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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Dec 19, 2011 - 05:57pm PT
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LEB,
They still "think like" tom cats only to a (much) lesser degree. Some of them are still quite territorial and continue even to spray.
thats Russ' whole point about eldo-prancers! lots of spray!
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Willoughby
Social climber
Truckee, CA
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:04pm PT
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Tami just said she'd eat a big one.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:10pm PT
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Easy ElCap, EFA's are in a lot of vegan foods. If you really want to balance the omega 3's to 6's, then you can adjust with flax and/or hemp seeds added to a salad
Not that simple really. The plant sources (aside from maybe algae extracts) aren't long-form...as in EPA/DHA, they are ALAs. And while yes you can convert ALAs to long-chain, the conversion isn't very efficient. So sprinking flax on your salad isn't really going to cut it (btw, do you grind your flax seeds? you should.). Sure, you'll get sufficient EFAs to survive, but nowhere near an ideal amount to thrive.
Eat how you want, it's your body, I don't have an agenda...other than keeping the prancing metrosexual skeletal bendy shakti ommmmmmm ommmmm soyfu latte drinking fru fru crowd from getting malnutrition...after all I might need one of them around someday, those titty-dragging 5.6 slabs don't lead themselves you know!
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monolith
climber
berzerkly
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:21pm PT
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I don't use much flax or hemp. I only mentioned it because some are concerened about the omega 3 to 6 ratio. Plenty of sources of efa's in vegan foods. 15 vegan years of high quality health and athleticism proves it for me.
Many vegan athletes thrive.
If you want to eat animals that make long-chains just like we do, fine. That's like making a house by using the parts from a torn down house.
The longer chains are assembled into triglycerides during digestion anyway.
You still scared of fiber?
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Matt
Trad climber
it's all turtles, all the way dooowwwwwnn!!!!!
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:25pm PT
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Good for you RW!
(note- i have not read the thread thru')
I have been vegan or mostly vegan for yrs, and veggie or mostly veggie for 20 yrs (broken up by about 4 yrs eating some fish).
I agree, I feel great too, and my wife and employers will attest that I rarely get sick (except I always seem to get a sinus infection when I fly coast to coast- which sucks!)
Anyway- take note:
A healthy carnivorous diet minus the meat will not be a healthy diet.
One can eat nothing but potato chips and be a vegan, so the label itself is no sign of a healthy diet, right?
That said, your life is now open to a whole new kind of creativity, enjoy the opportunity!
Try to eat diverse and whole grains, and go big on lentils whenever possible.
wrt B12, the body store like 3 yrs of that, so it's nice to supplement, but no rush going there.
I also suggest eating organic and not bio-engineered foods whenever possible/reasonable, because those chemicals are not doing your endocrine systems a lick of good... as you know.
Cheers,
-Matt
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:25pm PT
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Vegan Planet is a great cookbook. I'm not vegan but I like to eat healthy. In fact, just ate a very non-vegan pizza using the crust recipe from that book. Yum.
I like the idea of eating well most of the time.
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:28pm PT
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I'm not even a vegetarian, but the Moosewood cookbook still kicks ass.
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Relic
Social climber
Vancouver, BC
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:31pm PT
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Aside from the B12 issue, how do these effeminate metrohippyuals get a good/adequate source of long chain Omega 3s?
Good vegan sources for B12 are chorella, miso, and nutritional yeast.
Omega-3 and omega-6 essential fatty acid sources include all things hemp(seeds, oil, protein powder), flax seeds, nuts, avocado
I'm no expert but I have been doing the vegan thing for a while. I really felt great and noticed a huge difference in my energy level when I started the vegan thing. I cave in once in a while and eat burgs n crap like that, but I always feel like garbage after.
I highly recommend eating lots of quinoa. Use it as a sub for rice/pasta. Eat a lot of wholesome veg like kale.
I make smoothies for breakfast, especially when I'm planning on going climbing. My favorite smoothie powder is made by Vega, its called Complete Whole Food Health Optimizer. I get a lot of energy milage out of those smoothies, great stuff. It has all the essential daily vitamin, fatty acids, proteins, minerals you need.
A book I read on going vegan was The Thrive Diet, by Brendan Brazier. He's a tri-athelete vegan dude.
Good luck on your vegan thingy.
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S.Leeper
Social climber
somewhere that doesnt have anything over 90'
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:39pm PT
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Way to go Riley. I made it about 4 months full on vegan.
Find the food that satisfy you so you don't get tempted.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:48pm PT
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Repeat after me: ALAs are not DHA/EPA. ALAs do not convert very efficicently.
From "Differentiation of ALA (plant sources) from DHA + EPA (marine sources) as Dietary Omega-3 Fatty Acids for Human Health "
... the published literature and reviews thereof indicate that, for the most part, ALA does not offer the same beneficial effects (or even portions thereof) for most of the cardiovascular risk parameters which have been evaluated and favorably influenced with DHA/EPA. It should also be noted that, in many of the controlled human trials, higher levels of ALA (omega-3) have been employed relative to DHA/EPA (combined). In general, the anti-thrombotic effects (including inhibition of blood platelet aggregation) have been very week or non-existent when ALA is compared to DHA/EPA. This overall perspective should not be surprising upon consideration that ALA likely requires conversion to DHA/EPA via desaturation/elongation reactions if it were to provide similar cardioprotective effects to that of pre-formed DHA/EPA. As mentioned previously, the conversion efficiency of ALA to DHA/EPA is very limited in humans. Controlled human studies using deuterated ALA coupled to GC-mass spec analysis have indicated conversion efficiencies of ALA to DHA/EPA (combined) ranging from 8-30%. Whereas DHA/EPA has a well-established blood triglyceride-lowering effect with a trend towards increasing HDL-cholesterol levels, ALA has no such effects.
Vegan is not natural, primates eat meat.
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monolith
climber
berzerkly
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Dec 19, 2011 - 06:58pm PT
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Primates in general consume little animal products. Some nearly none. It's mostly curiosity and territorial control against other primates. They get most of their nutrition from fruits and leaves.
Some of the primates(chimpanzee,bonobo) are considerd frugivors.
If humans ate the way primates do, fruit consumption would go way up and meat consumption would go way down.
Ants anyone?
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Captain...or Skully
climber
Asgard or bust
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Dec 19, 2011 - 07:03pm PT
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Eyes in front, 3 kinds of teeth.
Predator.
Vegans are delicious, If you've got enough butter.
Whole lotta bastin' goin' on.
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Johnny K.
climber
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Dec 19, 2011 - 07:47pm PT
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mmmmmmmmmMMMMMMmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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Captain...or Skully
climber
Asgard or bust
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Dec 19, 2011 - 08:10pm PT
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You can have that shizz, Doc. If it's buried, it's supposed to stay that way.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Dec 19, 2011 - 08:34pm PT
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FACT: There is no one type of diet which is universally good for all types of people. Some people thrive on one kind of diet, others on another.
It took me roughly 30 years to figure out what works best for me, although had I listened better to my body I would have got there sooner.
I've tried a lot of diets including many years vegetarian. Here's what I know about me. Wheat is bad. Fat is good. High quality (pasture raised organic) meats are good in limited quantities. Fish and poultry are good. Again, organic poultry and no farmed fish.
So I get all my carbs from fruit and veggies. That is the largest bulk of food I eat. I eat some meat each day. Some eggs most days. I cook with olive oil (low heat only,) avocado and coconut oils for higher temps. No processed foods, no refined sugars. Almost no ales, just 1 coffee AM and maybe wine before bed. Lots of water. Sea salt for trace minerals. Supplement iodine.
I'm about 2 years in and it's really great. All of the big energy swings and "hitting the wall" from the past are gone. Used to be if I started to feel even a little hunger I had to eat right away or bonk. Not so now. The furnace just keeps right on running.
Riley I hope it works for you. I am not a skeptic, we each have our own needs. Listen to your body, it will tell you. Andof course your needs will change over time.
edit: Buy and prepare your own food as much as possible. I eat out about once in two weeks. Restaurants are hell, even pretty good ones.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Dec 19, 2011 - 09:49pm PT
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Oh Jim....that is terrible...! RJ
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Dec 19, 2011 - 09:50pm PT
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Riley...Try a wheat grass enema...it will turn it all around for you and balance your chakras....RJ
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
-A community of hairless apes
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Dec 19, 2011 - 09:59pm PT
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Ksolem,
"Here's what I know about me. Wheat is bad. Fat is good. High quality (pasture raised organic) meats are good in limited quantities... I eat some meat each day. Some eggs most days."
Interesting, and remind us, for it to be most meaningful,
1. your age,
2. your cholesterol numbers, ratio if you know it, too
3. whether or not you're on a statin
Thanks.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Dec 19, 2011 - 10:03pm PT
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My friend's grandmother Gladys, oldest living marathon runner. Vegetarian. 7th day Adventists with their vegetarian and vegan diets live longer then any other group on the planet, which is nice.
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nature
climber
Aridzona for now Denver.... here I come...
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Dec 19, 2011 - 10:33pm PT
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a couple of folks in this thread are a colon cancer waiting to happen.
good job riley... but you gonna have to break this habit if you show up at sushifest.
pescatarians untie!
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