Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2013 - 03:19pm PT
|
There's many guys behind the curtain pulling the stupid American puppet strings .....
|
|
rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2013 - 03:27pm PT
|
This connected , older friend , said some insiders in Washington thought it was the mob trying to stop government interference by the kennedy's..? Sad day in American History..
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2013 - 03:30pm PT
|
Jim LOL
These supertopo people here are far too brainwashed to understand simple things .....
|
|
mojede
Trad climber
Butte, America
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2013 - 06:02pm PT
|
TokerV--the Carcano had been fired numerous times since purchased in March of '62. He had tried and failed to snipe another Dallas dignitary earlier in the year.
Though he was military, he failed to make Sharpshooter, and could only attain Marksman--also, some of his squad ridiculed his sniping even.
Again, his luck peaked when his second and third shots hit their mark--the first didn't even hit the Lincoln Continental Limousine...
|
|
Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2013 - 06:04pm PT
|
the best trained snipers in the world; fbi hostage rescue teams, couldnt manage to repeat that feat of shooting when they tried
Completely false.
Curt
|
|
Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2013 - 08:02pm PT
|
Scientific acoustical evidence establishes a high probability that two gunmen fired at President John F. Kennedy. Other scientific evidence does not preclude the possibility of two gunmen firing at the President. Scientific evidence negates some specific conspiracy allegations.
The committee believes, on the basis of the evidence available to it, that President John F. Kennedy was probably assassinated as a result of a conspiracy. The committee was unable to identify the other gunmen or the extent of the conspiracy.
All thoroughly debunked.
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/odell/
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/218/4568/127.abstract
Next?
Curt
|
|
Rollover
climber
Gross Vegas
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2013 - 09:46am PT
|
Still wasn't Oswald acting alone..
|
|
rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 09:04am PT
|
Arson..tfpu...
|
|
justthemaid
climber
Jim Henson's Basement
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 09:35am PT
|
*(sigh)*
OK.. I tracked it down... here's your debunk proof. Magic bullet shot recreated. These guys got a hold of a copy of the car BTW and the position of the dummies with one seated slightly lower is accurate.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZRUNYZY71g
Oswald was intelligent and highly skilled with rifle (in spite of many conspiracists saying otherwise). He was totally psychotic and obsessed. I have no doubt he was able to make the shot. Hell, he made Russia so nervous they rejected his offer when he tried to defect. He murdered a couple family members the same day... which no one ever talks about for some reason.
Knowing how totally incompetent our government is.. I simply find it impossible to believe they are capable of orchestrating a "government conspiracy". That would imply there was cooperation and brains involved. Now THAT's an idiotic conspiracy theory.
|
|
mojede
Trad climber
Butte, America
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 10:52am PT
|
DMT, simply put, he wanted to do away with the CIA, the Federal Reserve, and the military industrial complex that Dwight D warned of...
edit: He didn't start any wars, but tried to deter them (after he firsthand saw the horrors). As the French pulled out of Vietnam, a few Special Forces were sent over to evaluate and help the Vietnamese. Johnson took the bull by the horns, sided with the military and created the Gulf of Tonkin incident to escalate the conflict, and bring the war-mongers into the game.
|
|
mojede
Trad climber
Butte, America
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 10:57am PT
|
Correct my history: What WAR did he start?
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 11:07am PT
|
WTF did Kennedy DO?
He pissed off all the guys behind the curtain running the real show.
He was going to take all their power away.
Thus they were forced to knock him off to keep their bullsh!t stupid agenda going.
Stupid Americans have no clue who's really running the show ......
|
|
Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 12:25pm PT
|
oswald was NOT highly skilled with a rifle,
the only people who believe that are ignorant of that fact that "marksman" is the LOWEST qualification ranking allowed to remain in the service...
Not true. The Marines had three levels of shooting qualification:
1) Expert
2) Sharpshooter
3) Marksman
Oswald had in the past tested at the "sharpshooter" level with a M1.
Curt
|
|
crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 01:16pm PT
|
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2013 - 08:31am PT
I personally do not buy into any of the conspiracy theories.
I believe Oswald was not unlike the modern day whack jobs we see all too often, wanting to make a name for themselves....take our their aggressions, etc.
He was also clearly a communist sympathizer....one can only imagine what would have been found out had Ruby not acted, and Oswald went to trial.
I think Ruby was an ardent Kennedy supporter, and acted out of rage...alone. And unwittingly, Ruby's act more than anything else, sealed the case to forever be debated as a conspiracy.
I agree. I think a trial would have shown Oswald was acting on his own.
I was 11. Still very vivid.
Vincent Bugliosi's book, "Reclaiming History" is the definitive book on the subject of conspiracy theories, in my opinion.
|
|
HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 02:22pm PT
|
oswald was NOT highly skilled with a rifle,
the only people who believe that are ignorant of that fact that "marksman" is the LOWEST qualification ranking allowed to remain in the service... Not quite true.
Yes, when he was discharged, this was his score. However, earlier he had attained the second highest marksmanship rating.
He certainly knew how to fire a rifle accurately.
As has been pointed out, modern computer simulations have demonstrated that a single shot from the book repository window would have resulted in exactly the reactions and wounds sustained by Kennedy and Connelly.
There's an axiom in engineering. Usually the simplest explanation is correct.
So many of you seem to have some personal investment in this issue.
You're obviously too young to remember having the President assassinated. I was 15, in middle school and will never forget the school being assembled in the auditorium and told the horrific news.
Whether you do or don't agree with his policies or personal behavior it is a truly shocking experience.
It also changes the course of history.
Kennedy set the direction of the space program: "we will put a man on the moon in this decade". Which we did.
Kennedy was in fact a decorated war veteran. He had been through the hell of war, unlike any President since Teddy Roosevelt, except George HW Bush.
I exclude Eisenhower since his experience in WWII was administrative. He never fired a weapon in battle.
Kennedy was the first Catholic elected President. In 1960 that was a very worrying thing, unfortunately.
Kennedy launched the ridiculous and futile Bay of Pigs Invasion. Thereby increasing the alienation between Cuba and US which persists today.
Kennedy, not learning his lesson from the Bay of Pigs, increased our commitment in Vietnam. Johnson turned it into a full-scale war. A war which transformed the US in many ways. What would Kennedy have done in a second term? Did his Catholicism influence his decisions since South Vietnam was at the time ruled by a Catholic family? After all Shrub took us into Iraq after calling upon advice from his god.
In spite of being strongly anti-Communist (see Bay of Pigs and Vietnam), Kennedy held his fire in the Cuban Missile Crisis. We came within a blink of all out thermonuclear war. Which would have changed the world into something we cannot imagine. What would "anti-communist" red-baiting Nixon have done?
Kennedy negotiated the Nuclear Test Ban Treaty with Khruschev. Nixon never could have.
He pushed civil rights as far as he could politically. Certainly not as far as most proponents would have liked. Would he have made as much, or perhaps more, progress as LBJ?
JFK's dalliance with Marilyn Monroe is of course famous. Largely because she herself was so famous and the increasing tentacles of the media (mostly a good thing).
Carrying on the tradition of Eisenhower (with his secretary), Roosevelt (with Eleanor's secretary and other women) and other Presidents.
Power is an aphrodisiac.
JFK's influence on our history and current times was truly important.
|
|
Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 02:30pm PT
|
Solid. So this "professional" apparently relies on ad hominen attacks to diminish the character of those he wishes to discredit, and this is the most worthy thing to point out about what he did right in his book. I guess anyone who questions that Oswald acted alone is also as kooky as a $3 bill. That alone seals the deal on my opinion of this guy personally. I would be interested in any actual example of him "picking apart" any fact based theory, with a reference to said theory to be sure he truly picked it all apart, but something tells me I wouldn't actually find that anywhere in that 1600 page book.
Perhaps you should actually read the book before coming to a conclusion about what you might or might not find in it? Just a suggestion. Bugliosi, by the way, merely comes to exactly the same conclusions as Gerald Posner, who wrote the book "Case Closed" in 2003 and also factually debunked all of the various conspiracy theories.
Curt
|
|
HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 04:10pm PT
|
Good to know you won't be trusting the Computer Simulations next time you get in a modern airliner.
Or in a serious crash in your late model auto.
Or........
Kennedy was shot in the back.....of his neck.
in the base of Kennedy's neck above the scapula, and exited through the front of his neck
exit through the anterior surface of the neck.
|
|
Rudder
Trad climber
Costa Mesa, CA
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 04:20pm PT
|
I really wanted to believe in a conspiracy because the movie JFK was so entertaining, such a great story!
But, I've wasted many hours through the years keeping up with the theories... the audio recordings from the motorcycle really looking substantial for a short time... but there's just nothing to ANY of the theories once reviewed.
Was there a government cover-up? Hell yeah. They were/are so corrupt that there were hundreds of things they didn't want the public to know. But, was there a second shooter? I sure haven't read of one bit of evidence to show me that there was. As interesting as it would be, it's just not there.
|
|
Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 04:22pm PT
|
Or perhaps I can save myself the time by sending the known iformation through my B.S. filter first to see if it's worth investigating further.
At least you admit to substituting your simple hunches for rigorous scientific analysis. It's no wonder you come to erroneous conclusions.
Curt
|
|
Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
|
|
|
Nov 21, 2013 - 04:27pm PT
|
I really wanted to believe in a conspiracy because the movie JFK was so entertaining, such a great story!
But, I've wasted many hours through the years keeping up with the theories... the audio recordings from the motorcycle really looking substantial for a short time... but there's just nothing to ANY of the theories once reviewed.
Was there a government cover-up? Hell yeah. They were/are so corrupt that there were hundreds of things they didn't want the public to know. But, was there a second shooter? I sure haven't read of one bit of evidence to show me that there was. As interesting as it would be, it's just not there.
Amen. The Warren Report was deeply flawed and omissions were made. The CIA and FBI (among others) misled investigators to cover their own asses. It's my belief that this has led directly to many of the conspiracy stories. Never the less, in spite of all its flaws, the Warren commission did get it right with respect to their conclusions--and all of the various conspiracy theories have been proven to be false.
Curt
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!