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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Jun 19, 2011 - 10:49pm PT
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No, by all accounts...
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WBraun
climber
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Jun 19, 2011 - 11:05pm PT
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Yep ...
That's how to do it.
You just watch this video and you'll be able to float any off-width in the country .....
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Darwin
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Jun 19, 2011 - 11:16pm PT
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I know we're dissing the question, but I thought it was a pretty darn good for an online video compared to say:
http://www.todaysbigthing.com/2011/03/28
I've heard about that crack at PG, but 5.9????
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213
climber
Where the Froude number often >> 1
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Jun 20, 2011 - 01:29am PT
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I say go to the Valley and work through the Hardman OW circuit. I can't imagine how climbing a 20' tall gym 5.9 (so in reality 5.7+) wide crack could possibly prepare you for the fun you will encounter on the Sentinel...you may as well read a book and expect to do it c2c in 6hrs!
good luck!
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Jun 20, 2011 - 02:26pm PT
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No wonder OW is so damn hard--You have to listen to Blood Metal to be able to crank that stuff. I guess that's the real secret.
In the SummitPost post, the OP says, "It nicely shows some of the techniques needed for such climbing."
This much is true, it does show some of the techniques that you might use in wide cracks. I think there's good shots of the footwork. Crazy hand-stacking. And watch that tape job!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jun 20, 2011 - 04:32pm PT
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I've wasted so much time; I'm in!
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nutjob
Gym climber
Berkeley, CA
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Jun 20, 2011 - 04:40pm PT
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I'll bet lots of people who can succeed on SS couldn't do 40 clean laps on the PGSF wide cracks in a whole day if you paid them $1000.
If you can cruise the PGSF wide all day long (throw in some of the fist pitches to shake it up), and you've done all-day 5.8/5.9 climbs outside, I'd bet on SS success. Or at least a good story with pics for us.
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Zander
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Jun 20, 2011 - 11:44pm PT
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Both sides of the OW at that gym are harder than anything on the SS. But it is 1,760 feet shorter than the SS, which might have some bearing on the question.
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Srbphoto
climber
Kennewick wa
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Jun 20, 2011 - 11:46pm PT
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Is that why there weren't any good OW climbers before Youtube?
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Dave Davis
Social climber
Seattle, WA
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Jun 29, 2011 - 07:58pm PT
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As far as I can remember(and that was quite some time ago) there really isn't any offwidth climbing on the Steck Salathe. Lots of chimneys and hand cracks, but I thought by definition an offwidth is bigger than a fist and too small to get into. One would do better to practice on a few flares where its usually easier, but a bit more unnerving to climb on the outside rather than burrow in the back.
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Alexey
Trad climber
San Jose, CA
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Jun 29, 2011 - 08:31pm PT
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There is almost no ow climbing in SS. Most of the hard pitches is chimney and flares.
The best training for SS is to watch as many as you can online movies for climbing chimneys and flares
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PellucidWombat
Mountain climber
Berkeley, CA
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Jun 30, 2011 - 07:58pm PT
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I filmed a few laps on two different occasions. The first time I brought a camera to film a bit to better see my technique (it's kind of hard to really know what you're doing with your own legs since you can't see them - just climbing by feel).
Then I got carried away with ideas from that and brought the camera back later to get some other angles that would show things better (e.g. the hand stacks from above). I intend to add more descriptions of what I'm doing in those video links later.
The version with the music really was meant to be a joke. Note the hyperbole & Monty Python references :-D
Regarding the OW rating, none of the employees at that gym have ever been able to tell me what it is 'supposed' to be. It used to seem really hard, but once the technique 'clicked' for me and I did a few OWs outside (e.g. Generator twice) I decided 5.9 is a fair rating if you have the basic techniques down since all the moves are secure and you can rest anywhere in it and even downclimb it without too much problem. It's a bit easier than Bongs Away, Center (5.10a), and I can do laps on it, change directions mid-height, and climb it facing left-side in. Climbing on the other side of the opening is much harder but not as hard as Generator Crack (so maybe that side is 5.10b?).
Coming from someone just starting to get into the wide, I'd say the crack is good practice, but limited in techniques - even the harder side does little to test you on flares. Speaking of which, has anyone done the 5.8 Churchbowl Terrace chimney? Now that's a fun flare! Can anyone tell me how that relates to the nature of SS?
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scuffy b
climber
dissected alluvial deposits, late Pleistocene
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Jun 30, 2011 - 08:09pm PT
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Those are pretty cool videos.
They show things pretty well.
Regarding your original intent, I would bet that what you saw was awfully
close to what you felt.
Myself, I like to keep going with armbars on that crack, never messing
around with the stacks, but it's interesting to see the variation in
preferences.
This crack is the real deal, so to speak, there are plenty of 5.9 wide
cracks on rock that are easier than this.
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PellucidWombat
Mountain climber
Berkeley, CA
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Jun 30, 2011 - 08:14pm PT
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by the way, the segment near the end of the joke video with the other guy blasting up the crack - he is climbing the hard side, which has a slight outward flare that spits you out. I found resting in that side is easier if you turn slightly sideways to better jam your feet deeper into the flare.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Often I see handstacks being done when all they do is return you to the old regressive point of view of facing the rock and hanging off of it largely disconnected from it---as you more or less do in face climbing and as is more intuitive and natural for people. Meanwhile you lose valuable connection.... I think many are getting confused and attracted by the idea of stacks too as if they were some panacea; they actually are rarely used outdoors on lead to the best effect and are really about special problem solving. As Scuffy says, it is usually much more important to maintain rhythm, form and a deeper one-sided position; stacks also require a knee or thigh lock or no overhanging conditions to the crack in order for you to advance----and if you can get a knee or even a thigh in there like that, you actually don't have much of a problem in front of you. I rarely found them to be a smart idea, especially on lead. Most offwidths are overhanging too.
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cms
climber
toyota, tacoma
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youre f^@&ing trolling me right??
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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man, think of the gas money I could have saved....
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scuffy b
climber
dissected alluvial deposits, late Pleistocene
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Oh, Peter, I think stacking is more useful and versatile than you realize.
Surely, I see stacking done in instances where it is not the most efficient
move, but there are plenty of times where a good knee combined with a good
stack can make a stretch of crack go more quickly and easily, even on
overhanging sections.
I think that to a large part our tendencies are a matter of habit. I did
most of my learning in corners and before I knew about stacking, and I
really grooved my stroke through a lot of repetition. So, I think of
armbars as the norm and stacks as special.
Many folks simply have the opposite perspective.
That said, I do think, in agreement with you, that stacking is often over
used.
I'm big on rules of thumb (they're made to be broken) and here's one that I
like: Stacks are most suited to straight in cracks, armbars are most suited
to corners. Everyone should be well versed in both in order to know why
an exception might be made.
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