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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 01:41pm PT
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The soloist, I have one for cheap if someone wants it, was too fiddly to me with the little jaw flopping around on a cord and requiring a chest harness.
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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Sep 16, 2011 - 01:54pm PT
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Ditto on the loops helping the device feed properly. It can get pretty frustrating if you don't do that.
I have used (and continue to use) both the Soloist and the SP. Both do the job with a similar amount of hassle. The only serious drawback to either would be the lack of the Soloist's ability to catch some falls. But backups will keep that from being a capital offense, and backups should be used regardless.
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Slabby D
Trad climber
B'ham WA
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:11pm PT
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You are obviously going to get a lot of different responses about how to configure your whole system.
The bets advice might be to really think hard about what your doing, how much redundancy you require and develop a system that you then can implement consistently.
Couple points
When you first start, it will feel like 90% rope management and 10% climbing and really won't be much fun. After doing a lot of pitches and walls with my SP it's gotten back to almost the reverse, feels like 80% climbing and 20% rope management. Regardless rope soloing will always have a large helping of engineering project vs climbing involved.
If you're having rope feed issues, yer doing it wrong. Proper management of a backup loop not only gives you redundancy should the SP fail but is also critical to providing smooth rope feed by balancing the weight on each side of the device. Done correctly (and using a rope that isn't overly slick or skinny) you can avoid the entire of issue of slack developing in the system that requires tieing the rope off mid-pitch and so forth.
FWIW I clip the SP directly into my belay loop with a single locking carabiner. I use a DMM Zodiac which is 80% stronger than any other AL locker on the market and rated to at least 12kn in crossload. I use a single backup knot at a time, figure 8 on an identical biner. I don't mind hanging on gear to fiddle with knots, it's just part of the process.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:15pm PT
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Where the hell is the OP? Some of the best responses I have seen on one of these threads. Thanks you guys.
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JeffR
Trad climber
Cayucos, CA
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:23pm PT
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tolman_paul, I used a Soloist for years and had no problems with the safety of the system, but like James said, the floppy jaw and the complexity of the thing was a hassle. I'm nearsighted, so I couldn't see to put it together without taking off my glasses.
The Silent Partner is much easier to use, albeit twice as expensive...
There's also the chest-harness factor, which I hated.
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Norwegian
Trad climber
Placerville, California
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:31pm PT
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i have traveled a lot with my silent partner,
and trial and error have led me to this current setup:
the double lockers on your harness are necessary to keep the s.p. in its proper positon for feeding the rope.
the cluster of clove's on my harness is not so much for backup but for managing my slack, and also keeping the rope weight off the s.p. too much rope hanging on the device will cinch the clove hitch up and impede your vertical dream.
if you stack all of your slack on your harness (some folks use a backpack) then you can climb the whole rope out without ever having to pull up slack coils while climbing. i've tried both and found it easier to have the whole rope with you from the beginning.
lots of hassles accompany this system. you have to keep a constant eye on how the slack is flowing. tangles lead to the system locking up; and this usually happens at very inopportune moments.
brush up on your swear words cause you'll need alot. she (s.p.) seems to respond well to pirate talk.
edit to note:
i've whipped about 25 feet onto my system without any grief (well a little grief in the form of holy shite!)
edit a few action shots:
believe in me cause i don't belive in myself.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:44pm PT
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No way I could do it like that. My stoney brain would explode.
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sac
Trad climber
Sun Coast B.C.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:45pm PT
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Been meaning to "go for a spin" w/ mine since I got it...over a year ago.
This is great info. Thanks!
Seeing how my current partner bailed on me... get this: TO GO PAY HIS TAXES!!... yeah I know....
I might just have to get out there w/SP.
... I'm sure the OP is sitting back, chillin', like a villin', and making (mental) notes! YEAH!
Cheers!
A.
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Norwegian
Trad climber
Placerville, California
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Sep 16, 2011 - 02:56pm PT
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my rope is way old and beat to hell, like it's driver.
no problem feeding thru the s.p.
one pain in the arse though is the rope gets so twisted from the running clove hitch that eventually it wont even feed thru the s.p.
when it gets this bad, i try to free-dangle it down a long pitch and let it wiggle its way untwisted.
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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Sep 16, 2011 - 03:11pm PT
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The reason I ask about the SP is I have a soloist, and have had it pretty much since they hit the market. It's not a perfect device, but I've rarely found it lacking for my needs, which have been 5.9 and easier rock, and WI 3 and easier when leading, the hardest aid my head can handle, and up to whatever I'm willing to attempt on tr. I don't get on overhanging stuff, and the chest harness isn't a deal killer.
But as I'm a gear nut, I'm always debating an upgrade ;)
It just seems like the rope management with the the SP is a real goat rope, no pun intended, well maybe a slight pu. Then again, I have gotten to the top of an ice climb and found that I'd put the rope backwards into the soloist, hence I was going to alot of effort and had no belay. Needless to say, I'm a bit more careful in checking which end the rope runs into the soloist. I haven't used backup loops on the soloist, something I should start to incorporate, but then you get into the rope managament goat rope.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 05:33pm PT
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Ekat,
Is there any issue with using say a burly steel locker instead of two whatever other kind? Like maybe damage to the "ears" due to the extra space available for the locker to move if it came under high impact. Does that make any sense?
Edit: anyone else this question to.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Sep 16, 2011 - 05:39pm PT
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Tolman Paul, nice ice shot, but you CANNOT use the Silent Partner below freezing. Blinny will tell you, if that cylindrical centrifuge cylinder is frozen, your ass will be grass in a fall, while in the cold the soloist will still lock up tighter than Michelle Bachmans husbands butthole at a gay mens convention. (as long as you are not upside down of course)
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 05:49pm PT
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man, another good post. Thanks.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 05:51pm PT
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Thanks, thats very cool.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 08:23pm PT
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Bump for Ekats' answer
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Norwegian
Trad climber
Placerville, California
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Sep 16, 2011 - 08:38pm PT
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the size of the hole in the "ears" of the s.p.
promotes redundancy in the belay structure.
if you run one beaner (steel or otherwise),
the slop in the "ear" hole
lets the s.p. rotate and therefore doesn't feed well.
if you attach the s.p. to the belay loop, it essentially
rotates the device ninety degrees.
with the device oriented the way in my picture,
the rope is always feeding from left to right (from the
drivers perspective). if the unit was spun, as it would
be attached to your belay loop, then the flow would be funky.
i think that might be three sense. i'll donate the surplus cent.
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Norwegian
Trad climber
Placerville, California
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Sep 16, 2011 - 08:53pm PT
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one problem i've found with the device
is that loose ends on your harness or rack,
ie leg loop straps, slings, stoppers
get pulled into the spinning parts and
seizes the knot and thus stops the flow.
you must secure leg loop strap excess, chalk back straps, etc
or anything else that could get stuck in there
one disgusting story regarding cause i've no esteem or shame
is one time i was working at our strawberry cabin and finished
my chores early so decided to get a route in at the leap.
as all i had were work jeans, and the day was 90 plus high,
i wanted some shorts. i had none but i found some of my wifes.
so i wore them, though they were on the short-short side, i figured they would be more comfortable than jeans.
wrong was i as the short-shorts became even shorter when cramped under my harness and my soft inner-leg flesh and ahhhmm, other venerable parts were constantly being pulled into the rope knot. it was totally horrible.
so never wear your wife or girlfriends shorts while running this belay.
edit:
i should state that the above referenced "problem" is not one of the device but more one of driver error. i really have found NO problems with this belay system. it's smokin and i hope i can still find one once mine wears out.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 09:00pm PT
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I attach to the belay loop as per Dave T. recommend. It allows the whole device to rotate and feed no matter what weird position. Just drop on it and test the hang so to speak to make sure it doesn't hit your face. I have the same problem with my wall harness, the only one I use with the SP.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 09:02pm PT
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Norg, I will definitely put that top of the list.
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James Doty
Trad climber
Phoenix, Az.
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Sep 16, 2011 - 09:08pm PT
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No but I used to live and work in the Palm Desert area. Worked with and did a couple trips with the Bird but none of the benefit parties or anything. Something I will have to rectify in the future.
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