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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Nov 13, 2014 - 01:23pm PT
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Who the hell would want pristine wilderness? I want a goddamn starbucks on every summit! Hell I'd move to Chamonix if I could. That's the way to do it... lifts to and from all my favorite climbs and a gift shop on top.
Via ferratas for all!
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 13, 2014 - 01:32pm PT
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Not as adventurous as a 'cocktail' in W Hollywood!
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Nov 13, 2014 - 01:33pm PT
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The Latinos referred to in that piece are the very ,very few which these new age Sierra clubber lefties meet in faculty lounges or in the halls of the state legislature.
Are far as Muir is concerned --- look for more of this type of politically correct revamping and revising of historical figures as California sinks ever lower into a corrupt one-party state run by an increasingly insulated and unaccountable governmental elite
On the one hand the enviro lobby wants their own heroic figure in the textbooks , but on the other are deeply embarrassed by Muir's politically incorrect comments.
Solution: expunge him from the Leftist pantheon . But do it in a way that sounds reasonable, natural, and incremental. Like a long-drawn out sleight of hand.
This is one of the things the radical left and totalitarians types in general have displayed a practiced hand at doing in other countries and other times. One day Trotsky was a heroic champion of the people --- the next day he has a bullet in his head and his photos and writings have been mysteriously "liquidated" from all public records.
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Tricouni
Mountain climber
Vancouver
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Nov 13, 2014 - 02:13pm PT
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... One day Trotsky was a heroic champion of the people --- the next day he has a bullet in his head ...
If I remember correctly Trotsky was killed with a sawed-off ice-axe.
John Muir's writings will survive the current revisionism. As for his racist remarks, he was a child of his time, and his statements are very mild compared with many from those days.
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 03:42pm PT
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I remember when WE (white americans, just to be clear) needed to be educated about trash... remember the early/mid 60's?
Ladybird Johnson telling us to stop tossing junk out of the car window.
Chief Crying Eagle.. not his real name.. and all the TV adds showing dead fish, trash etc all along the rivers.
Well we got trained and the environmental movement got started.
I take all sorts of people out climbing, some have never left the urban concrete world, first piece of trash that hits the ground... I pick it up, nicely explain that we don't like our climbing places looking like Canoga Park.
They all get it.
Its time for a new education program all across the USA.
and DMT .... Muir puts me to sleep when I read his stuff....
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hossjulia
Trad climber
Carson City, NV
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Nov 13, 2014 - 03:57pm PT
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Idiots and corporate drones is what Universities breed it seems.
Saw some well heeled, straight from REI, happen to be Latinos come off the short section of the JMT this summer. Not nice. Not friendly. Poor tippers. Acted like doing 100 miles made their sh#t not stink. From LA may have more to do with the attitude. No joy either, acted like it was all a big hassle. UGH! Made sure we knew they were Sierra Club members. But, I've been cringing at THAT for years now!
Not really sure where I was going with this, just disgusted I guess.
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craig morris
Trad climber
la
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Nov 13, 2014 - 04:17pm PT
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I think that one of the effects Muir had aside from his writing was as a guide in Yosemite. He was the guy and that was the place to see. his ideas had an effect on those he met.
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JOEY.F
Gym climber
It's not rocket surgery
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Nov 13, 2014 - 05:54pm PT
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"Muir's legacy has to go," said Jon Christensen, a historian with UCLA's Institute of Environment and Sustainability. "It's just not useful anymore."
Let me take a stab,
"Muir's legacy has to stay, It's more useful than ever"
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
moving thru
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Nov 13, 2014 - 06:14pm PT
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Thanks, Joey. For me you hit pretty much exactly on the core of this discussion. You don't just make people and the history they are intertwined with disappear with the snap of an arrogant finger. Did this UCLA professor even come close to accomplishing all John Muir did?
Times do change, yes. But the change should include the great history of how this change took place along with those that gave a good portion of their lives for it. To me it is irreverent and wrong to toss out the folk that were a huge part of working to make the Sierra the incredible place it is today.
And, OBTW, did this dude professor ever hike the JT Or the PCT?
Edit: And Sir Jon Christensen is posed like a god wearing a suit coat for crying out loud. I'm speechless. But then it is UCLA.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Nov 13, 2014 - 06:20pm PT
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Scrubbing Bubbles,
Maybe that's what he saw. I'd rather have the truth dealt straight, than be fed some bullshit like *latinos* are the vanguard of environmentalism in California.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Nov 13, 2014 - 07:23pm PT
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Irrelevant...? Is his Facebook page being deleted..?
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Nov 13, 2014 - 07:32pm PT
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"Latinos are the most environmentally active people in the state....."
"I guess those UCLA beard stroking professors have never visited "lower Eton Canyon" or the POOL at Malibu, or ????? anyplace really."
"I was hoping somebody would pick up on that monumentally
stupid statement."
Which statement are you referring to?
Guyman, that's a really stereotypical, narrow-minded comment to make.
You are saying that latinos, by definition, and universally, demonstrate their disregard (and disdain) for the outdoors via the tagging & graffiti that they all do in such places as Lower Eton Cyn, etc?
You gotta clarify that. It sounds about as shitty as it sounds.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Nov 13, 2014 - 07:35pm PT
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Which Latinos...?
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Fossil climber
Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:04pm PT
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No one who ever had a major impact on human behavior is irrelevant, as far as human history goes. Would climbers say that Norman Clyde or John Salathe are irrelevant because of their relatively primitive methods?
Everyone starts somewhere, and some influence others, but eventually things change.
Looking at what we know about the universe, I think that life is irrelevant. Don't sweat the small stuff.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:23pm PT
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PhD Trolls are pretty good eh?
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:29pm PT
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The UCLA profs delivered the essential anti-wilderness talking points heard at most public land policy meetings...
... must get some interesting funding for their research.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:41pm PT
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Muir's descriptions of storms in the Yosemite are classics of their kind. Not all his writing stresses saving the wilderness. He was a man of the times, as TTR says. He ran a sawmill at the base of Yosemite Falls, etc.
He had a special gift...living in the Valley nearly on his own, with very little other than his own labor to sustain him, meanwhile penning beautiful descriptive passages of his adventures, glorying in his joy.
This part of his legacy will never become irrelevant and will always inspire those who love to read good literature. You have to accept his "quaint" phrases just like you have to accept those of other nineteenth century writers. Correct English counted for something in the "olden days" (a quaint phrase from my childhood in the fifties & I always seem to think of Annie Oakley when I say it).
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:45pm PT
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To what?
He didn't say to where?
Ha!
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Captain...or Skully
climber
in the oil patch...Fricken Bakken, that's where
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Nov 14, 2014 - 02:35am PT
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ouch.
I dig The Muir. Ivory Tower as#@&%es, not so much.
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yanqui
climber
Balcarce, Argentina
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Nov 14, 2014 - 03:02am PT
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An old white guy gets paid 120+ grand a year to theorize that one of the keystone founders of the environmental movement was too much of a privileged old white guy to be relevant anymore. Now that's what I call humor. Was it from the Onion?
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