Valley Giants

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Barney Rubble

Trad climber
ALAMEDA
Jan 20, 2017 - 03:20am PT
Pull testing? Don't know, haven't weighted one yet. I figure if I fall hard enough to break something like that I deserve whatever happens to me :-)

I'll see if the maker wants to post up more info.
nutstory

climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
Jan 20, 2017 - 05:50am PT
Thank you Barney!
August West

Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
Jan 20, 2017 - 01:44pm PT
Kind of look overly thinned out, curious how they did in pull testing?

My Valley Giants saw quite a bit of use over the years. But as much as I can remember, my partner (or I) always pushed it along on lead or used it for aid. A lighter, large cam that was rated for body weight would actually have served my needs better.
Gnome Ofthe Diabase

climber
Out Of Bed
Jan 20, 2017 - 02:32pm PT
August West! The 1st rule of fight club!

We wanted it to be clear -ish,
that this recent complaint is from a neophyte; un-familiar to the battle of
The wide.
He really only grasped the idea of small cam action.

realization of the limitations and strengths of wide cam use only comes with the experience
Personal experience !

Don't spill the beanz!

it has been clear , and was made doubly so by the Madbloters and my banter you must have (the Thearter Goth), Strength finesse and willingness to sacrifice body parts to completely utilize the benefits of larger cams, IN ORDER TO SURMOUNT THE WIDE
edavidso

Trad climber
Oakland, CA
Jan 20, 2017 - 03:27pm PT
I make the cams that Barney Rubble posted a picture of.

I've made four sizes so far, which are numbered by the middle range of the crack size they protect: #4.5, #6, #8, and #10. The #4.5 is equivalent to a BD#5, the #6 is like a BD#6 but with a little more range, the #8 is like a VG#9 but has an extra inch of range and goes to 10", the #10 is like a VG#12, but has the same increase in range and goes to 13". The increase in range is due to the wide double axle design.

All of them have a trigger lock mechanism, which allows them to be locked in the closed position until they are needed and then they very easy to unlock with one hand. They are intentionally more difficult to lock in the retracted position.

They were designed for 10 kN and have been tested to 10 kN, but I have not tested any of the newer designs to failure. The stem will, in theory, hold 14 kN but there is a chance, especially on the larger two, that the lobes will buckle before reaching 14 kN.

Here are some more specs:
#4.5: range = 80.8 to 147.3 mm, weight = 305 g
#6: range = 107.4 to 195 mm, weight = 426 g
#8: range = 145.5 to 253 mm, weight = 527 g
#10: range = 189 to 330 mm, weight = 765 g

Attached is a picture of all four, the #8 in the retracted and locked position and open position, and my wife, Robin, racked up with a few of them.

Credit: edavidso
Credit: edavidso
Credit: edavidso
thebravecowboy

climber
The Good Places
Jan 20, 2017 - 03:34pm PT
super cool! you have obviously already put some coin into this project. any plans on releasing your results to the greater mass of sick sick OW fetishists? I would be game for a #8 if you were so inclined to let one go.

love my vg but damn is it heavy
NutAgain!

Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
Jan 20, 2017 - 04:33pm PT
Did you research smooth lobes touching the rock vs. knurled or bumpy? Seems like it might matter more on the bigger cams than on the smaller ones, to find a spot that sits nicely without walking.

I'm on the list of highly interested folks...

Camalot strength for comparison (using numbers from their website):
[0.3] 8 kN, 1798 lbf
[0.4] 10 kN, 2248 lbf
[0.5] 12 kN, 2698 lbf
[0.75-6] 14 kN, 3147 lbf
Jaybro

Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
Jan 20, 2017 - 04:44pm PT
I look forward to trying these out sometime.
Clint Cummins

Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
Jan 20, 2017 - 05:47pm PT
Nice work.
The new trigger design looks like a very good innovation.
(The way the cable goes to a separate lever near the axle instead of to the surface of the cam lobe).
Moof

Big Wall climber
Orygun
Jan 20, 2017 - 08:56pm PT
Drooling.

Take my money.
Alexey

climber
San Jose, CA
Jan 20, 2017 - 10:14pm PT


I proceeded to plug in a camming device that Erick actually makes. It is lighter and has more range than a black diamond #6. Erick is a master fabricator and spends hours perfecting wide gear for offwidth adventures. A unique man.

first time I was reading about new big cam production in Wild Turkey report
http://www.supertopo.com/tr/Deparately-Seeking-Stacks-A-Wide-Adventure/t12928n.html

Erick, are you going to sell your big cams?
nutstory

climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
Jan 21, 2017 - 06:27am PT
Bonjour edavidso, thank you very much for posting such great photographs of your magnificent cams. These delicate devices remind me stained-glass windows of cathedrals.
I would not want to impose too much on you but would it be possible to have a close-up picture of the central part of the device (double axle, springs, bridge, and stem attachment).
The trigger wire arrangement looks innovative to me.
If you ever produce some more samples, I would be most excited to get a #8 from you...
In 2009, your Green 2cam did almost win the Homemade Cam World Cup Beauty Pageant Thread on RC ;-)
Matt's

climber
Jan 21, 2017 - 07:55am PT
Really impressive for a home-made cam! Looks like your #6 is about 100g lighter than the BD camalot version.

As someone mentioned upthread, these sort of cams are usually pushed above the head, and thus don't need to be super-bomer. For this reason I am not too worried about the whole design taco-ing during a fall.

The ability to lock the cam in a compact, closed state is clever, but was not too hard to accomplish before...

I think there is a niche market for ultra-light big cams--- would be nice for big climbs like the salathe!
edavidso

Trad climber
Oakland, CA
Jan 22, 2017 - 06:32pm PT
Thanks for the interest. I'll probably sell some #8's at some point and maybe the #10 someday. I wouldn't be able to compete with BD on the #4.5 or #6. The #6 pictured was the one we brought up Wild Turkey last year. The #8's have seen a few ascents of the Salathe by friends.

As was mentioned these cams are very light. The #8 is about 60% the weight of a VG#9 and weighs less than a BD#6. Most of the weight savings were accomplished by taking as much material as possible out of the lobes while retaining strength and buckling resistance.

The lobes have no teeth and are a smooth profile. The teeth do nothing as far as I can tell. Rock is harder than aluminum and bites into the lobes. We've had no problems with these walking.

The trigger design is unique as was noted. I wanted to move the trigger mechanism internal to the lobes to make cam retraction similar to that of a smaller cam. It also means adjacent lobes sit basically right next to one another, which increases buckling resistance and allows the cam to have a narrower overall head width. It also made it easier to accomplish the integral trigger lock mechanism.
Alexey

climber
San Jose, CA
Jan 22, 2017 - 08:25pm PT
Erick, I want to buy your #8 when it would be available, thanks..
Studly

Trad climber
WA
Jan 22, 2017 - 09:25pm PT
I'd take an #8 also if they are available. Beautifully crafted cams!
Clint Cummins

Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
Jan 23, 2017 - 02:57am PT
Lending out a giant cam for the Salathe' is a fine tradition!
One of my partners bought a homemade #7.5 from some Mexicans in Camp 4
in 1985 when we first did the Salathe'.
It's gone up the climb on loan several times since.
We still call it the "Secret Weapon".
Great to have on that last pitch and a couple of other spots (too small
for Hollow Flake, but that's OK).
It's pretty sketchy compared to yours, though - the axle is simple threaded
stock, so the cams have a lot of play by now!

[Edit to add:]
Stephane,
Yes, I believe it's a Kuate, though not marked that way.
We bought a small cam from the same guys,
stamped KUATE 0.5 on one side of the shaft, and MEXICO on the other side.
Not quite time to retire it - hoping to use it again on the Salathe' this spring!
"Secret Weapon" &#40;7.5" max range cam&#41; side view. <br/>
Purchased fr...
"Secret Weapon" (7.5" max range cam) side view.
Purchased from some Mexicans in Camp 4, May 1985.
No stamped marks. Has been up the Salathe' Wall several times, but is too small for Hollow Flake crux!
Credit: Clint Cummins
"Secret Weapon" end view.
"Secret Weapon" end view.
Credit: Clint Cummins
Here are Marty Karabin's photos of a Kuate 7.5, which appears to be an exact match, except the one I have does not have any marking on the stem or elsewhere. Also the one I have has a tubular axle.
Unknown #5
Unknown #5
Credit: karabin museum
KUATE 7.5 Cam - Mexico
KUATE 7.5 Cam - Mexico
Credit: karabin museum
from
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=1547699&tn=160
nutstory

climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
Jan 23, 2017 - 06:35am PT
Clint, can we see a photograph of this exotic cam...?
Would not it be a Kuate???
I know a great location for your "friend's" retirement"...;-)
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
Jan 23, 2017 - 08:11am PT
Valley Giants: Salathe, Chouinard, Robbins, Harding, Pratt, Bridwell, Kauk, Bachar
nutstory

climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
Jan 23, 2017 - 08:47am PT
"Valley Titans"
"Valley Titans"
Credit: Bledsoe / Deis / Davidson
Erick, forgive me for giving this name to your cam.
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