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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 13, 2014 - 09:38am PT
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Today's LA Times:
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John Muir's legacy questioned as centennial of his death nears
By Louis Sahagun
John Muir is the patron saint of environmentalism, an epic figure whose writings of mystical enlightenment attained during lone treks in California's wilderness glorified individualism, saved Yosemite and helped establish the national park system..
As the first president of the Sierra Club, Muir shaped enduring perceptions about how the wild world should be prioritized, protected and managed.
But now some critics are arguing that the world has changed so much in the century since his death that Muir has gone the way of wheelwrights.
He is no longer relevant.
"Muir's legacy has to go," said Jon Christensen, a historian with UCLA's Institute of Environment and Sustainability. "It's just not useful anymore."
Christensen and others see Muir's beliefs as antiquated in the face of 21st century environmental challenges that the bushy-bearded Scot could not have imagined: population growth, urban sprawl, demographic shifts, climate change.
The debate boils down to Muir's primary ethic: The wilderness is a temple to be left undisturbed, so man occasionally can experience nature in its purity. That precept helped shape a century of conservation, ensuring that there would be unspoiled wilderness for succeeding generations.
"He had a huge passion for nature, such as we should all cherish in our hearts," said Mary Ellen Hannibal, a Bay Area author and Muir devotee. "He holds up an ideal of experiencing nature firsthand in a spiritual, transcendent way."
"Environmentalism, in some ways, has moved beyond John Muir," said Noah Greenwald, endangered species director at the Center for Biological Diversity. "But he was a good guy. He was at the forefront of the notion of setting aside portions of pristine nature and letting natural forces in them move forward unimpeded."
To Christensen and others, however, Muir's notion that immersing people in "universities of the wilderness" — such as Yosemite — sends the message that only awe-inspiring parks are worth saving, at the expense of smaller urban spaces.
Critics also say Muir's vision of wilderness is rooted in economic privilege and the abundant leisure time of the upper class.
Rather than accessing Muir's beloved Sierra Mountains as backpackers, skiers or rock climbers, they argue, Californians would benefit more from the creation of urban parks, additional roads and trails in wild lands.
Nature exists in many forms, they say. Pristine wilderness is but one.
On Thursday, six weeks before the centennial of Muir's death, conservationists, geographers, lawmakers, artists, historians and environmental justice advocates will meet at UCLA to discuss his legacy and relevance. The occasion is the investiture of Glen MacDonald as the university's John Muir memorial chair in geography.
Among the presenters at the event, titled "A Century Beyond Muir," will be Christensen, who is a friend and colleague of MacDonald's.
Lining up behind him will be other critics — including Richard White, a historian at Stanford University who says Muir's late 19th century, Anglo-Saxon brand of environmentalism and bias toward untouched wilderness skewed the way nature has been portrayed in popular culture.
For example, in his writings, Muir said the squirrels he killed on his ranch in Martinez, Calif., were disgusting pests out to ruin the orchards. But he described the squirrels living in his beloved High Sierra as hard-working creatures like those later popularized in the Disney classic "Snow White."
Critics also see a correlation between the emotional, biblical language of Muir's writings and the demographic makeup of national park visitors and the ranks of the largest environmental organizations — mainly aging, white Americans.
The Sierra Club, which Muir founded, and the Audubon Society are struggling to connect with California's diverse population, particularly Latinos, who polls show are among the most devoted environmentalists in the state. A strong and diverse membership in California, where Latinos are expected to become a majority by 2050, is important to influencing political decisions and raising funds to support missions of conservation and environmental education.
Yet "the conservation movement reflects the legacy of John Muir, and its influence on a certain demographic — older and white — and that's a problem," Christensen said.
Walking in the footsteps of John Muir: Robert Hanna rarely mentioned that Sierra Club founder John Muir was his great-great-grandfather.
He is joined in that view by D.J. Waldie, an author and expert on Southern California culture.
"We have to reimagine our relationships with nature to accommodate modern, increasingly diverse communities that see the world differently than white Anglo-Saxon Protestants like Muir did in the late 19th century," Waldie said.
"For many communities of color, nature of great significance isn't out there in distant charismatic Sierra peaks; it's in urban parks, in local mountains and along local rivers — and under their fingertips in the stuff they grow in their own backyards," he said.
One blemish on Muir's past is indisputable: He had disdain for California's Native Americans, a group he claimed had no place in the Sierra landscape.
Laura Pulido, a professor in USC's Department of American Studies and Ethnicity, said Muir's prejudice should be taken in perspective.
"It is essential that we try to understand John Muir in all his complexity," Pulido said. "He was a man of his times, who actively worked to disgrace California Indians by taking their lands.
"But he also launched the environmental movement, which is no small thing," she said.
In Hannibal's view, "all this postmodern talk about what Muir said and what his prejudices were is, at the end of the day, just words. What counts is the number of acres protected."
On a recent weekday in his office at UCLA, MacDonald tried to conclude a spirited debate with Christensen over the relevance of Muir's legacy: "For all his flaws, Muir did a lot of great things and his enthusiasm for nature continues to inspire."
Christensen wouldn't budge. "Muir's a dead end," he said. "It's time to bury his legacy and move on."
louis.sahagun@latimes.com
Copyright © 2014, Los Angeles Times
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Maybe White Tower pundits are also irrelevant? Furthermore, in the first
picture (as framed in the print edition) Mr Snooty Pundit is seen to be
wearing patent leather slip-ons. Dood, you just lost all credibility!
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 09:48am PT
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One reason there are so many older NP visitors is that they are released from captivity after a lifetime of slavery. They aren't about to go into wilderness, though, because for most it's beyond their abilities.
A taste will do for most, maybe a ride on a train back in the day made it an adventure of a lifetime.
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ron gomez
Trad climber
fallbrook,ca
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Nov 13, 2014 - 09:52am PT
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I guess we're all entitled to our own opinions.
Some of my favorite writings are of John Muir and I think wilderness is a good thing to preserve. Yes the world changes....maybe we should change with it, maybe not.
Peace
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 13, 2014 - 09:54am PT
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You bury the person, his/her legacy lives on.....by definition.
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this just in
climber
north fork
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Nov 13, 2014 - 09:58am PT
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Blasphemy Reilly.
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son of stan
Boulder climber
San Jose CA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:04am PT
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Not irrelevant. His legacy is solid.
Never stop pondering life's big questions. Like what
kind of chain saw would John Muir have used on trails?
Maybe this one.
http://www.stihlusa.com/products/chain-saws/professional-saws/ms880/
And I think today he would have used it to drop trees onto trails to slow
the scourge of the sierra horse packing businesses.
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:09am PT
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Just another bunch of UCLA jackoffs....
"Latinos are the most environmentally active people in the state....."
I guess those UCLA beard stroking professors have never visited "lower Eton Canyon" or the POOL at Malibu, or ????? anyplace really.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 13, 2014 - 10:11am PT
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Guy, thank you, I was hoping somebody would pick up on that monumentally
stupid statement.
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kaholatingtong
Trad climber
Nevada City
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:32am PT
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Do they really believe this sh#t? Is it possible for a college professors reading comprehension to be this bad?
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skcreidc
Social climber
SD, CA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:41am PT
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Reeaaalllyyy.....sounds like some department at UCLA is becomming irrelevant.
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:43am PT
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Just one more good reason for a mandatory program of eugenics, birth control, and euthanasia to establish and maintain a New World Order.
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Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
sawatch choss
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:50am PT
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Everybody has their particular hobby horse to ride. Muir's was the grand wilderness. For someone else, it's the urban park or backyard garden. I don't agree that because his vision was incomplete, it should be completely discounted. There were plenty of small farms and open spaces back then- they didn't need an advocate. Now they do. But that's not his fault.
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:57am PT
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"It's time to bury his legacy and move on."
To what?
He didn't say to where?
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dirt claud
Social climber
san diego,ca
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:57am PT
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I was wondering what the fook he was talking about. My family would make fun of me when I would visit them in Mexico because I would stuff trash in my pockets instead of throw it on the ground. Things have changed now with the new generation but many do not have the morals about littering like we have here. I've been to Mexican national parks and monuments and even those have trash sometimes. 3rd world countries governments that don't emphasize care for natural surroundings or do not provide the proper ways of disposing of trash and people get used to throwing it on the ground. Not gonna say Latinos are the biggest population that litters here but I don't see them as ""Latinos are the most environmentally active people in the state....." either. I guess he is talking about all the cartels growing weed in the forests when he sais the are the most environmentally active.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 11:00am PT
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Just trying to get their 15min. by saying something inflammatory. Dumbsh*ts.
Unfortunately some people will now use this as an excuse to futher impose homo sapien will on the environment, and we can then rationalize our out of control population growth and lack of respect for the rest of of the living things we share the planet with.
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Sheets
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 11:25am PT
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I've noticed environmental justice advocates sure push a lot of things I would consider counter to environmentalism.
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neversummer
climber
30 mins. from suicide USA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 12:05pm PT
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EAT MY SH#T UCLA...
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10b4me
climber
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Nov 13, 2014 - 12:21pm PT
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Just another bunch of UCLA jackoffs....
+1
"Latinos are the most environmentally active people in the state....."
I guess those UCLA beard stroking professors have never visited "lower Eton Canyon" or the POOL at Malibu, or ????? anyplace really.
or the West Fork of the San Gabriel River(near the bridge).
edited to say, been going to the west fork since 1970. If I had a dollar for every diaper I've seen thrown in the river. . . . .
and not a fan of the rednecks either.
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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Nov 13, 2014 - 01:05pm PT
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Thats a pretty broad brush statement saying Latinos are the most enviro minded in the state. Kayaking the West Fork of the San Gabriel River a few years ago I witnessed Latinos spray painting on the rocks, throwing diapers and trash in the river along with their BBQ ashes, at least they threw the ashes in the river and was shot at with a pellet gun. Granted this was a weekend and I should have known better and right downstream all the redneck white guys were mud bogging with their giant 4x4's. The Latinos are far from carrying the enviro torch in California.
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Nov 13, 2014 - 01:21pm PT
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D.J. Waldie, an author and expert on Southern California culture
LMFAO, my how we live in a specialized society. I'm with WB move on to what? Perhaps a cocktail in West LA.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Nov 13, 2014 - 01:23pm PT
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Who the hell would want pristine wilderness? I want a goddamn starbucks on every summit! Hell I'd move to Chamonix if I could. That's the way to do it... lifts to and from all my favorite climbs and a gift shop on top.
Via ferratas for all!
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 13, 2014 - 01:32pm PT
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Not as adventurous as a 'cocktail' in W Hollywood!
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Nov 13, 2014 - 01:33pm PT
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The Latinos referred to in that piece are the very ,very few which these new age Sierra clubber lefties meet in faculty lounges or in the halls of the state legislature.
Are far as Muir is concerned --- look for more of this type of politically correct revamping and revising of historical figures as California sinks ever lower into a corrupt one-party state run by an increasingly insulated and unaccountable governmental elite
On the one hand the enviro lobby wants their own heroic figure in the textbooks , but on the other are deeply embarrassed by Muir's politically incorrect comments.
Solution: expunge him from the Leftist pantheon . But do it in a way that sounds reasonable, natural, and incremental. Like a long-drawn out sleight of hand.
This is one of the things the radical left and totalitarians types in general have displayed a practiced hand at doing in other countries and other times. One day Trotsky was a heroic champion of the people --- the next day he has a bullet in his head and his photos and writings have been mysteriously "liquidated" from all public records.
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Tricouni
Mountain climber
Vancouver
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Nov 13, 2014 - 02:13pm PT
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... One day Trotsky was a heroic champion of the people --- the next day he has a bullet in his head ...
If I remember correctly Trotsky was killed with a sawed-off ice-axe.
John Muir's writings will survive the current revisionism. As for his racist remarks, he was a child of his time, and his statements are very mild compared with many from those days.
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 03:42pm PT
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I remember when WE (white americans, just to be clear) needed to be educated about trash... remember the early/mid 60's?
Ladybird Johnson telling us to stop tossing junk out of the car window.
Chief Crying Eagle.. not his real name.. and all the TV adds showing dead fish, trash etc all along the rivers.
Well we got trained and the environmental movement got started.
I take all sorts of people out climbing, some have never left the urban concrete world, first piece of trash that hits the ground... I pick it up, nicely explain that we don't like our climbing places looking like Canoga Park.
They all get it.
Its time for a new education program all across the USA.
and DMT .... Muir puts me to sleep when I read his stuff....
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hossjulia
Trad climber
Carson City, NV
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Nov 13, 2014 - 03:57pm PT
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Idiots and corporate drones is what Universities breed it seems.
Saw some well heeled, straight from REI, happen to be Latinos come off the short section of the JMT this summer. Not nice. Not friendly. Poor tippers. Acted like doing 100 miles made their sh#t not stink. From LA may have more to do with the attitude. No joy either, acted like it was all a big hassle. UGH! Made sure we knew they were Sierra Club members. But, I've been cringing at THAT for years now!
Not really sure where I was going with this, just disgusted I guess.
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craig morris
Trad climber
la
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Nov 13, 2014 - 04:17pm PT
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I think that one of the effects Muir had aside from his writing was as a guide in Yosemite. He was the guy and that was the place to see. his ideas had an effect on those he met.
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JOEY.F
Gym climber
It's not rocket surgery
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Nov 13, 2014 - 05:54pm PT
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"Muir's legacy has to go," said Jon Christensen, a historian with UCLA's Institute of Environment and Sustainability. "It's just not useful anymore."
Let me take a stab,
"Muir's legacy has to stay, It's more useful than ever"
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
moving thru
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Nov 13, 2014 - 06:14pm PT
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Thanks, Joey. For me you hit pretty much exactly on the core of this discussion. You don't just make people and the history they are intertwined with disappear with the snap of an arrogant finger. Did this UCLA professor even come close to accomplishing all John Muir did?
Times do change, yes. But the change should include the great history of how this change took place along with those that gave a good portion of their lives for it. To me it is irreverent and wrong to toss out the folk that were a huge part of working to make the Sierra the incredible place it is today.
And, OBTW, did this dude professor ever hike the JT Or the PCT?
Edit: And Sir Jon Christensen is posed like a god wearing a suit coat for crying out loud. I'm speechless. But then it is UCLA.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Nov 13, 2014 - 06:20pm PT
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Scrubbing Bubbles,
Maybe that's what he saw. I'd rather have the truth dealt straight, than be fed some bullshit like *latinos* are the vanguard of environmentalism in California.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Nov 13, 2014 - 07:23pm PT
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Irrelevant...? Is his Facebook page being deleted..?
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Nov 13, 2014 - 07:32pm PT
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"Latinos are the most environmentally active people in the state....."
"I guess those UCLA beard stroking professors have never visited "lower Eton Canyon" or the POOL at Malibu, or ????? anyplace really."
"I was hoping somebody would pick up on that monumentally
stupid statement."
Which statement are you referring to?
Guyman, that's a really stereotypical, narrow-minded comment to make.
You are saying that latinos, by definition, and universally, demonstrate their disregard (and disdain) for the outdoors via the tagging & graffiti that they all do in such places as Lower Eton Cyn, etc?
You gotta clarify that. It sounds about as shitty as it sounds.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Nov 13, 2014 - 07:35pm PT
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Which Latinos...?
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Fossil climber
Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:04pm PT
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No one who ever had a major impact on human behavior is irrelevant, as far as human history goes. Would climbers say that Norman Clyde or John Salathe are irrelevant because of their relatively primitive methods?
Everyone starts somewhere, and some influence others, but eventually things change.
Looking at what we know about the universe, I think that life is irrelevant. Don't sweat the small stuff.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:23pm PT
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PhD Trolls are pretty good eh?
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:29pm PT
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The UCLA profs delivered the essential anti-wilderness talking points heard at most public land policy meetings...
... must get some interesting funding for their research.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:41pm PT
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Muir's descriptions of storms in the Yosemite are classics of their kind. Not all his writing stresses saving the wilderness. He was a man of the times, as TTR says. He ran a sawmill at the base of Yosemite Falls, etc.
He had a special gift...living in the Valley nearly on his own, with very little other than his own labor to sustain him, meanwhile penning beautiful descriptive passages of his adventures, glorying in his joy.
This part of his legacy will never become irrelevant and will always inspire those who love to read good literature. You have to accept his "quaint" phrases just like you have to accept those of other nineteenth century writers. Correct English counted for something in the "olden days" (a quaint phrase from my childhood in the fifties & I always seem to think of Annie Oakley when I say it).
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clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
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Nov 13, 2014 - 10:45pm PT
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To what?
He didn't say to where?
Ha!
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Captain...or Skully
climber
in the oil patch...Fricken Bakken, that's where
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Nov 14, 2014 - 02:35am PT
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ouch.
I dig The Muir. Ivory Tower as#@&%es, not so much.
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yanqui
climber
Balcarce, Argentina
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Nov 14, 2014 - 03:02am PT
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An old white guy gets paid 120+ grand a year to theorize that one of the keystone founders of the environmental movement was too much of a privileged old white guy to be relevant anymore. Now that's what I call humor. Was it from the Onion?
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TMayse
climber
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Nov 14, 2014 - 06:19am PT
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Muir should be judged by his actions right? Yosemite exists because of his efforts. Ok, he said some jacked up stuff in regards to the Native Americans... Who hasn't stuck their foot in their mouth from time to time? This notion that Muir's legacy is no longer relevant is crap.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Cave Creek, AZ
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Nov 14, 2014 - 06:36am PT
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A Muir was a mystic, so he's bound to be misunderstood. Irrelevant? That's an arguement that has no legs.
maybe we should work toward his relevance once more?
Yeah. Early on I was giving money regularly to The Nature Conservancy. My wife and I took our three daughters to their Ramsey Canyon Preserve in southern Arizona years back. The docents got all worked up because we would pick up leaves and stones and deviate from the trail with the kids so that they could really see up close and feel and smell all of the wonderful stuff there. So, my kids all ended up being proud tree hugging dirt worshippers because they grew up with the smell of dirt and woodsmoke in their clothes.They want to see it preserved for the future and are willing to work at it because they have experienced first hand how valuable it is.
Most people don't care about wilderness because, in part, they have never experienced, and, in part, because we as humans are typically more focused on meeting our basic needs (food and shelter?) and beyond that buying and consuming and doing stuff that feeds our egos instead of nurturing our spirits.
We could stand to get more about the valuable characteristics (and model them) of Muir the mystic and Muir the conservationist.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Nov 14, 2014 - 07:20am PT
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What frustrates me about conservationists most I suppose is the "all or nothing" mentality. An Extreme example is the idea that the planet is best if no people are on it. If this is what the profs are trying to combat then I could agree with them.
I'm so far from that mentality that it seems very alien to me. I am pro environment pro wilderness within reason. I am also pro industry (well regulated). In my mind the planet is fine no matter what we do. Life will go on. We could nuke the place and life would go on or something truly cataclysmic could happen and Life could completely die off and the planet would go on.. in another 1/4 of the universes age.. the planet will not exist. So what. What matters in my mind is quality of life of humans .. without wilderness some of the greatest experiences will not exist.
Yet the majority of people will never experience it for various reasons. Most people live in cities and urban environments. Conservation for them means clean air, reduced light pollution and perhaps some parks. If this is what the professors are talking about I get it.. and that is important too.
None of it is irrelevant however.
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ydpl8s
Trad climber
Santa Monica, California
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Nov 14, 2014 - 09:42am PT
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He was an important man for his times. George Washington and Thomas Jefferson's lifestyles would not seem too PC by today's standards. Does that make their contributions irrelevant?
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Nov 14, 2014 - 09:53am PT
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Just another bunch of UCLA jackoffs.... I am gravely disappointed in my alma mater. I'd expect that kind of opinion from the environmentally minded folks at USC, but never from the Bruins. USC probably deemed him irrelevant long ago because he had no money and advocated preservation, not exploitation.
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ydpl8s
Trad climber
Santa Monica, California
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Nov 14, 2014 - 09:57am PT
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This could really get into a catch-22, but if they weren't as relevant as they were in their day and age, we might not be having this discussion in our day and age. :-)
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Captain...or Skully
climber
in the oil patch...Fricken Bakken, that's where
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Nov 14, 2014 - 10:23am PT
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UCLA is pretty damned irrelevant to me, so Eff that guy & all his ilk.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Nov 14, 2014 - 10:25am PT
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Nice Trojan dig Fat Dad. Always a good thing ;-)
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 14, 2014 - 10:57am PT
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Muir was a visionary despite his fortunate background.
In the end we will learn to be environmentally sustainable or mankind will perish.
And THAT will always be relevant.
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Nov 14, 2014 - 11:01am PT
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Those professors need to "shake off their city legs!"
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Under Achiever
Trad climber
Los Angeles
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Nov 14, 2014 - 11:56am PT
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“When one tugs at a single thing in nature, he finds it attached to the rest of the world.” J.Muir
I think that encompasses pretty much every modern day environmental concern, especially climate change. Muir appears to be more relevant than ever.
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canyoncat
Social climber
SoCal
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Nov 14, 2014 - 12:02pm PT
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Christensen is an ass. Mic drop
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Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
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Nov 14, 2014 - 12:36pm PT
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Environmentally sustainable and wilderness are two different things. Most of Asia hasn't had any wilderness for a couple of millenia and yet the agriculture there is highly productive and sustainable.
Washington, Jefferson, and John Muir were all hypocrites even in their day when it came to regarding non white humans as less than human. Other contemporaneous groups like the Quakers, felt differently even at the time. Democracratic education should expose the warts along with the greatness.
As for the professors, they're not stupid, just self serving. One gets rewarded in academia by countering received wisdom, not by contributing more of the same. It often seems it doesn't matter if the contradictory opinion is true or not, only that it is expressed cleverly. To me, that is a major fault of our academic system, that being critical is so often seen as more important than being creative in one's own right.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2014 - 12:41pm PT
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Well and succinctly put, Jan.
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StahlBro
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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Nov 14, 2014 - 12:46pm PT
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I agree Jan. And it is dangerous because these people will now be cited as "experts" in ways that will further dergrade our undertanding of human relationships to the natural world.
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Mark Force
Trad climber
Cave Creek, AZ
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Nov 14, 2014 - 05:06pm PT
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Nov 14, 2014 - 05:12pm PT
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Funny.
When I travel Latin America most stuff we consider trash is worth money and somebody is recycling it.
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rmuir
Social climber
From the Time Before the Rocks Cooled.
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Nov 14, 2014 - 05:44pm PT
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Jon Christensen? Who?
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RP3
Big Wall climber
Twain Harte
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Nov 14, 2014 - 06:19pm PT
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If we begin discounting every thinker, philosopher, or writer who had a belief considered objectionable to some future society, we would have a short list of people to quote!
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ryankelly
Trad climber
el portal
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Nov 14, 2014 - 08:42pm PT
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friday night posting...I need a life
Muir and the movement he inspired protected the Tuolumne and Merced Watersheds over a hundred years ago. To celebrate that level of preservation is necessary. To call it "America's Best Idea" is scary in the face of the work needed now:
To foster resilience at the various temporal and spatial scales of ecosystems so that they can withstand all sorts of disturbance.
Wilderness has a place in the protection of ecosystem services ( economically under valued creations of functioning ecosystems like clean air and water and soil) but it is not the end game of modern sustainability...
this ain't news people: we don't have a knowledge gap, we have a communication gap
Luckily, connectivity is on the rise. Check out google images for the "Adaptive Cycle" for a modern take on systems...
Whooaaa weekend supertopo rant!
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donnski
Mountain climber
Nanoose Bay, BC
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Nov 26, 2014 - 10:55am PT
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This really ticks me off, and I am from Canada. The idea that wilderness is a white guy's idea is offensive. Jon Christensen is not our friend.
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rbord
Boulder climber
atlanta
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Nov 26, 2014 - 11:23am PT
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We'll said Jan. Isnt that the way of it for all of us. I love the outdoors like people like me so Muir is an awesome visionary and that la guy sucks! We humans and our belief creation capabilities rule! (somehow ..)
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Nov 26, 2014 - 11:39am PT
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I have been thinking lately, that once all the other lands are fracked, we will still have our Parks to run to. That's the lazy way out. Do the Parks make it possible for everything else to get raped? That guy's harshness toward Muir is just a way to get people to look. Muir rules.
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Nov 26, 2014 - 12:41pm PT
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duke of puke
climber
boulder, co
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Nov 26, 2014 - 02:43pm PT
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Guys... you don't get it. Capitalism, what we're all on, is the religion of consumption. Everything Muir fought for will eventually be consumed, or our economy wont exist, and we all want an economy ( or religion ), now, don't we?.
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Hoff
Big Wall climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Nov 26, 2014 - 04:59pm PT
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Shameful what lengths people will go to for publicity. Maybe they will stay away from Yosemite forever, and it will be less crowded on my next visit.
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paul roehl
Boulder climber
california
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Nov 26, 2014 - 05:07pm PT
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Muir articulated in a very clear and accessible way the necessity of wilderness to the human spirit and for that we should be thankful. He convinced thousands of folks of the restorative and reconciling qualities of the wild and the result of that influence still lives... I don't know what people expect, lives are long and the opportunities to be fallible are endless. Racist, perhaps. But he did much good and I like his writing, but then I like adjectives, especially "glorious".
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
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Nov 27, 2014 - 12:12am PT
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Irrelevant? Hardly.
rambler
climber
mountaineer
Naturalist
Natural philosopher
Came to theories that glaciers were a prominant force of nature in sculpting the Sierras and took copious notes on these theories before the Geology community ever came to them. Didn't John have a run in with Whitney (geologist) over these contraversial ideas at the time?
All around crazy mountain man who climbed big trees, rode an avalanche, danced all night on a mountain top to avoid freezing, slept in a fumerole on Mt. Shasta to avoid freezing to death, and did it all on herbs and tea (I'm probably stretching the truth on the last statement) among many other feats of daring and bravery (or stupidity depending on how you look at it). Just a wild, wilderness fun kind of guy.
Conservationist and preserver of wilderness for many generations to come
Founder of the Sierra Club
Father of the National Park System
Unbelievably gifted writer and author
By the way, it's John's B-Day on April 21st (and mine!)
I have a special place in my heart for John Muir. Would have loved to have met him.
Edit:
http://www.sierraclub.org/john_muir_exhibit/
"John Muir (1838-1914) was America's most famous and influential naturalist and conservationist. He is one of California's most important historical personalities. He has been called "The Father of our National Parks," "Wilderness Prophet," and "Citizen of the Universe." He once described himself more humorously, and perhaps most accurately, as, a "poetico-trampo-geologist-botanist and ornithologist-naturalist etc. etc. !!!!" Legendary librarian and author Lawrence Clark Powell (1906-2001), (anticipating an event that was not to occur until 2006), said of him: "If I were to choose a single Californian to occupy the Hall of Fame, it would be this tenacious Scot who became a Californian during the final forty-six years of his life." "
Pursuit of his love of science, especially geology, often occupied his free time. Muir soon became convinced that glaciers had sculpted many of the features of the valley and surrounding area. This notion was in stark contradiction to the accepted contemporary theory, promulgated by Josiah Whitney (head of the California Geological Survey), which attributed the formation of the valley to a catastrophic earthquake. As Muir's ideas spread, Whitney would try to discredit Muir by branding him as an amateur. But Louis Agassiz, the premier geologist of the day, saw merit in Muir's ideas, and lauded him as "the first man I have ever found who has any adequate conception of glacial action."[23]
In 1871, Muir discovered an active alpine glacier below Merced Peak, which helped his theories gain acceptance. He was a highly productive writer and had many of his accounts and papers published as far away as New York. Muir's former professor at the University of Wisconsin, Ezra Carr, and his wife Jeanne, encouraged Muir to put his ideas into print. They also introduced Muir to notables such as Emerson, as well as leading scientists such as Louis Agassiz, John Tyndall, John Torrey, Clinton Hart Merriam, and Joseph LeConte.[citation needed]
A large earthquake centered near Lone Pine, California in Owens Valley (see 1872 Lone Pine earthquake) strongly shook occupants of Yosemite Valley in March 1872. The quake woke Muir in the early morning and he ran out of his cabin "both glad and frightened," exclaiming, "A noble earthquake!" Other valley settlers, who believed Whitney's ideas, feared that the quake was a prelude to a cataclysmic deepening of the valley. Muir had no such fear and promptly made a moonlit survey of new talus piles created by earthquake-triggered rock-slides. This event led more people to believe in Muir's ideas about the formation of the valley."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Muir
Not only did John Muir wear many hats and his interests were far-ranging in the natural sciences and environmental conservation, mountaineering etc., but let's not forget perhaps one of the most important aspects of his life and the foundation of his World view . . . He was also a devout man of faith. He believed in GOD, The Trinity. This comes out crystal clear throughout his many writings. He also owned a plethora of copies of The Good Book, The Holy Bible.
Sounds like a UCLA prof is just a little envious of Muir's life accomplishments, so he has to try to pull him down. Human nature at its worst.
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JerryA
Mountain climber
Sacramento,CA
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:38am PT
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The Muir-Hanna Cabin is in Lundy Canyon. Google it to read an interesting L.A.Times article about one of his descendants.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Nov 27, 2014 - 10:27am PT
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Muir's main contribution was in getting government to set aside some significant tracks of land and declaring to the world that we can't screw with this terrain - at all, for all time. That these few places HAVE to remain the very same. We cannot improve, develop, or change the scenery. They are scared relics of our heritage and it's going to be hands off forever.
What does this mean? Where is the value here?
Climbing and kayaking and BASE jumping and all the rest can be viewed as metaphors for things that often go missing in our lives: simplicity, passion and playing for keeps, with real stakes and nerve and consummate skill — things that are exactly what they appear to be, and not pursued for money or power. Places and activities that force people back into intimate contact with dirt and rock and sun - and their own feelings. No posing and no spin. No glib presentation. No bullsh#t.
The essential “reason” to visit the wild places, the austere and bleak places that Muir had set aside, is to get centered and grounded, to find a restorative, personal experience of something real, unfeigned and unrehearsed. And most of all, something bad ass. Visiting these places is one way to reclaim our fierceness, naturalness and power.
Who is really going to step up to the microphone and declare that these experiences are no longer relevant to our lives today? Based on what experiencs? I would wager that whoever said as much has never bivouacked on a wall climb, or even spend a few nights alone in the wilds. Go do that and get back to us with a message that you wasted your time on something irrelevant.
JL
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Nov 27, 2014 - 10:34am PT
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I was puzzled by this article.
But first, one must be aware that when you are interviewed, you are never quite sure what will be quoted in the article. I had a friend recently interviewed for 60 minutes for three hours by Anderson Cooper, only to be onscreen for 30 seconds.
I know Glen MacDonald, who I would describe as the very antithesis of the meaning of this article. I think he is very appropriate in the John Muir chair.
The historian, I do not. I find it odd that a historian would belittle the historical importance of Muir. I am puzzled because I don't know the basis of "Muir's irrelevancy"--he never actually states it. His UCLA bio states:
Jon Christensen has been an environmental journalist and science writer for more than 30 years. His work has appeared in The New York Times, Nature, TheNewYorker.com, High Country News, the San Francisco Chronicle, and many other newspapers, magazines, journals, and radio and television shows. Jon was a Knight Journalism Fellow at Stanford University in 2002-2003 and a Steinbeck Fellow at San Jose State University in 2003-2004, before returning to Stanford to work on a Ph.D. in environmental history and the history of science. Jon was a founder of the Spatial History Project and executive director of the Bill Lane Center for the American West, an interdisciplinary center for research, teaching, new media, and journalism at Stanford before coming to UCLA in 2012.
It seems that he should be plugged in, but he seems out of touch with many in the environmental movement and even the agencies on the land.
What a strange article. It does not match my experience.
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Polar Bear
Mountain climber
Moraga, California
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:14pm PT
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"I have done the best I could to show forth the beauty, grandeur, and all-embracing usefulness of our wild mountain forest reservations and parks, with a view to inciting the people to come and enjoy them, and get them into their hearts, that so at length their preservation and right use might be made sure." John Muir Martinez, California September 1901
submitted by Steven Thaw, Moraga, California
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Polar Bear
Mountain climber
Moraga, California
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:16pm PT
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"The Spirit has again led me into the Wilderness, in opposition to all counter attractions, and I am once more in the glory of the Yosemite."
John Muir
submitted by Steve Thaw, Moraga, California
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Polar Bear
Mountain climber
Moraga, California
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:18pm PT
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"In every walk with Nature, one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir
submitted by Steve Thaw, Moraga, California
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Polar Bear
Mountain climber
Moraga, California
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:29pm PT
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"Walk away quietly in any direction and taste the freedom of the mountaineer. Camp out among the grass and gentians of glacier meadows, in craggy garden nooks full of Nature's darlings. Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees.The winds will blow their own freshness into you,and the storms their energy, while cares drop off like autumn leaves. As age comes on one source of of enjoyment is closed, but Nature's sources never fail." John Muir
submitted by Steve Thaw, Moraga, California
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Polar Bear
Mountain climber
Moraga, California
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:30pm PT
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"Natural Faith casts out fear." John Muir
submitted by Steve Thaw, Moraga, California
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Polar Bear
Mountain climber
Moraga, California
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Nov 27, 2014 - 08:33pm PT
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"The rights of all creation..." John Muir
submitted by Steve Thaw, Moraga, California
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AE
climber
Boulder, CO
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Nov 29, 2014 - 01:23pm PT
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Come back in 100 years and look up Jon Christensen....
Perhaps he is misquoted but to make absurd statements of ethnicity as correlated to strong environmentalism sounds far more "radical poly sci" than mere journalist. Face it, native americans were not as eco-friendly as we like to believe - just more stable small indigenous populations that had relatively little power to leverage against the natural forces in their ecosystems. Romanticism was the big movement in Muir's time, but he actually walked the walk, while east coast literary types like Thoreau waxed eloquent without much more than dipping a toe into the shallow end.
The entire paradigm shift towards more environmental consciousness depended on folks like Muir to invoke a real awe towards great natural wonders and wilderness, however biased by human beliefs, and far more humble areas around the country would all be planted or paved by now without that motivating inspiration.
Third try to spell paradigm correctly. Damn.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, CA
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Nov 29, 2014 - 04:53pm PT
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Actually Pilgrims, the somewhat silly or at least frisky prof can't be as ripe for a beating as all that and you know it.
Jon Christensen, being a spry and maybe even puckish associate professor down in LA, has issued an apology in his I, Jackass even presumably spoofing a bit here with humorous pseudo-veiled reference to I, Claudius, the 12-episode BBC series of the Seventies.
here: from: http://www.laobserved.com/intell/2014/11/i_jackass.php
Anyway, in this new article of response to the more than 150 Letters to the LA Times editor, he steps back from troublesome youthful vigor and scary water's edge to flatly state less exploitatively, or should I say, only states the nearly platitudinous, the following:
As an historian, I did not in any way mean to suggest that we should not teach our kids about John Muir, understand his great accomplishments, as well as his human flaws, and the great work he has inspired among generations of environmentalists. What I meant to argue has to do with the difference between history and legacy. I value the history of John Muir. But I also think that Muir's legacy -- what he means today -- is no longer very useful and in some ways stands in the way of what needs to be done today. His vision of a California divided in three -- between cities where people live and work, the economically productive landscapes of farms, ranches and mines, and the wilderness cathedrals of nature -- is no longer a useful way to think about people and nature in the 21st century. We need to value people and nature everywhere. And along with many others, including the environmentalist who told me it is my job to make Muir relevant, I worry that Muir's message "does not resonate with so many people" anymore. Not only does it not resonate, it also excludes many people who will have to be engaged if we want the love for nature that so many of us share to continue to thrive in California.
and goes on to further state:
I have what I hope is a constructive reason for rethinking John Muir. That reason is this: John Muir was a terrific hero for the 19th and 20th centuries. And he accomplished amazing things in his own life and in the work he has inspired. But while we might take inspiration from Muir as a founder of the environmental movement, we can't count on him for guidance now, any more than we can turn back to George Washington as a guide to politics today. We need new conservation and environmental heroes. And those modern heroes will likely look very different from John Muir. They might be Latina, female, love cities, worry about social justice, and want a cabin in which to spend a night in a state park. They might be black, love car
So basically his straw man goes away, he has gotten loads of (bad) attention, and he looks a lot better to the department for promulgating the hope for urban nature theory such that would be accessible to all races and income levels. Namely, the University being responsive to the society. Something they like to do more and more since FSM 1963. How could he go wrong?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 29, 2014 - 05:09pm PT
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How could he go wrong?
He sinned. Torquemada is not amused by his feeble justifications.
He will be summoned.
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the czar
climber
meyers, ca.
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Nov 29, 2014 - 05:42pm PT
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http://alj.am/1qUD1EP
Why is it so hard to believe Latinos are worried and care about the environment?
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Nov 29, 2014 - 06:42pm PT
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Jon Christensen's critique of Muir's legacy has opened a conversation about Muir. It is good to question the status quo, and not fall into a mindless hero worship. With this conversation about Muir I can only come away with Muir's significance more firmly cemented in history, thank you Mr. Christensen.
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gunsmoke
Mountain climber
Clackamas, Oregon
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Nov 29, 2014 - 07:26pm PT
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And those modern heroes will likely look very different from John Muir. They might be Latina, female ...
Looks like the biggest strike against Muir, in Christensen's opinion, is that he's a white male, a problem made all the worse by the fact that whites are no longer the largest ethnic group in Muir's home state.
Why is it so hard to believe Latinos are worried and care about the environment?
Answer, personal experiences I've had in the outdoors that don't correlate with view that Hispanics have a heightened sense of care for the environment.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 30, 2014 - 10:19am PT
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Those thoughts are dangerous. Dangerously moronic! :-)
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Nov 30, 2014 - 10:32am PT
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Tempest in a tea cup.
Muir's legacy is solid and may last for thousands of years. His time here marked a turning point from conquering the natural world to seeking the wildest of places as a spiritual therapy.
His work is comparable to that of any of the religious prophets.
Modern media brought his work to my attention as well as to others. I see his following growing.
It is surprisingly not-political if you get right down to it. His work bridges religious differences as well as political boundries.
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MikeL
Social climber
Seattle, WA
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Nov 30, 2014 - 11:10am PT
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“Relevant," appears to mean "important to the matter at hand."
Which “matter at hand?” As I read these posts, there appear to be many matters.
In every event, matter changes all the time. (Try not to get too excited about it when you make the discovery.)
It is somewhat surprising to me that ST’s readership takes umbrage at someone diss’ing an avowed mystic—being as agnostic and atheist as they generally seem to be. Just goes to show, I suppose, that requiring consistency in views is not very important rationally, or that any mythical hero blinds his or her followers to their senses.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
in the oil patch...Fricken Bakken, that's where
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Nov 30, 2014 - 03:33pm PT
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Here's the difference. Muir was one of Us. He was a rock monkey.
So there, Mister Man.
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Lynne Leichtfuss
Sport climber
moving thru
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Nov 30, 2014 - 04:18pm PT
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How very typical of some in the elitist intellectual university system. Make an error........cover it up by changing the topic, shuffling the pea in the 3 pods, smoke and mirrors. Get the debate topic onto something else, like Latinos, females, big cities and the out doors.
JL did a good job in his reply. But when I read this sentence No posing and no spin. No glib presentation. No bullsh#t. I did have a very small chuckle. :)
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Sounds to me like these blokes from UCLA are wolves in sheep's clothing.
Setting aside specific areas to be pristine for all time, compared to "just be happy to have a park in your neighborhood. Don't worry that your public lands will be sold to multinationals who will own the mineral rights and will do with it whatever they will. You don't have to worry, because that land was really just set aside for folks who have the money to drive there and enjoy it--and that's not you."
My goodness, if Muir's legacy were ever important, it's most important now, as we move towards screwing up every corner of the Earth.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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The National Parks: America's Best Idea
http://www.pbs.org/nationalparks/about/
The National Parks: America's Best Idea is the story of an idea as uniquely American as the Declaration of Independence and just as radical: that the most special places in the nation should be preserved, not for royalty or the rich, but for everyone.
And the FIRST picture on the page----John Muir.
I also think that all the preservation efforts since then have stemmed from Muir. So the recent designation in the San Gabriels would seem to be a direct extension, and an ongoing impact of his legacy.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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The National Parks will be some of the first to go when our currency collaspes here. Lots of liquid assets tied up there readily available for harvest.
\
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Muir, who said,
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks,"
appears to have hit a universal nail-head of truth with this observation. It is relevant for all time.
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Scoop
Mountain climber
Truckee, CA
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I work in conservation. Jon Christensen loves being at the center of a
maelstrom and creating one if need be. He is what we'd call on this site a "poser."
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AE
climber
Boulder, CO
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I must agree - his ilk is too common, in many walks of life, but shows in this manner particularly among frustrated academics whose narcissism is only rewarded by meager bouts of attention from naive freshmen who swoon to their beguiling language and hipster cool.
We can't underestimate the value of exposing kids from all backgrounds, ethnic or economic, to the magnificent areas of the world. Telling kids that the entire park system and the history of conservation is another form of white privilege and exploitation is reprehensible, and an insidiously subtle form of moral relativism. Without intellectual debate, it's intuitively obvious to kids that Yosemite and the Grand Canyon have some fantastic extraordinary quality, which is the whole point of preservation for all. Denying them this, or creating a mindset which claims a neighborhood park as an acceptable equivalent, is another form of cultural discrimination as much as segregated schools or job opportunities.
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Flip Flop
climber
salad bowl, california
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Be afraid. He was a Shepherd, a nut farmer, a tramp, a mystic and a recalcitrant Scot. His view of god is clearly atheist.
"Rocks and waters, etc., are words of God and so are men. We all flow from one fountain Soul. All are expressions of one Love. God does not appear, and flow out, only from narrow chinks and round bored wells here and there in favored races and places, but He flows in grand undivided currents, shoreless and boundless over creeds and forms and all kinds of civilizations and peoples and beasts, saturating all and fountainizing all."
~John Muir, "Letter to Catharine Merrill, Yosemite" (1872) - See more at: http://www.patheos.com/Resources/Additional-Resources/John-Muir-Was-a-Pagan.html#sthash.dH1X0Hcp.dpuf
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