Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
tom woods
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:10pm PT
|
2-3 feet loweer? Bolt no bolt, no big deal in my opinion, but there is a bomber #4 BD (maybe a 5 I don't remember) stopper placement probably right next to the new bolt.
You stick the stopper in sideways. there a 3/4 inch slot that tapers but it's shallow. It also has a lip on it so the stopper does not fall out.
I'm serious, you should check it out. I'd love a second opinion.
The placement was about 2-3 feet below the old bolt, so you didn't need it, but I'd stop to place it any way to keep my gear creativity skills sharp.
Tom
|
|
tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:11pm PT
|
As I recall, a #0 tcu works fine for protecting the nucracker mantle, and I also fail to see how that move gets the reputation it does.
|
|
cmclean
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:15pm PT
|
Tom that's funny. Twice I've looked at that spot and thought "some small stopper HAS to fit there," tinkered around with my #5 and never gotten it to stick, and finally left it there thinking "that's purely psychological pro." I brought my #4 HB offset on Saturday to test it out (I bet it would have worked perfectly) but didn't bother trying since the bolt was just a couple moves further up.
|
|
Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:19pm PT
|
paul-
i think peeps pul the mantle just fine but screw up the traverse step into the final slab, and since the last piece you get was back at the mantle, it fails to keep people from the slab below.
and i think it gets the reputation from the double compound fractures, but i could be wrong about that...
|
|
tom woods
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:23pm PT
|
the stopper is sideways, the number faces the rock and the curved side faces out toward the climber. It's sweet.
If they moved the bolt there, maybe the argument changes.
Tom
|
|
Kindredlion
Big Wall climber
4hrs too far from YNP
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:24pm PT
|
the bolt was not there last mth... it was wet.. and that pitch was still bomber..
why chop it if you can flatten it?... so much less work..
seriusly.. i put it there... its for a new wave aid line i was trying to free... i'm above that now... it goes...
choppin brocolley?
why not just install a dozen crash pads? mark the bolt with orange spray paint? tick it with chalk? sheesh.. or u could just clip it, or not... stfu and climb.. pass me a kobra on your way ..
|
|
punjab
Gym climber
oregon
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 08:24pm PT
|
i agree with tom, have done the route numerous times and place a nut first. don't remember the size but probably an offset. oh, and that BOLT SHOULD GO, part of the fun of the climb is the run-out pin-scar pinching...and if one is not confident on that terain they have no buisness with being on it, go climb superslide...
|
|
k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 09:59pm PT
|
"restoring the route to the thin nailing it was for the first ascent."
klaus, you figure that one out and you're a hero.
ION, I heard it was Zach who drilled the new bolt...
PS. It's so ironic that the crack is called Serenity. First the scaring, then the ugly chop, and now this.
|
|
crazyfingers
climber
CA
|
|
|
Apr 28, 2008 - 10:05pm PT
|
Are people climbing just the first pitch and then coming down?
I agree that there are options for bomber pro at the same level as where the bolt is and that section of rock is not the crux of the route, or even the pitch.
Placing the bolt there is obviously dumbing down the route and seems to only make things safer for the folks who maybe shouldn't be there at all.
Making climbing safer is a tricky matter. I don't want to see anyone get hurt, but making climbing safe is lame.
I'm sure I am now doomed to deck on the first pitch of Serenity...
|
|
nx
climber
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 01:31pm PT
|
I'm not sure why the bolder, stronger climbers have more right to climb Serenity. You're not really going to impress good climbers with that lead. I thought that bolt was there to get you past the junk at the bottom. I don't see special appeal about that runout.
Here's how a guy I know broke his back on a different climb: Place bad pro at 15 ft, fall at 20 ft, gear tugs, inverts you and pulls out. I thought the low pro on Serenity was crap - but I have no confidence.
|
|
Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 01:40pm PT
|
Just curious about this... I posted it elsewhere and got no response.
So, are there ethics to chopping? I think there should be. For instance in the threads talking about this Zach character, it's mentioned that's he's planning on chopping routes he can't climb. What kinda sh#t is that? I, for one, feel that if you can't do the route legitimately, you have no business even thinking about chopping.
Basically, I think rap chopping is as bad as rap bolting. Anyone else have an opinion on this? Oh yeah, I don't recall the bolt being there late last season either.
|
|
Forest
Trad climber
Tucson, AZ
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 01:49pm PT
|
Here's how a guy I know broke his back on a different climb: Place bad pro at 15 ft, fall at 20 ft, gear tugs, inverts you and pulls out.
If anything, momentary pro should pull you upright, not invert you. Unless you've got your leg on the wrong side of the rope.
What am I missing?
|
|
nx
climber
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 02:36pm PT
|
If you hang from your harness you end up more or less horizontal, so the tug from gear will also usually take you off your feet. Also tripping happens (there are good trips and bad trips).
|
|
Matt
Trad climber
primordial soup
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 02:45pm PT
|
why not just take a chisel and create a perfect handcrack?
that mo-fo would be 5.7
of course some 5.6 climber would want to see a bolt there anyway
|
|
Nefarius
Big Wall climber
Fresno, CA
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 02:49pm PT
|
Up to the bolt isn't much harder than 5.7... Low angle, good feet, etc...
|
|
Mr_T
Trad climber
Somewhere, CA
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 08:09pm PT
|
A true stone master spends their 10d days running it out on Greasy But Groovy, and can't be bothered with the Serenity traffic jam. There are so many awesome intermediate and hard routes in Yos with crap pro, why does some jerk have to go bashing one of the trade lines (that keep all those crowds occupied)? They have all of Tuolumne to keep them busy with poorly pro'd 10d's. Perhaps the chopper isn't strong enough for all those R's and X's and feels they have to cut down a 10a pitch to feel tough?
|
|
Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 09:15pm PT
|
Does that mean that the latest new bolt on Double Cross (J-Tree) should stay?
|
|
crazyfingers
climber
CA
|
|
|
Apr 29, 2008 - 11:19pm PT
|
The difficulty rating of the route is immaterial.
What should matter most is that the bolt is in a spot where good protection can easily be placed and it's a section of the route that is easy climbing compared to the rest.
Even sport routes get run-out in the sections of climbing where the difficulty drops off.
|
|
climbrunride
Trad climber
Durango, CO
|
|
|
Apr 30, 2008 - 01:52am PT
|
Once again, I don't get it. Why are all these people speaking up so strongly now, saying that the bolt should not be there. Just because it was briefly missing? Where were they for the last 20 years? And why did it not matter to them until now?
Here's another thing which makes no sense to me about this whole thing: The third pitch has a string of thin pin scars with much harder climbing through them. You have to climb a little ways between really thin protection and really poor protection. But no one is up in arms about THAT pitch! Is complaining just a matter of convenience?
|
|
AllezAllez510
Trad climber
PDX, OR
|
|
|
Apr 30, 2008 - 09:04am PT
|
There's a bolt on Double Cross? Where? Why? Wasn't there three months ago...If true that's f-n lame.
If I recall, the bolt on Serenity was welcome less because of the difficulty of the moves and more because of the green slime in the pin scars I was climbing.
I thought the pro on the third pitch was pretty bomber. It was good enough to catch me. Twice. Ugh.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!