Jet wheel stowaway survives

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Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Apr 22, 2014 - 12:24pm PT

DMT, see post #18.

More likely he will open a travel agency in Ethiopia or Cuba.

Tvash

climber

Seattle

Apr 22, 2014 - 12:28pm PT

No crop dusting from the flight attendants, so there's that.

philo

Trad climber

Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?

Apr 22, 2014 - 12:30pm PT

Quick someone notify Mythbusters.

Majid_S

Mountain climber

Karkoekstan

Apr 22, 2014 - 12:43pm PT

Another false report to create new organization called BSA to beef-up airport security and add another $50 per passenger as" security tax"

And kid doesn't remember anything

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Apr 22, 2014 - 12:58pm PT

The aerodynamics of the fuselage design minimize drag, and an area that has positive or negative pressure would be inducing major drag. They wind tunnel test the designs extensively as aerodynamic drag is the enemy of fuel economy.

That kid needs to consider a mountaineering career, he don't need no stinkin' oxygen, or a down jacket! He can travel light and fast

Aircraft fly.

The reason they fly is that the shape of the wing causes air pressure above the wing to be lowered and air pressure under the wing to be raised when moving forward.. thus causing lift. This air pressure differential is what holds several tons of aircraft up when flying. So the pressure increase under the wing is not insubstantial. It is also not uniform in every area.

2 of the wheelwells on the 767 are located on the underside of the wing.

How much does this affect air pressure inside the wheelwell? Dunno, Maybe very little, perhaps alot, I say measure and find out. To get an accurate idea what the boy experienced you would have to measure at the position his lungs were located. I suspect even a foot one way or the other would change the situation quite abit. You might even need a dummy crammmed in there to get it right because the pressure might be different for a void or filled volume.

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Apr 22, 2014 - 01:04pm PT

I got a hunnerd that says it ain't gonna be a pressure difference of more than 1.5 psi. Any takers?

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Apr 22, 2014 - 01:08pm PT

I wouldn't take that bet. But if it were raised just 1.5 PSI then that would raise the psi from 3.0 at 38000 feet to 4.5 putting him at an effective altitude of approximately 29,000 feet

That would be a huge difference physiologically. Still remarkable but much more possible to survive.

Jon Beck

Trad climber

Oceanside

Apr 22, 2014 - 01:28pm PT

The reason they fly is that the shape of the wing causes air pressure above the wing to be lowered and air pressure under the wing to be raised when moving forward.. thus causing lift. This air pressure differential is what holds several tons of aircraft up when flying. So the pressure increase under the wing is not insubstantial. It is also not uniform in every area.

It is the same principle that makes a sail propel a sailboat on a tack (into the wind) It is not the pressure against the sail, rather it is the lower pressure on the top of the wing (or leeward side of the sail) that provides lift. One would think that a sailboat would go the fastest on a downwind run. A mainsail generating lift going perpendicular to the wind will be faster.

This low pressure creates huge aerodynamic drag and is unavoidable. Any other drag is to be eliminated as it only increases fuel consumption, be it holes, antennas or any other feature that changes the airflow.

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Apr 22, 2014 - 01:31pm PT

I'm not sure to what degree there is higher pressure under or lower pressure above. Fair point. I seem to recall its a combination of both to some degree.. but I could be wrong and perhaps it is mainly lower pressure above causing the lift. I do know that this stuff varies in different areas of the wing.

I still think this is an interesting question.

Sierra Ledge Rat

Mountain climber

Old and Broken Down in Appalachia

Apr 22, 2014 - 01:33pm PT

http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-news/ci_25611408/jet-wheel-stowaways-how-theyre-able-survive

"At 38,000 feet — the cruising altitude of the Hawaiian Airlines flight that the FBI says the 15-year-old took Sunday — the outside air temperature is about minus 85 degrees. The air is so thin that a person will pass out because the brain is starved of oxygen.

The plane's own machinery can aid a stowaway's survival, at least initially. Warmth radiating from the wheels, which heat up on the runway during takeoff, and from hydraulic fluid lines can moderate the temperature. But those effects dissipate, and at cruising altitude the temperature in the wheel well would be about minus 30 degrees, estimated John Hansman, a professor of aeronautics and astronautics at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

Unlike areas of the cargo hold that are pressurized so that pets can breathe, air in the wheel wells is essentially the same as outside the plane. An FBI spokesman in Hawaii said the boy told authorities he did not remember the flight.

And then there is the huge risk when the wheels are lowered for landing. This opens the equivalent of a trap door, turning a cramped but relatively sheltered space into one from which it would be easy to fall thousands of feet to the ground or water below.

Wheel well survivors typically find space in a recess area next to where the gear retracts, according to an FAA review of cases. The boy hopped into a Boeing 767, and it was not immediately clear how big the area is on that jet. Boeing representatives declined to comment, saying they did not want to encourage any copycat attempts."

dave729

Trad climber

Western America

Apr 22, 2014 - 02:13pm PT

Saying now that Kahului International Airport (Maui) has video of him exiting the 'Front' wheel well of the 767.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/stowaway-video-exiting-planes-wheel-death-defying-flight/story?id=23402777

Boeing 767 -that front gear hatch could look inviting to a 15yr old
run away at 'O-dark-thirty'.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Delta_Air_Lines_B767-332_N130DL.jpg

labrat

Trad climber

Auburn, CA

Apr 22, 2014 - 02:49pm PT

Surprised that he made it!

Agree with Dingus
"Maybe he should take up high altitude climbing?"

Erik

climbski2

Mountain climber

Anchorage AK, Reno NV

Apr 22, 2014 - 02:51pm PT

Well that takes a bit away from my wing airpressure theory I guess lol. I would still like to know the actual conditions in there. It's beyond remarkable he survived.

Tvash

climber

Seattle

Apr 22, 2014 - 03:11pm PT

There is a pressure differential between the top and bottom of an airfoil - only 5% or so (it varies), but that doesn't matter.

The pressure of the stationary air inside the wheel well is the same the still air outside the plane - 38000 in this case. 20% of sea level, roughly.

You might survive steerage class with 5 or 6 O2 bottles, a big ole down bag, and some pretzel sticks, but it seems the crowd that prefers this mode of travel will have no part of those crutches.

dave729

Trad climber

Western America

Apr 22, 2014 - 03:26pm PT

767 nose gear retraction test
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkWEcIgn8BE

Anyone seen a TSA directive for a stowaway check
be made in wheel wells nation wide prior to roll back?

Tvash

climber

Seattle

Apr 22, 2014 - 03:57pm PT

For all the Darwin award talk, considering that over half of Americans don't believe in the Big Bang, and well over a third don't believe in human caused global warming, evolution, or a 4.5 billion year old Earth (with a nod to Mother Jones's FB meme of the day) I'd say this kid is more norm than outlier.

Reilly

Mountain climber

The Other Monrovia- CA

Apr 22, 2014 - 04:04pm PT

I can't wait to see his selfies! What a view he had from the front wheel well on final!

Tvash

climber

Seattle

Apr 22, 2014 - 04:20pm PT

It's utterly amazing that anyone survives Steerage Class on a plane. I didn't realize anyone ever had.

Hawaii, though. Ya gotta admit - good choice.

Not understanding our upper atmosphere seems forgivable to me, in light of the tens of millions of 'normal adults' whose ignorance stretches far deeper and wider. During a partial solar eclipse years ago, I once asked 4 adults which was closer, the sun or the moon. Half got it wrong.

Then again, there is my own youth. I can recall my first backpack trip in the Sierras at 13. Altitude? UV? Radiative cooling? What? After 8 days I came out 3 shades darker, 10 lbs lighter, and burning with desire for a real sleeping bag. No planes, but I did dream of hopping freights, but never did. Probably not a bad thing.