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couchmaster

climber
Jan 16, 2017 - 12:52pm PT


This should get interesting. http://www.yescalifornia.org/ Hope you all don't build a wall to keep us fourflushers out of Yosemite.




" THE CASE FOR INDEPENDENCE IN 9 SIMPLE POINTS
Being a U.S. state is no longer serving California’s best interests. On issues ranging from peace and security to natural resources and the environment, it has become increasingly true that California would be better off as an independent country. Here’s a summary of why we think so.

1. PEACE AND SECURITY
The U.S. Government spends more on its military than the next several countries combined. Not only is California forced to subsidize this massive military budget with our taxes, but Californians are sent off to fight in wars that often do more to perpetuate terrorism than to abate it. The only reason terrorists might want to attack us is because we are part of the United States and are guilty by association. Not being a part of that country will make California a less likely target of retaliation by its enemies.

2. ELECTIONS AND GOVERNMENT
California’s electoral votes haven’t affected a presidential election since 1876. On top of that, presidential election results are often known before our votes are even counted. So, why should we keep subjecting ourselves to presidents we play no role in electing, to 382 representatives and 98 senators we can’t vote for, and all the government officials and federal judges appointed by those very same people we don’t elect.

3. TRADE AND REGULATION
The U.S. Government maintains a burdensome trade system that hurts California’s economy by making trade more difficult and more expensive for California’s businesses. As long as California remains within this burdensome trade system, we will never be able to capitalize on the trade and investment opportunities that would be available to us as an independent country. On top of that, the United States is dragging California into the Trans-Pacific Partnership agreement which conflicts with our values.

4. DEBT AND TAXES
Since 1987, California has been subsidizing the other states at a loss of tens and sometimes hundreds of billions of dollars in a single fiscal year. As a result, we are often forced to raise taxes and charge fees in California, and borrow money from the future to make up the difference. This is partly why California presently has some of the highest taxes in the country, and so much debt. Independence means that all of our taxes will be kept in California based on the priorities we set, and we will be able to do so while repaying our debts and phasing out the current state income tax.

5. IMMIGRATION
California is the most diverse state in the United States and that is something we are proud of. This diversity is a central part of our culture and an indispensable part of our economy. As a U.S. state, our immigration system was largely designed by the 49 other states thirty years ago. This immigration system has since neglected the needs of the California economy and has hurt too many California families. Independence means California will be able to decide what immigration policies make sense for our diverse and unique population, culture, and economy, and that we’ll be able to build an immigration system that is consistent with our values.

6. NATURAL RESOURCES
Certain minerals and other natural resources like coal, oil, and natural gas are being extracted from California at below market value rates by private corporations with the permission of the U.S. Government. While a small portion of the revenue is shared with us, our share has been withheld during times of sequestration. That means the U.S. Government is paying their debts with royalties collected from selling off California’s natural resources. Independence means we will gain control of the 46% of California that is currently owned by the U.S. Government and its agencies. We will therefore take control of our natural resources and be the sole beneficiary of royalties collected if and when they are extracted from our lands.

7. THE ENVIRONMENT
California is a global leader on environmental issues. However, as long as the other states continue debating whether or not climate change is real, they will continue holding up real efforts to reduce carbon emissions. The truth is this country accounts for less than five percent of the world’s population yet consumes one-third of the world’s paper, a quarter of the world’s oil, 27 percent of the aluminum, 23 percent of the coal, and 19 percent of the copper. Independence means California will be able to negotiate treaties to not only reduce the human impact on our climate but also to help build global resource sustainability.

8. HEALTH AND MEDICINE
The Affordable Care Act was enacted by the U.S. Government to lower the cost of health care and expand health insurance coverage to the uninsured, yet millions of Californians still lack access to quality health care because they can’t afford it. For many, access to hospitals and medicine is a life or death issue. Independence means we can fund the health care programs we want and ensure everyone has access to the medicines they need because our taxes will no longer be subsidizing other states. Finally, California can join the rest of the industrialized world in guaranteeing health care as a universal right for all of our people.

9. EDUCATION
California has some of the best universities but in various ways, our schools are among the worst in the country. Not only does this deprive our children of the education they deserve, but it also costs taxpayers billions in social services and law enforcement expenses linked to lacking opportunities resulting from poor education. Independence means we will be able to fully fund public education, rebuild and modernize public schools, and pay public school teachers the salaries they deserve. On top of that, independence means freedom from federal education policies and one-size-fits-all standards set by political appointees on the other side of the continent."

AP

Trad climber
Calgary
Jan 16, 2017 - 01:28pm PT
Maybe it is time to carve out some of the Western States and Provinces.
The new country could be called ClimberStan and it would consist of:
California
Oregon
Washington
BC
Alberta
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 16, 2017 - 02:42pm PT
I'd never read this before. I don't think you can, without immediately understanding the intelligence behind the words. Remarkable.

Letter From Birmingham Jail
King's famous letter, published in The Atlantic as "The Negro Is Your Brother" several months after its original writing, was written in response to a public statement of concern and caution issued by eight white religious leaders of the South. It stands as one of the classic documents of the civil-rights movement.

While confined here in the Birmingham city jail, I came across your recent statement calling our present activities "unwise and untimely." Seldom, if ever, do I pause to answer criticism of my work and ideas. If I sought to answer all of the criticisms that cross my desk, my secretaries would be engaged in little else in the course of the day, and I would have no time for constructive work. But since I feel that you are men of genuine good will and your criticisms are sincerely set forth, I would like to answer your statement in what I hope will be patient and reasonable terms.

I think I should give the reason for my being in Birmingham, since you have been influenced by the argument of "outsiders coming in"

I am in Birmingham because injustice is here ...I am cognizant of the interrelatedness of all communities and states. I cannot sit idly by in Atlanta and not be concerned about what happens in Birmingham. Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. We are caught in an inescapable network of mutuality, tied in a single garment of destiny. Whatever affects one directly affects all indirectly. Never again can we afford to live with the narrow, provincial "outside agitator" idea. Anyone who lives inside the United States can never be considered an outsider ...


We have waited for more than three hundred and forty years for our God-given and constitutional rights. The nations of Asia and Africa are moving with jetlike speed toward the goal of political independence, and we still creep at horse-and-buggy pace toward the gaining of a cup of coffee at a lunch counter. I guess it is easy for those who have never felt the stinging darts of segregation to say "wait." But when you have seen vicious mobs lynch your mothers and fathers at will and drown your sisters and brothers at whim; when you have seen hate-filled policemen curse, kick, brutalize, and even kill your black brothers and sisters with impunity; when you see the vast majority of your twenty million Negro brothers smothering in an airtight cage of poverty in the midst of an affluent society; when you suddenly find your tongue twisted and your speech stammering as you seek to explain to your six-year-old daughter why she cannot go to the public amusement park that has just been advertised on television, and see tears welling up in her little eyes when she is told that Funtown is closed to colored children, and see the depressing clouds of inferiority begin to form in her little mental sky, and see her begin to distort her little personality by unconsciously developing a bitterness toward white people; when you have to concoct an answer for a five-year-old son asking in agonizing pathos, "Daddy, why do white people treat colored people so mean?"; when you take a cross-country drive and find it necessary to sleep night after night in the uncomfortable corners of your automobile because no motel will accept you; when you are humiliated day in and day out by nagging signs reading "white" and "colored"; when your first name becomes "nigger" and your middle name becomes "boy" (however old you are) and your last name becomes "John," and when your wife and mother are never given the respected title "Mrs."; when you are harried by day and haunted by night by the fact that you are a Negro, living constantly at tiptoe stance, never quite knowing what to expect next, and plagued with inner fears and outer resentments; when you are forever fighting a degenerating sense of "nobodyness"--then you will understand why we find it difficult to wait. There comes a time when the cup of endurance runs over and men are no longer willing to be plunged into an abyss of injustice where they experience the bleakness of corroding despair. I hope, sirs, you can understand our legitimate and unavoidable impatience ...

You express a great deal of anxiety over our willingness to break laws. This is certainly a legitimate concern. Since we so diligently urge people to obey the Supreme Court's decision of 1954 outlawing segregation in the public schools, it is rather strange and paradoxical to find us consciously breaking laws. One may well ask, "How can you advocate breaking some laws and obeying others?" The answer is found in the fact that there are two types of laws: there are just laws, and there are unjust laws. I would agree with St. Augustine that "An unjust law is no law at all."


Now, what is the difference between the two? How does one determine when a law is just or unjust? A just law is a man-made code that squares with the moral law, or the law of God. An unjust law is a code that is out of harmony with the moral law. To put it in the terms of St. Thomas Aquinas, an unjust law is a human law that is not rooted in eternal and natural law. Any law that uplifts human personality is just. Any law that degrades human personality is unjust. All segregation statutes are unjust because segregation distorts the soul and damages the personality ...

There are some instances when a law is just on its face and unjust in its application. For instance, I was arrested Friday on a charge of parading without a permit. Now, there is nothing wrong with an ordinance which requires a permit for a parade, but when the ordinance is used to preserve segregation and to deny citizens the First Amendment privilege of peaceful assembly and peaceful protest, then it becomes unjust.

Of course, there is nothing new about this kind of civil disobedience. It was seen sublimely in the refusal of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego to obey the laws of Nebuchadnezzar because a higher moral law was involved. It was practiced superbly by the early Christians, who were willing to face hungry lions and the excruciating pain of chopping blocks before submitting to certain unjust laws of the Roman Empire. To a degree, academic freedom is a reality today because Socrates practiced civil disobedience.


We can never forget that everything Hitler did in Germany was "legal" and everything the Hungarian freedom fighters did in Hungary was "illegal." It was "illegal" to aid and comfort a Jew in Hitler's Germany. But I am sure that if I had lived in Germany during that time, I would have aided and comforted my Jewish brothers even though it was illegal. If I lived in a Communist country today where certain principles dear to the Christian faith are suppressed, I believe I would openly advocate disobeying these anti-religious laws ...

I have no fear about the outcome of our struggle in Birmingham, even if our motives are presently misunderstood. We will reach the goal of freedom in Birmingham and all over the nation, because the goal of America is freedom. Abused and scorned though we may be, our destiny is tied up with the destiny of America. Before the Pilgrims landed at Plymouth, we were here. Before the pen of Jefferson scratched across the pages of history the majestic word of the Declaration of Independence, we were here ...If the inexpressible cruelties of slavery could not stop us, the opposition we now face will surely fail. We will win our freedom because the sacred heritage of our nation and the eternal will of God are embodied in our echoing demands ...

Never before have I written a letter this long--or should I say a book? I'm afraid that it is much too long to take your precious time. I can assure you that it would have been much shorter if I had been writing from a comfortable desk, but what else is there to do when you are alone for days in the dull monotony of a narrow jail cell other than write long letters, think strange thoughts, and pray long prayers?

If I have said anything in this letter that is an overstatement of the truth and is indicative of an unreasonable impatience, I beg you to forgive me. If I have said anything in this letter that is an understatement of the truth and is indicative of my having a patience that makes me patient with anything less than brotherhood, I beg God to forgive me.

Yours for the cause of Peace and Brotherhood,
MARTIN LUTHER KING JR.
10b4me

Mountain climber
Retired
Jan 16, 2017 - 05:33pm PT
^^^ I'm sure that Wendell, bluering, and rick summer will have something to say about that.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 16, 2017 - 07:38pm PT
So here is the breakthrough. Conversion to this product, created in Ca, could have a major world-wide impact.

https://www.impossiblefoods.com/
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Jan 16, 2017 - 08:31pm PT
I miss celebrating George Washington and Abraham Lincoln B-days instead of the single generic presidents day. You got 2 full days with the government largely shut down and off your back. A working man could a lot done with that extra day.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 16, 2017 - 10:08pm PT
yeah, I'll bet you loved that FEDERAL GOVT IMPOSED law that REQUIRED private employers to give you a day off with pay, for which you did nothing.
Jon Beck

Trad climber
Oceanside
Jan 16, 2017 - 10:48pm PT
So let's just turn the drunk drivers loose to kill

What is the purpose of bail Wendell? do you know? Is the purpose of bail in misdemeanor cases really to protect the public as you seem to infer? I am curious about what you think it is.
Craig Fry

Trad climber
So Cal.
Jan 24, 2017 - 04:14pm PT
Thank Goodness we had good flood control engineering here in California

go Jerry!
Lollie

Social climber
I'm Lolli.
Jan 24, 2017 - 05:21pm PT
How does bail work? Do people get it back, if they do turn up in court?
couchmaster

climber
Jan 24, 2017 - 05:42pm PT
^^Lollie, to answer your question about bail, you have to pay money which you lose (forfeit) if you don't show up for court. If you do show up you get it back if you didn't borrow it, if you went through a bail bondsman they keep some of it for the service of the high risk loan. Via Bail Bondsmen there is a system in place where you can borrow a percentage (10/90 percent is common) to get out of jail. Essentially you borrow from someone named Guido if they think you will show up for court.

Watch "Dog the Bounty hunter" to see what occurs when you "jump" bail (ie - flee). It's a system which tends to favor the wealthy. It is so that good people who tripped on their dicks can get out pending a court hearing and still work their jobs and be part of their familys until the trial. In this country we are suppose to be Innocent until proven guilty. President Obama gifted this current President a new system of guilty until you are executed and you don't need no f*#king trial whereby he can even kill innocent American children though. Obama killed at least 2 that we know of. #shrugsshouldersnoonegivesaf*#k Of course, no one seemed to care about this but I suspect Trump will have them reconsidering this gift to him from the last President once he realizes he's got it. (Lord forbid)

Anyhow, I digress, For heinous crimes, bail can be denied of course.
Lollie

Social climber
I'm Lolli.
Jan 26, 2017 - 02:58pm PT
We don't have that show here. Yes, I can see why wealthy people benefit from it.

I find your judicial system scary and arbitrary, but maybe that is because I don't understand it.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jan 26, 2017 - 04:04pm PT
President Obama gifted this current President a new system of guilty

Obama created a new legal system on the sly? What a badazz!
couchmaster

climber
Jan 27, 2017 - 12:18pm PT

The plot thickens if CA. becomes a "Sanctuary state". It will be interesting to see the conflict resolve on the migrant issue (or not) with the Federal gov't. http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article129038699.html

"Democratic lawmakers in California are moving swiftly to pass a package of legislation that would restrict state and local law enforcement, including school police and security departments, from using their own resources to aid federal authorities in immigration enforcement.

The brewing legal battle between the state and Republican President Donald Trump, who Wednesday took sweeping actions designed to construct a wall along the U.S.-Mexico border and withhold federal funding to localities that refuse to cooperate with federal immigration authorities, could test the limits of California’s power amid questions over billions of dollars in funding."
c wilmot

climber
Jan 27, 2017 - 12:23pm PT
Who will maintain their estates? Of course ca politicians want to keep their de facto slave workforce.

It odd to se people demand they be allowed to exploit workers while pretending to care about them as humans
dirtbag

climber
Jan 27, 2017 - 12:25pm PT
Oh, is that what is going on?
couchmaster

climber
Jan 27, 2017 - 12:32pm PT

I was surprised to see how the Calif thing was rolling a few years back. Rich people have these folks working as housemaids and yard dudes, and are shocked when it's suggested to them that at least their (the rich folks) spanish speaking will be getting better. They (rich white employers) tend to don't give a microf*#k about learning to speak Spanish. It's a different mindset fer sure.

Peoples mindsets generally in that area (SO CAL) seem to be a pretty messed up thing for multiple reasons.
Chaz

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Jan 27, 2017 - 12:48pm PT
Why don't neighborhood kids mow lawns and do babysitting anymore? No WAY Chuy's Mow Edge & Blow can undercut the price of a 13-year-old borrowing the family lawnmower.
couchmaster

climber
Feb 12, 2017 - 08:41pm PT
Evacuation of parts of Yuba country.


Officials are predicting the Oroville dam spillway will fail shortly, possibly as soon as within 60 min. Move along if you're in this watershed or prepare to swim. They're flying rocks in to buttress and support the spillway but...."The California Department of Water Resources said it anticipates a failure the Auxiliary Spillway at Oroville Dam."


"The following cities in Yuba County are under evacuation orders, the sheriff's office spokesperson Leslie Caqrbah said:

Marysville
Hallwood
Ollivehurst
Plumas Lake
Wheatland

In Sutter County, an immediate evacuation has been ordered for Live Oak, Yuba City, Nicolaus and all communities Feather River Yuba City basin, officials tweeted.

Sutter County OEM immediate evacuation ordered for Live Oak, Yuba City, Nicolaus & all communities Feather River Yuba City basin
— County of Sutter (@CountyofSutter) February 13, 2017

Residents are being asked to evacuate north, toward Chico. DWR said residents in other cities should follow the orders of local law enforcement."
couchmaster

climber
Feb 13, 2017 - 09:39am PT
It took awhile but now the Dam has it's own thread. http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/2943791/Dam-Trouble

Nice water photo Dingus!

BTW, too busy wasting money to afford to address the environmental concerns of these 3 groups back in 2005? http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/02/12/oroville-dam-feds-and-state-officials-ignored-warnings-12-years-ago/

"Three environmental groups — the Friends of the River, the Sierra Club and the South Yuba Citizens League — filed a motion with the federal government on Oct. 17, 2005, as part of Oroville Dam’s relicensing process, urging federal officials to require that the dam’s emergency spillway be armored with concrete, rather than remain as an earthen hillside."

I thought it was a concrete spillway?





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