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Jerry Dodrill
climber
Sebastopol, CA
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Jan 29, 2011 - 07:48am PT
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Climbing photography/videography needs to be held to the standards set by, say, Galen Rowell. If Team Lama comes away with less footage than they wanted, that may be a fortuitous outcome.
By that standard they would need to take pictures of themselves, or have a photographer as a "participatory" member of the climbing team, a concept not likely with this big production shoot, but a high ideal indeed.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Jan 29, 2011 - 10:05am PT
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Rap bolted routes are the lift assisted skiing of the climbing world. everything in it's own time and place. See many lift towers in the back country?
My inner ego is strong brother.
That's why we love you, Coz!
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the kid
Trad climber
fayetteville, wv
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Jan 29, 2011 - 10:08am PT
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jhedge, i have to disagree that a bolt is a bolt.
sounds good on paper, but style still means something and in this media age, style may be the last thing that the modern climber can stand out against the media crush. which would be very cool to see this generation committing to the style that i grew up with a respected to my core..
i have ground up countless routes, some death, some fun. i have also rap bolted countless routes and most of those fade from memory quicker than the repeat..
style matters to those who are interested in style, style also shows the person climbing that route a small taste of the FA party..
this sport has been so dumbed down, that it would be refreshing to see style and ethics make a come back..
but hey that's just my opinion..
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Disaster Master
Social climber
Born in So-Cal, left my soul in far Nor-Cal.
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Jan 29, 2011 - 12:17pm PT
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The Kid:i have ground up countless routes, some death, some fun. i have also rap bolted countless routes and most of those fade from memory quicker than the repeat..
Good point. Of all the routes I have put up, the ground up ones are the best in my mind. And I have NOTHING against rap-bolting if done well.
Some of my rap-bolted lines are remembered as classic because the moves / feature just rocks. They get climbed a lot more than other lines I put up ground up. I have had people pleed with me to bolt some of my trad lines. "The climbings so good, but the gear is scary!"
Well, I started at the bottom and got to the top on that one ground up. So it stays that way. To bolt it would be to kill part of my past. Even though I really want people to climb it and experience the moves, it's not woth the sacrifice of boldness for fun sometimes.
The climbs I remember the fondest are often dispised by those who try and repete them. To them it is "Unnessicarily scary". To me it is a line in stone that once measured my resolve. Love those!
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Jan 29, 2011 - 12:48pm PT
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Don't forget that we have Rolo and Chris Geisler and Mikey on scene. I have never met Rolo, but have read his stuff. I've climbed with Chris and he is a solid climber and a straight shooter. And Mikey will keep us apprised.
Those three and others are sure to look out for the rock, and for us.
In the meantime, keeps those cards and letters sent to the sponsors. Write the sponsors directly. While the Red Bull people are not climbers and just don't "get it", the climbing gear manufacturers most assuredly do.
Superb photo, Mikey - "monkeys are sending!"
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gee double
climber
victor idaho
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I hope Lama free climbs it... and soon after someone on sight's it! Good Luck!
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james williamson
climber
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I agree with the original Kid, "F#+@!ck that kid", and the guy before that said to "pound" the guy and his crew. It's dangerous ground to annoint a "rock cop" squad, but as climbers, we as a community must play a role in protecting those places that few will ever get to. To be a little judgemental, some don't belong or deserve to be there. There could be many reasons why they should not be there, but perhaps the most important might be a lack of respect or appreciation for what it means to be there and what the setting represents in a context broader than just the immediate.These tactics applied to The Captain or Marmolada represent something completely different. As it appears that the other parties have for two years attempted to make Lama understand the significance of the Tower and the negative impact His project would have,and that such obvious overwhelming public sentiment has not encouraged him to consider that virtually everyone in the world with knowledge of the situation thinks it is a bad idea, he appears to be a sociopath who will not be deterred. F#!+K that guy, pound his ass and forget waitin for him to get it.
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bruce kaufman
climber
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My first post on Supertopo: a letter submitted through the Red Bull comment page.
"It has come to my attention that David Lama and his Red Bull sponsors plan to place climbing bolts on Cerro Torre during rappel. This act is not supported by the vast majority of Alpinists in the world or by any environmentalist that I know. Placing bolts on historic and idyllic massifs such as Cerro Torre leaves scars that cannot be erased. Moreover, it stands against decades of clean climbing ethics and an alpinist ideal akin to leave no trace. Just because it’s possible to film in this location doesn’t mean that it should be done. Please respect the wishes of the majority and cancel any plans to film with David Lama at Cerro Torre."
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atchafalaya
Boulder climber
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Speaking on behalf of a fictional majority really isn't that persuasive, and what decades of clean climbing practices are you referring to?
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Klimbien
Trad climber
Orange Walk, Belize
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This is the reply from RedBull after I submitted an email to them.
...Thanks for sending us your concern.
David Lama is back in Patagonia climbing the Cerro Torre. Due to bad weather, the undertaking and film production had to be stopped last year. The entire shoulder and wall has been cleaned of our and older material which was found. Only one haul bag and 30 bolts, which had do be used due to falling ice and to protect the main climbing route, had been left. For the completion of the production, the film crew will refrain from using any further bolts and remove the existing ones as part of this years attempt. We know David Lama as a responsible climber, support his undertaking and know that he will refrain from any unnecessary and incorrect steps.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to give us a call at 1(877)673-9444.
Regards,
Emily
Red Bull
http://www.redbullusa.com
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Dickbob
climber
Colorado
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Feb 10, 2011 - 04:52am PT
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Klimbien,
Word for word I received the exact same response from Emily
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rolo
climber
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Feb 13, 2011 - 08:47am PT
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Three days ago Canadians Chris Geisler and Jason Kruk came mighty close to pulling off a "fair means" ascent of the SE ridge of Cerro Torre. They reached a point 40 meters from the top of the headwall without touching any of Maestri's Compressor routes bolts -they might have used a couple on belays, but none on progression. Very F... impressive. Chris lead on the headwall through the night, spending 8 hours on one of the pitches. Hearing the description first hand was priceless. Hat's off to them for such a good go at it!
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Feb 13, 2011 - 08:58am PT
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Wow! what an impressive effort.
What stopped them?
Did they continue on bolts or descend?
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Disaster Master
Social climber
Born in So-Cal, left my soul in far Nor-Cal.
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Feb 13, 2011 - 12:08pm PT
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rolo
climber Feb 13, 2011 - 05:47am PT
Three days ago Canadians Chris Geisler and Jason Kruk came mighty close to pulling off a "fair means" ascent of the SE ridge of Cerro Torre. They reached a point 40 meters from the top of the headwall without touching any of Maestri's Compressor routes bolts
Could someone post details or a link to info when avail? That sounds VERY interesting...
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Johnny K.
climber
Southern,California
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Feb 13, 2011 - 12:10pm PT
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What Paul said!
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bmacd
Social climber
100% Canadian
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Feb 13, 2011 - 08:26pm PT
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Chris Geisler: Back intact. We climbed to the Torre headwall in 1.5 days, sessioned the headwall for a night, got to 20' left of compressor itself on variants, wind picked up so we split, worked....In BA, home tomorrow night.
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shipoopoi
Big Wall climber
oakland
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Feb 13, 2011 - 11:34pm PT
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hmmm, interesting thread here. i think lama should be free to rap bolt it, as long as he does not use fixed lines. good freaking luck in that weather. and hold off on the film crew until the thing actually gets freed, then pose down for it. and lama is missing the real point, until he actually sees the headwall up close, how does he know what he's dealing with. might the maestri bolt ladder be the actual line of free ascent, as is the case with many bolt ladders, they connect the natural features of the rock. i think the future of the maestri route is to do the free varaiations pioneered by brits, wharton, and smith, and then try to free climb the actual bolt ladder. maybe there does not need to be another bolt line.
and by the way, some colorado boys did the ffa of the torre via the ferrari route back in the day, free climbing the torre is so last millinieum.
also, the rap route down from the shoulder is totally viable. it replaces a very dangerous rapell route that had only one bolt on some anchors. i had thought previously how nice it would be to have these backed up or replaced.
steve schneider
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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So I'm waitin' for my samwich (jamon y queso) in El Chalten and, being a multi-tasker, I
start to peruse the bulletin board. Also, being a tool freak, my eye is immediately
drawn to this cool looking unit:
You could save some weight by ditching the wheels... jess sayin'.
I was thinkin' Weld_It could substiture skis for the wheels on K2.
The natives were not amused!
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