I haven't posted here in about 30 days! plus, people are arriving at, or deriving a lot of false assumptions, so i was attempting to shed some light on them, and in the process answera few of the specific questions that you guys came up with that no one responded to. but, perhaps they are convenient (false assumptions) for you regardless, since ya have already determined that it is all bogus anyway, right? so what difference does it make if lies are being spread, eh? but i suspect others (open minded searchers) are reading both threads, so some of us "xtians" are compelled to speak up when we note a discrepency! BUT, that could prollie be addressed through our thread, eh? I have already, personally, suggested that we "xtians" do just that (qoute and respond to what is said here on the I Like The Christian Life (or whatever Spider Sabitch's thread is called)...good idea, eh? i believe so, especially since the OP/Khanom explecitely expressed a desire for us to "hold your reaction, criticize on other threads"! I do believe we should respect that and show a little restraint. but wudevah, bro! since there are some hard headed types on both sides. lata...
Delhi Dog

climber
Good Question...
Oct 5, 2012 - 05:01am PT
I'm still trying to figure out what all these religious folks are doing on the atheist thread. Anyone jump ship yet?
The user formerly known as stzzo

climber
Sneaking up behind you
Oct 5, 2012 - 08:58am PT
Sttzo - the point is to not do good works to solely impress men/people (make yourself look good, or for personal gain or ego)). It would be very self indulgent and defeat the purpose, as far as a spiritual/ Christian perspective is concerned. That is what JC is refering to in Blueblocr's quote/paraphrase!

Then perhaps the phrase should say that instead of being ambiguous.
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