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Banquo
climber
Amerricka
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 5, 2016 - 11:54am PT
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bearbreeder,
That's a sweet little stove and I'm tempted to get one. I use a Snow Peak GigaPower which is about 100g for lots of trips where I don't need or want a bigger stove. It is very reliable.
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Banquo
climber
Amerricka
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 5, 2016 - 10:46pm PT
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Del Cranky,
If you don't like the tests, do some of your own and post your findings. Join the fun.
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perswig
climber
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Like Ghost my MSR from the 70's still works like a rocket and it still has its original seals!
Pushing 30yo on this one, also all orig.
As to Ghost's seals - if he's required replacements, I'd rather not know the details...
Dale
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Inverted canister stoves have been mentioned by a couple folks on this interesting thread.
I’ve become an inverted canister stove fan, since getting an Optimus Vega in 2012. Re the flaring problem Banquo mentioned, it is wise to start any of the various inverted canister stoves on the market, from MSR, Primus, JetBoil, & Optimus, with their canisters upright to warm the generator tube, so it then vaporizes liquid fuel when you invert the canister.
What Optimus has to say about the Vega, applies equally to the other fine inverted canister stoves on the market. However Optimus looked at the competition & made some improvements over existing stove models when they introduced the Vega.
Efficiency Mode: the stove gets best fuel-efficiency in upright canister (Efficiency-Mode) vapor gas mode. Simmering is also possible in Efficiency Mode.
Why the Inverted Canister Mode (4-Season Mode) is important.
• Cold temperatures translate into lower pressure in the gas canister. As a result your stove does not perform at usual power. Invert your canister and continue cooking in liquid gas mode at constant pressure. Depending on the conditions, you may be able to operate your stove in 4-season mode in temperatures down to approx. -20°C / -9°F. By contrast, a full cartridge upright canister stove isn't much good in temperatures lower than -5°C / 20°F.
• Nearly empty cartridge: when the gas level in your canister is coming to an end, the more volatile propane has already been used up, the pressure level is dropping, and the stove is losing power. In that case you can continue cooking in 4-Season mode at constant pressure until the canister is completely emptied.
• Turbo boost: when a very fast boil-time is needed, the canister can be flipped around. Cooking in 4-season mode is about 30% faster than in upright-canister mode. However, fuel consumption is about 15-20% higher.
I used to work as an Optimus sales-rep, but my then business-partner & I did our own cold-weather testing that confirmed inverted canister stoves work well down to around 0 f.
Jerry, "manned-up" and did a 3 degree F. test on the Optimus Crux & Vega Dec.21, 2012. Here's his results and a couple photos.
I did my outside test this morning on the Crux and Vega.
I tested them outside with a new 110 Gram (4 oz.) Optimus canister (propane 27%, iso-butane 25%,n-butane 48%) chilled to 3.7 degrees F. by being left outside for 10 minutes.
I used 1 pint of cool tap water in a covered Optimus Terra Lite with Heat-exchange coil pot.
Elevation about 4500 feet.
The Vega in 4-season mode (Inverted Canister) did a rolling boil in 2 minutes 30 seconds. I did use the windscreen accessory included with the Vega.
The 10,200 BTU rated upright-canister Crux took 5 minutes and 30 seconds to barely boil.
I do enjoy that the Vega folds up reasonably small, but when unfolded, it offers a very stable pot platform. It's large burner spreads the flame out & I can sautee on it.
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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25g+70g for an aluminum cup ... add in a small foil foil style windscreen, matches and canister and yr around 350g all in for an emergency or UL kit
That's not bad but of course the fuel cylinder is heavy. For emergency use an even lighter alternative is the Esbit titanium stove (13g, $15) and 3-4 Esbit (hexamine) fuel tablets (14g, ~$0.50 each). I also pack a small windscreen homemade from heavy-dudy aluminum foil. One of my pals hiked the JMT, twice, with only this setup.
One tab will boil about 16 oz of water. Esbit fuel emits toxic fumes and should NOT be used in a tent or snow cave.
Here's a good page on solid fuels.
Here are a couple of complete systems for under 90g.
For backpacking I prefer a cannister stove (Kovea, 56g) or an alcohol stove (I use the penny stove). My Whisperlite hasn't been ignited in over a decade. Same with my dad's old Svea 123.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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I have been intrigued by the make it yourself beer can stove that runs on alcohol which is said to be great in the third world where alcohol is readily available. Has anyone tested these in real mountain conditions?
Boodawg- Check out Backpacking Light forums. I tried one and do not think it would be good for cold/high altitude, but good for backpacking. I also have concerns about them causing forest fires if they get knocked over; a few PCT hikers have done so.
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ELM !
climber
Near Boston
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I'll pile on the Svea bandwagon. I have two..one that is 30+ years old and another that is about 10 years old. They just run always and without question. Has to be the most dependable piece of camping gear I own. Besides they look cool!!
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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ok, so I own an embarrassingly large array of stoves -- gas, isobutane, Esbit, whatever
the acid test of a stove is how quickly it can produce a liter of water from snow.
the JetBoil is okey-dokey in the Sierra in July when you get the munchies for some freeze-dried fettuccine Alfredo, but when it's 14 Fahrenheit and you NEED SOME WATER -- well, yer gonna die. The MSR Reactor is well-motivated to produce water, and is THE ONLY GAME IN TOWN if you do anything in winter and have to have an isobutane rig
white gas is fussier than Isobutane but will get the job done (most likely). The XGK is the way to go.
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TradEddie
Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
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Thanks to all for the interesting information. I discovered the limitations of my pocket rocket on a trip to NZ. It wasn't life threatening, but having spent a long cold night dreaming of coffee, even the spectacular view of Mt. Cook above us didn't make up for the misery of warming a canister under my armpit.
I love that propane converter, I'll be buying one for sure.
TE
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Banquo
climber
Amerricka
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 6, 2016 - 04:46pm PT
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I love that propane converter, I'll be buying one for sure.
There are several available with prices from around $10 to $40 or so. I got an alloy one because it is lighter. Be sure to read reviews.
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Spiny Norman
Social climber
Boring, Oregon
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Note that Jetboil says not to melt snow in their stoves. Which is bullsh#t, of course. But there are safety issues. Like melting heat exchangers that spit molten metal at you.
Here is a good article on how to melt snow with a Jetboil.
And with respect to an Esbit stove for emergencies, I agree with bearbreeder that that's pretty much only for low-altitude stuff. It's not what you want if you are days from the TH (esp. above treeline) and you need to melt snow.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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First Reilly: Wait, I didn't mean to imply that Ghost works like a rocket...
And then Perswig: As to Ghost's seals - if he's required replacements, I'd rather not know the details...
Fer fuksake dudes. Of course I work like a rocket. Ain't nobody can keep up with me. And my seals are all in perfect condition...
Although, that does remind me of a story of my days days in Alaska. A time when I was out on my snowmobile, and the thing started acting weird. But I managed to get it back into town and to a dealer. The mechanic said he'd get on it right away, so I went for a walk down along the shore while he worked on it. Bitterly cold day, with plenty of wind, but nice to be out. Anyway, I went back to the shop about half an hour later, and when the mechanic saw me he came out and said "it looks like you've blown a seal."
"No," I told him, "it's just frost on my beard."
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