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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 12:07am PT
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These are two different issues. The oil burning issue is in newer 4cyl. engines. We have 2014 Forester that was burning over a quart of oil per 1000 miles with less than 20,000 miles on the engine. After numerous oil consumption tests we got a new engine. Hopefully that solves the problem.
They probably gave you the overfill test, then hopefully a shortblock or rebuild. They thought it was the oil control rings initially, but after revision, the problem has only lessened. They also use the super thin oil that most mfr's use now to help mpg. They seem to be making good on it. Mine hasnt persisted, only one low oil light, within first 5000 miles, then never again. The GF's outgoing 2012 Impreza had issue, now her 2015 XV does not. Still a little all over the place.
On the subject of their 4wd ability, I have gotten my Forester to places I never thought I could. Ive pulled up to a few places and been the only non truck there. Also, Ive even gotten my WRX up to the george creek trailhead as well. So much comes down to the driver, etc. My WRX is lowered about 1" on more aggressive suspension and still made it with careful driving and lots of cargo.
The head gasket issue was most prominent with the DOHC EJ25, the engine used in Foresters from 98-01, 2.5RS 98-99, and in Outbacks 97-99 IIRC. That was less of a fluke and cooked at cyl #3 IIRC. The ones after that were more of a fluke, but were prominent enough to get a TSB.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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Nov 25, 2015 - 12:44am PT
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Bought a 2015 Forester. Not real happy with it. If I had it to do over I'd buy another Highlander.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 12:55am PT
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Elaborate. The highlander is a Camry based CUV, the Forester is based on a smaller car, they dont really have equivalents straight across between brands. Everyone has their reasons for liking the cars they do, its all about finding what is best for you and your needs.
The Highlander is quite bigger than the Forester, they arent apples to apples.
Subaru is and will always be short on options and creature comforts for sure, and their accoutrements will always be a couple model years behind the big makers'.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 04:35am PT
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I forgot, a good place for subaru research is cars101.com
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doughnutnational
Gym climber
its nice here in the spring
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Nov 25, 2015 - 06:12am PT
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They probably gave you the overfill test, then hopefully a shortblock We got a new short block. Otherwise I like the car. It is roomy, good in the snow, good clearance and comfortable. We have the manual transmission and I wish it had a lower 1st gear for the minimal off roading I do in it.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 06:41am PT
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Me too, Ive had 8 MT subarus, this is the numbest shifter and clutch ever. Its the cable operated shifter from the previous legacy. Supposedly the MT cars exhibit more oil consumption than the CVT cars.
If youre interested to read up more and see others' plights: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2690656
Most folks seem to get taken care of well with the exception of the over-emotional and occasional terrible dealer. SOA has taken good care of me in the past with an air pump issue, hopefully they got it solved.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 25, 2015 - 06:46am PT
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John, we have a 13 year old Outback and a 7 year old Forrester and love them both.the AWD is fantastic for snow country and they both are surprisingly good on off road travel. The short wheel base and AWD allows you to travel what are considered bad 4WD roads.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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Nov 25, 2015 - 06:49am PT
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Elaborate. The highlander is a Camry based CUV, the Forester is based on a smaller car, they dont really have equivalents straight across between brands. Everyone has their reasons for liking the cars they do, its all about finding what is best for you and your needs.
The forester is under powered. Pressing on the gas pedal is an act of faith and not enough for evasive action. If it came with a 6 cylinder it would be nice.
The subie does not have adequate stash pockets. Every time I have to hit the brakes crap goes flying everywhere.
Tourqu is too high at minimum speeds; it just wants to gun it when you want to pull into a parking space or such.
Overall it is a decent car, but not what I want. I drive in Orange County CA. Off road it is okay. It is AWD, not 4WD.
edit: Jim. maybe your thoughts are correct; mine are based on the 2015 model.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 25, 2015 - 08:20am PT
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wtf were they thinking with not putting an overhead rear hatch light? I've installed my own stick on light back there
Had the same issue with the hamstermobile. They put a puny little light down on one side so if there's anything in the back it's worthless.
Magnetic stick on light from the welding supply store works great.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 08:43am PT
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The forester is under powered. Pressing on the gas pedal is an act of faith and not enough for evasive action. If it came with a 6 cylinder it would be nice.
The subie does not have adequate stash pockets. Every time I have to hit the brakes crap goes flying everywhere.
Tourqu is too high at minimum speeds; it just wants to gun it when you want to pull into a parking space or such.
Overall it is a decent car, but not what I want. I drive in Orange County CA. Off road it is okay. It is AWD, not 4WD.
edit: Jim. maybe your thoughts are correct; mine are based on the 2015 model.
I agree on the power, the 2.5i is a bit anemic, especially if you have the CVT. I have the manual, and I dont feel as wanton for power. That said, I also have a fast car for my jollys. You can get the Forester in XT with whats nearly the new WRX's powerplant and upgraded CVT but its a hike in price.
Also agreed on the interior, subaru has most always had underengineered interiors and electronics, theyre just a few model years behind others, a curse of being a small maker.
Sounds mostly like poor match for your needs. Do you ever need AWD out of it like to go skiing or? I cant wait for the day when I buy a non AWD car. Ill always have one one way or another but a nice fun car on the side without the practical restrictions will be great.
If you dont need strong AWD or AWD at all, youre just bathing in choices, you lucky devil.
Ive also found, through running it through its paces on dirt roads and on more severe and slow crawly roads, that the traction control is best disabled on the slower crawly stuff. Not like the Rubicon trail or anything, but terrain where the tacomas and crawlers will look at you funny when you come over a crest into view.
I think the base level audio interface with bluetooth and the ipod connectivity is far behind the competition as well. Sometimes I think it has demons built in, it has little 'fits' occasionally. Ive heard the Harmon Kardon is far better.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 08:51am PT
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Forgot to mention, Im very glad I leased mine. I like it overall and it fits my needs way more than the 2006 WRX Wagon (fun, yes, small, yes, low, yes). I like it but not enough to buy it after or lease another.
Unless some more refinement happens, Ill be looking at their new offerings which are forthcoming, a 7 passenger SUV to replace the barely noticed Tribeca, and another smaller one, not sure what the name will be.
Ill always have a strong Subaru car in my arsenal. Ive pulled F150's out of the ditch more than once with my WRX. You cant not have one and live in Tahoe. The lady will daily drive the crosstrek, Ill sell my WRX and return the Forester when the time comes in '17 and I will be buying a truck, possibly the Chevy Colorado diesel, but hopefully the Japanese makers will ofer theirs in US market. Diesel, 4x4, four wheel camper, done.....and Ill have some sort of cheap fun impractical car, miata? hopped up old volvo?
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TrackerTodd
Mountain climber
CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 08:52am PT
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Everything Budda said. The head gasket issue was primarily an issue with the 04-05 Forester and that was fixed. I have two Subarus now and sold one many years ago and never had a head gasket problem . As far as being under power if you get the XT like I have it has plenty of power to get up and go. Im sadly selling mine soon simply because I need a truck to haul bikes and motorcycles.Good luck in your search.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 08:54am PT
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I wasnt even aware of the 04-05's having issue. Your FXT you mean? Thats otherwise an STI block without the forged internals and oil squirters. Sucks they had issue.
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Nov 25, 2015 - 09:13am PT
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Suby's "symetical" awd works great. I remember the first time I had mine in the snow in an empty parking lot and it was almost impossible to spin out or make it lose control in any way. I had to pull the e-brake to make it spin.
The drawback is it costs a little in mpg since it's always on. A benefit is that since it's always on you are more likely to retain control if you hit an unexpected ice patch or need to make a quick maneuver.
You can check out Suby's numbers here: http://tradeinqualityindex.com/reports/Subaru.html
e.g. Forester's are traded in at an average of 132K and 11.8% of them have engine issues. It rates at 42/100, below average :-(
RAV4's have tranny issues. Which is a bummer because it would be Toyota's closest thing to a suby. But the highlander is well rated. 85/100 well above average. Traded in at 147K with 4% having engine issues. I was impressed with the newer Highlanders. Very solid feeling, off road capable. Tows a good amount. But not the best mpg.
http://tradeinqualityindex.com/reports/Toyota.html
When I was deciding between a Suby and a CRV or RAV4 in 2006 the Suby felt more solid. The others felt like tin cans. And it handled much better since it wasn't as top heavy, but had just as much interior room. But I would hope the Hondas/RAV4 have gotten better since then.
If I was going to buy a car new and sell it at 100K, or lease it, I'd probably go Suby. But I would like to keep a car until 200K, since it costs WAY less for that 2nd 100K. Like 1/4 the cost. When you add up insurance, sales tax, etc. You can save multiple 10s of thousands of $. And if you finance it, that's even more $$$.
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Winemaker
Sport climber
Yakima, WA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 10:02am PT
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I owned a Subaru in NZ and one is Seattle; oil consumption problems with the Stateside car forced sale. I now have a V6 Rav4 and really like the car. The V6 is really nice for acceleration and mileage is only about 1 mpg less than the 4 cylinder. Since purchase I've averaged 23.5 mpg over 120k miles. The only problem I've had was a O2 sensor @ 35k. No oil consumption or other issues and I'm getting ready to do the first non-oil change type maintenance on it, changing spark plugs. Unfortunately I understand they no longer make the V6 so will make this one last.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 25, 2015 - 10:21am PT
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Thanks, everyone, for the fantastic response. Decision time isn't immediate, so feel free to keep them coming, but that could change at any point. I managed to get myself in the doghouse last night (by preheting the oven (whose light was out) to bake some cornbread for stuffing, unaware that my wife had a dutch oven's worth of dough in the oven, rising to make choreg (an Armenian pastry) today). It may take a very significant bribe to make it back to her good graces.
John
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John M
climber
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Nov 25, 2015 - 10:28am PT
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Thanks Buddhastalin, for all that great information.
I bought a 2002 Honda CRV last year. I had it on snow only one time last winter. Ack.. hated it. Part of it is the tires.. summer tires, but part is also what Buddha said, to engage the rear, the front have to slip. This is to me a big deal in winter driving. I would rather not lose that tiny bit of control every time I need 4wd. I will see what happens once I get better tires on it.
the other thing I don't like about that year is how much everything shudders when the ABS engages. Egad.. glad I was warned about it.
I previously drove an 88 Nissan pathfinder. What a difference.
….
I have driven my friends 2000 outback. That thing is solid on snow and ice. She said she bought the outback because the forester was less solid. More tin in the forester. I think they do a better job on the forester now. Not sure though. I'm tall and have a hard time getting into an outback. Thats another issue to me.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 10:43am PT
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The ABS is the same on all the cars as far as being harsh with pedal kickback. Mine is only slightly better on both cars. But yeah the interior can add some theatre to ABS if its not trustworthy.
I would like to think that proper snow tires or good A/S tires would have improved your experience and opinion of the CRV, but its true, all haldex-type awd systems work like that.
The mpg thing is the definite tradeoff for quality awd. Thats what the new FB and FA engines are supposed to improve upon, the outgoing EJ's lack of mpg. I had a 1.8liter EJ18 Impreza, it was a gutless wonder that didnt even get good mpg for being underpowered.
The EJ isnt even retired of duty, they still use it in the STI. They had lots of time to refine it, its like 25 years old. The FA/FB are new, like from scratch new. No more timing belt, lots of things. They are going to have to refine it thats for sure and Ive been watching for 2016 owners on the NASIOC to see how many post issues. Otherwise, I think the FB/FA is a good engine thus far. The turboed versions are going well, not much of any large issues and less oil consumption in the turbo cars it seems.
Anyway, tires are definitely every bit as important as drive configuration. Id rather have a FWD car on snow tires than an AWD car on all seasons in snowy conditions. We just got dumped on here yesterday and today, it was carnage all over for a bit there, and there were plenty of AWD, RWD, and FWD cars and even 4wd trucks in the ditch and backwards and such. You could have ten wheel drive and still put er in the ditch if youre tires arent appropriate.
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 10:43am PT
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Good info Buddha.
I'm driving a 2003 Forester, which became my new car after my wife got a new car. My car before that was 4Runner that had 250K on it. Probably not a surprise to say that the Forester does have head gasket issues, but so far that's only meant monitoring the oil level a little more frequently. For 150K and having been driven for over 10 yrs., that's not a big deal in my book. Combine that with the benefits we've gotten from the AWD, and I'd say we're far ahead.
This thread is also interesting to me because I'm probably going to buy something new in the next year or so. Since I'm always parking in the same lot with lots of lawyers like myself who drive MUCH nicer rigs than myself, I was thinking of going slightly upscale to something like an Audi Q5 (not superduper pricey, but has AWD), mostly because I bust my ass to support my family and feel like I've earned it. However, the more practical, dirt bag climber part of me is reminding me that a car is mostly a hunk of metal, so why not get something more practical, so I'm looking at a new Forester. Does anyone know if the oil consumption issues extend to the 2015 models? I have heard that the interiors aren't as well designed as the older versions, but that's not a huge issue to me. Curious as to any other gripes people have with the new Foresters.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 25, 2015 - 10:55am PT
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It does. Mine had a short spell of it, its a 2015. I linked a thread on page 1, its all about the FA/FB oil consumption. Apparently theyve been working on it since MY11. From what Ive seen, it seems to have improved, and it seems to affect MT cars the most. Scroll that thread and such, peoples experiences and facts and also lots of whining and poor spelling at times, but worthwhile.
I know Honda has a new Ridgeline in the works if not ready, and an Element replacement is due, if theyre going to do it. So, if they use SH-AWD on these, theyll be worthwhile. If the use that realtime crap, then that would be less appealing even though the rest of the wehicle may be good. You might research and hold out for a drive in one of those.
A german car is a definite spend. They are real nice, powerful, nice interiors, audis awd is non haldex (exc on TT and A3) and good. But they cost more to own. Also to buy, but to own. I would lease or off it before the warranty is up. Euro cars are generally more expensive to own. If youre ready for the potential of that, then youll enjoy your teutonic new ride, if not, youll hate it.
For the record Ive had some high mileage subarus,
84 GL w >160k miles and I did not maintain it at all, sold running
82 GL w 140k-destroyed by jumping like ironman stewart
96 Impreza w >180k, sold for good price in great shape
97 Outback w 160k, sold for good price in great shape (it had bad headgaskets at 3k mile and got a longblock before I owned it)
06 WRX 204k miles and just wants more, I maintain it very well, replace things that are worn or broken, run it properly, etc. Should sell for 6-8k based on what Ive seen in other ads.
15 Forester now, 22k miles, brief oil consumption issue, now has 5k miles interval, no consumption.
Others werent high miles or current
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