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rlf
Trad climber
Josh, CA
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Oct 11, 2011 - 10:07pm PT
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Yes, that harness makes your ass look big...
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 11, 2011 - 10:37pm PT
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I was in the restarunte bar buisnes for 23 years . can't tell you the number of fat lazy people who sat at our bar sucking down suds and stuffing their faces with fries and extra cheese nachos while complaining that they had a slow metabolism. One of those guys we used to call Jabba the Hut. I took a closeup shot of him with a 20mm lense and posted behind the bar. He got a good look at his six chins and freaked out! Dude started working out and sking etc. lost 160 lbs
Metabolism my arse..........
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Oct 11, 2011 - 10:43pm PT
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hey there say, melissa....
as to your qoute:
Every year my pants get another size smaller, but I just stay the same weight. (Who's got the reference?)
if you find this happening, i am not sure, but it reminds me of something i read somewhere.... not sure if it was a news article about sewing patterns, or what??? or just buying in department store:
it went on to say something like this, ( though i do not know how true this is)...
it was saying that patterns were making smaller size numbers for larger bodies... *since not so many folks were as thin as years back...
and then it said that dress and pants sizes were including larger "person" sizes, for the size number, henche, a size 6 would really be for a person of size 8, or something like that...
*the odd reason was said to be so that american shoppers would not be so embarresed by having to buy such bigger sizes...
i don't know how true this is... but my mom and a few folks from "back in the day" do seem to remember smaller size numbers in patterns, NOT being TO MATCH what they are today...
*say, i know that boys jeans now, always seem to come in the loose fit a lot... it is hard to find the other regulars anymore, in the smaller stores, ... not sure how it is in the bigger cities though...
well, i just shared in case you were wondering on why this was, or, what happened.... (i may not have understood correctly though, so i messed up, please forgive... )...
:)
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Oct 11, 2011 - 11:11pm PT
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hey there, say, archie... say, as to medicines... i know of stories from the epilepsy sites, where a few folks share how the medications that stop their seizures have caused them to gain a lot of weight, and it was very upsetting to them, being that to gain ability to function back to normal, they were tampering with their health, not only as to liver etc, but as to their excess weight...
PLUS for the self-esteem issues that they trying to overcome, now they didn't even look "like they used to look", and this was another burden, against who they were fighting to be:
the way they were, without the seizures...
very hard stuff... harder still, when this burden is on kids or pre-teens having to deal with this, too...
one gal felt like folks thought she was lazy, due to her weight, though she had no choice in that matter, due to her trying to control the seizures....
note:
*course, i know this is SIDE issue, as to the wrong food standards, etc, that are the major cause of overweight, as compared to years back, before it was so prevailent....
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Archie Richardson
Trad climber
Grand Junction, CO
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Oct 12, 2011 - 06:40am PT
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Over 164 million prescriptions for antidepressants were written in the US in 2008 (Wiki). Antidepressants can cause weight gain.
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YoungGun
Trad climber
North
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Oct 12, 2011 - 07:51am PT
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@Cragman: really don't appreciate the photo. Some of us browse at work, ya know?
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steveA
Trad climber
bedford,massachusetts
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Oct 12, 2011 - 08:34am PT
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I posted comments on this subject on another thread I started months ago.
It is NOT as simple as calories in equals calories out and another comment often mentioned blaming a "SLOW" metabolism.
Fat must be burned in order to loose it: the more you exercise the faster the fat loss; however this is NOT true for everyone. Genetically, about 1/3 of the population is predisposed to rapid weight gain by eating the WRONG type of carbohydrate. The type which breaks down rapidly into glucose; which raises blood sugar levels, triggering the rapid release of insulin from the pancreas. Insulin's job is to lower blood sugar levels and PACK ON FAT.
Many of the obese people in this country have the above genetic type and due to IGNORANCE are unaware of it.
This fact coupled with the combination of a lack of motivation to exercise and BURN fat are the prime reasons for our sorry state.
One poster above mentioned that he is hungry every three hours. This is due to eating the "wrong" type of carbohydrates, triggering a rapid insulin response. The blood sugar levels drop, ( as long as the insulin is still working and doing it's job), and the brain signals the human to eat more, since it is deprived of glucose. The cycle keeps repeating and the poor, unaware individual is constantly packing on fat.
Worse still is the FACT that these poor individuals who inherited this trait, through no fault of their own, are UNABLE to burn FAT if their insulin levels are elevated. These unlucky individuals may work out hard trying to loose weight with little success and very often just give up.
It is pretty easy to point the finger and just say these people are simply lazy etc. I know from personal experience what I am talking about since I to have inherited this trait. All my brothers and sisters are MORBIDLY OBESE. I have an identical twin brother who has close to a 60 inch waist!
I fortunately learned how keep my weight down, (I'm still climbing pretty hard at 65), by being introduced to Dr. Barry Sears thru a friend. Sears wrote the book, "Enter the Zone" which changed my life for the better. This book can be bought on Amazon used for a few bucks.
Sorry for the long winded post, but I'm a little tired of simplistic answers to a rather complex problem. The vast majority of the population
is IGNORANT when it comes to understanding the complex hormonal response
triggered every time we eat.
I have preached this to my brothers and sisters, but it falls on deaf ears.
Even with spot on knowledge, one has to apply it!
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raymond phule
climber
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Oct 12, 2011 - 08:47am PT
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About the size thing. I have some clothes from decathlon where the signs says USA S, EUR M.
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YoungGun
Trad climber
North
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Oct 12, 2011 - 09:33am PT
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Just noticed this study published online ahead of print in the journal Drug Testing and Analytics, which suggests that both performance-enhancing drugs and hard training “may alter the expression of specific genes involved in muscle and bone metabolism by epigenetic mechanisms, such as DNA methylation and histone modifications.” Cool, huh? This is why the “genetics versus training” debate is so irreducibly complicated: training can effectively change your genetics.
The SciAm article focuses on evidence that overweight mothers may pass the tendency to be overweight on to their children. What’s crucial is that this “inherited” trait isn’t encoded in DNA — instead, it’s how the DNA’s instructions are carried out that is altered. For example, there’s preliminary evidence that children born to an overweight mother before she undergoes gastric bypass surgery are more likely to become overweight when they grow up than their siblings born after the surgery [EDIT: see this AP story or this study for details]. If this was a simple genetic inheritance (i.e. through DNA), the surgery wouldn’t make any difference to inherited traits. Instead, it appears to be an epigenetic phenomenon.
http://sweatscience.com/training-changes-your-genetics-or-rather-epigenetics/
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YoungGun
Trad climber
North
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Oct 12, 2011 - 11:54am PT
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Sorry locker, not gonna take the bait =)
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YoungGun
Trad climber
North
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Oct 12, 2011 - 12:05pm PT
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If you DID get in trouble for viewing photo's...
something tells me that you'd much rather it be of a more attractive woman...
LOL!!!...
Nah, I didn't get in trouble... and yea, I'm just bitching because it was gross. ;)
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Oct 12, 2011 - 12:21pm PT
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For example, there’s preliminary evidence that children born to an overweight mother before she undergoes gastric bypass surgery are more likely to become overweight when they grow up than their siblings born after the surgery [EDIT: see this AP story or this study for details]. If this was a simple genetic inheritance (i.e. through DNA), the surgery wouldn’t make any difference to inherited traits. Instead, it appears to be an epigenetic phenomenon.
Wouldn't mom's eating behavior and what was fed to and observed by the kids be altered post bypass too?
Anectodal, but anyway...I'm the only person in my family except for a nephew that doesn't need to lose weight. My genes aren't better than anyone else's. My diet is. I have never spent significant time with anyone who was overweight where their overeating relative to their activity wasn't obvious, although I'd say that a majority would claim that they ate healthy, reasonable amounts of food and were physically fit.
It's like there is a perception disconnect. If they perceive themselves as having a healthy lifestyle dialed without getting the desired outcome, then they think that they are genetically doomed and stop trying to change anything.
Like, when my mom defends a friend of ours who weighs nearly 400 lbs. for eating mostly vegetables and salads, I'm baffled by her desire to believe this. It defies the physical laws of nature. He doesn't have magic genes that can conjure fat from nothingness. He'd need to be eating asparagus by the bail.
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Steve's sister
Social climber
Las Vegas, NV
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Oct 12, 2011 - 12:30pm PT
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If those in question of being obese are in fact cancer patients, then the steriods they take as part of their treatment may be the cause. For some women this is emotionally harder than the hair loss.
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ladyscarlett
Trad climber
SF Bay Area, California
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Oct 12, 2011 - 02:43pm PT
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Oh man, on discussions like these, I can really see how perspective colors every comment.
And with weight issues, it makes sense.
In the past, I've held to the idea that people's bodies align with their lifestyle. I want to do more with my body than average mainstream Americans want, so my body is shaped different than some of them.
With weight, I find there are so many issues that people will take into account, physical, emotional, mental...and depending on the person, they can use these factors as a crutch/excuse to prevent them from achieving their goals or use it as information to further their desired achievement.
As someone who happens to be the heaviest/thickest/softest in my family and friends, and struggle with weight management every day I am constantly slapped with the reality that for me, it's just.not.that.easy. And if it's true for me, it must be true for others.
I try to comfort myself with the knowledge that the body is far more malleable than I think. It's my mind that will always be too hard and brittle for what I want to achieve. Hopefully, time will keep on letting me search for right balance.
Now...don't get between me and the pastry...I need it to feel good and it's the only thing that will work. Trust me, I've tried...
2p
LS
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monolith
climber
berzerkly
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Oct 12, 2011 - 02:56pm PT
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Nice LS.
As others have said, simply it's calories in vs calories out. But that's not very helpful, and a little condescending.
What is creating the demand for the calories in? I think the body craves nutrition and if you eat low nutrition foods, there will always be a demand for more food.
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ladyscarlett
Trad climber
SF Bay Area, California
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Oct 12, 2011 - 03:23pm PT
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I think the 'calories in - calories out' is a reality, but it just doesn't address all the mechanisms in play.
Yes, it's true, but it doesn't take into account that eating is emotionally linked for some. It FEELS GOOD and makes me happy. Nutrition might not (and probably not) have anything to do with it.
When my friends down a Guinness/Murphy's that has more calories than the donut I'm stuffing into my face, we're not actually craving nutrition, we're craving a different kind of satisfaction. Knowing and acknowledging the reality of calories in vs calories out doesn't change the desire (which feels like a need) for that specific flavor of satisfaction. Balancing out that donut and beverage with a calorie burning activity just might not bring that mental satisfaction those people are searching for.
I've noticed that a generous portion of my leaner friends don't get the same enjoyment out of food that I do. They get that type of enjoyment through something else - exercise, sex, video games, drugs, or whatever, but not food. These people have better impulse control when it comes to food.
Me, it's like being in a room full of hot scantily-clad people and being told not to have any sex related or sensual thoughts. Just not that easy.
Calories in-calories out. I'm sure that people besides me wish it were as simple in practice as in word.
I'll say this, it was much easier to control my eating when I had a very rigid food budget. Eat on $20 a week, no exceptions no matter how shitty your brain is feeling, and the weight will begrudgingly stabilize.
Thanks for reading from this side of the peanut gallery..
Cheers
LS
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monolith
climber
berzerkly
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Oct 12, 2011 - 03:28pm PT
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What the body craves and what the mind craves can be too different things. The body signals the mind it wants something, but can't really say exactly what it is, so the mind goes back to it's favorite things, depending on many factors, like social needs, convenience,etc.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Oct 12, 2011 - 04:06pm PT
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It's funny it's usually the people who are naturally thin who say "it's only calories in vs calorie out, what's the big deal". But it IS different for different people, it's not just behavior it's genetics. Some people process more calories into energy some people store them as fat.
Some people also put muscle on easier than others. I've worked out with naturally thin friends who did the same workout schedule as me and I put muscle on much easier than them. I don't say "you're just not working hard enough" I know it's phyically easier for me to gain muscle with the same amount of work. One of my friends had "chicken legs" and worked them out a lot, while I have barely done any weight training on my legs and mostly from skiing and other sports they are much more muscular than his. It's genetics.
Of course I have little sypmathy for the lazy morbidly obese people that have horrible fatty/salty diets (and always seem to wear flip flops when their feet really need to most supportive shoes they could get), but I realize it's probably harder for them to limit their calories and enjoy excercise the way I do.
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the goat
climber
north central WA
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Oct 12, 2011 - 04:19pm PT
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calories in, calories out Easy for JD to say, skinny little runt. Next time I see him cragging (as long as it's close to the car) I'm going to sit on him while eating a Snickers......king size of course.
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Mike Friedrichs
Sport climber
City of Salt
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Oct 12, 2011 - 05:19pm PT
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Tradmanclimbs, I'll bet that you are white, above poverty. I would even guess that you had two parents and probably went to college.
As a group, climbers aren't usually lacking in self esteem or self efficacy. We're a pretty confident bunch. It takes confidence to criticize how other people that you've never met climb on a public forum. But many people lack support, lack social structures and have serious esteem issues. Obesity disproportionately effects racial and ethnic minorities, low income, and low education.
Sure, obesity is related to personal behavior. But society has a lot to do with choices we make about our personal behaviors. The largest increase in obesity happens between 3rd and 5th grade. Do those kids get to choose what they eat and how much physical activity they get? The same scumbag corporations that are hooking kids on tobacco are also hooking them on soda and fast food - prime ingredients for a lifetime of obesity and diabetes.
Compounding the problem is the way we've engineered physical activity out of our lives. How many of you walked or rode your bike to work today? Yeah, I thought so. Even better, how many of you walked your kid to school today?
It's pretty easy to drive your Suburu's to the crag after work, knock off a few pitches and then criticize the poor overweight minority person who is working two full-time jobs, trying to provide a better life for his/her child. These people don't feel empowered to change their lives. Have some empathy.
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