Missing friend in Mammoth Lakes area

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WBraun

climber
Oct 15, 2015 - 08:23pm PT
Aerial searches for SAR are for public service should be exempt with permission and coordination from/with the local authorities.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
Oct 15, 2015 - 09:04pm PT
There is no such thing as the Forest Service..They are a figma of our gross materilaistic subconsciousness..Puppets of Honda motors and other carbon producing corporations..The real Forest Service employees are entombed in small cubicles attending endless meetings while speaking in tongues...Release the drones...!
WBraun

climber
Oct 15, 2015 - 09:11pm PT
Are you sure?

You been reading too much bullsh!t from the stooopid duck .....
Jimr

climber
Redondo Beach, CA
Oct 17, 2015 - 12:28pm PT
Looking at maps this morning and realized my scenario makes more sense launched from Devil's Postpile/Minaret Lk. as LAhiker noted. Doesn't change anything as far as the potential search area goes. in DPP and out AM would have added the cross country he mentioned wanting to do as well.
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Oct 17, 2015 - 12:47pm PT
Are you sure?

You been reading too much bullsh!t from the stooopid duck .....


again with the gold.
DataJunkie

climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
Oct 25, 2015 - 02:16pm PT
It has gotten very cold very quickly this season. After the most recent rainstorm it has remained cold, but still somewhat nice for hiking. The road is closed for the season after the 31st though.

I hiked up to Shadow Lake the other day, it was about 35 out when I started. The majority of signs had posters on them, starting at Agnew Meadows to the junction with JMT (I didn't go beyond that). Even the bridge over the San Joaquin Middle Fork right before to climb to Shadow.

I spent a lot of time down at Reds Meadow and Devils Postpile this summer. There were very few posters in this area, or they were removed. I remember after Steve Fosset's remains were found near Minaret Mine, some campers came forward that said they saw his plane flying in the area. Hopefully there are posters further up the trail. The report from the campers seems to be an example of something important being ignored by the witness as unimportant.

I was hoping to get to Minaret Lake this summer, but with the days getting so short it isn't practical.
Alpineholydog

Trad climber
Spring Tx
Nov 8, 2015 - 07:29pm PT
I know the season of searching is passed. An idea hit me that I'm sure that occurred to others here but I have not seen in this forum or on the Find Matthew Greene site. Have the logs from the summits of all the likely mountains Matthew would have climbed been pulled and the names recorded. One might try to track down those that left their non trail names on the registers. Someone is out there that saw Matthew on the 17th of July. Perhaps showing them the info on Matthew might jog their memory. I cannot remember everyone on my hikes and I know that to put it together is intricate work. Special circumstances stand out however. Are the summit registers gathered somewhere in California? Since it's been a few years one could hope that they might be in a central location. If some are still out there a coordinated effort within the climbing community to photograph the registers in that time frame might be possible in the future. Just a thought...

Anything to narrow down the possibilities.
Alpineholydog

Trad climber
Spring Tx
Nov 26, 2015 - 07:01pm PT
Looks like Sierra club stores summit logs at the Bancroft Library in Berkley. Questions for those in the know...
1. Are all the minarets/Ritter/Banner covered by the Sierra club and gathered and stored.
2. Has anyone reviewed the stored summit loges to get the names of those who climbed on July 17th of that year?
3. If the logs are on the mountains still what about sponsoring a climbing event to photograph the logs for the dates that Matthew went missing. Again the goal would be to contact those climbers to see if anyone saw Matthew in an area to LIMIT the search area.

T H

Boulder climber
ne'erdowell
Nov 26, 2015 - 11:26pm PT
^^ In this day and age it seems pretty silly to still be recording anything that matters so much with pencils and paper.
It should all be done online, and just remove the (eyesore) registers from the summits altogether.
LAhiker

Social climber
Los Angeles
Nov 27, 2015 - 08:11am PT
Alpineholydog said:
Have the logs from the summits of all the likely mountains Matthew would have climbed been pulled and the names recorded. One might try to track down those that left their non trail names on the registers. Someone is out there that saw Matthew on the 17th of July. Perhaps showing them the info on Matthew might jog their memory.

Good point. As far as I know, some of this has been done, but more is possible.

Banner and Ritter: Registers were checked after it was realized that Matt was missing. He hadn't signed either, but hear the relevant pages were photographed and attempts were made to contact people who did. I also hear that SAR tried to contact people with overnight permits for the area. It's possible that now that we have the unfortunate luxury of time, a bit more sleuthing into names that might have been hard to track down might turn up someone who might have seen Matt. Others such as Maverick, Cragman, or members of Matt's family may know more about this. I'm not sure who has the photos of those pages but could ask around.

Minarets: some registers have been checked and others not. In July 2014, I collected info on which registers in the Minarets had been checked and posted an appeal for photos of pages of Minarets summit registers from around when Matt disappeared, in an effort to find more people who might have seen him or who might have noticed some other evidence:
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=2195321&msg=2452330#msg2452330
The appeal, initially posted in this thread, was later posted separately on Supertopo, Summitpost, and Mountain Project. Harry Langenbacher, who maintains the Sierra Nevada Summit Registers page for the Sierra Club, posted an appeal on that page and renewed it this fall.

Unfortunately, no one has replied to my request for pictures of register pages in the Minarets; don't know whether anyone contacted Harry Langenbacher. I can certainly repost the appeal (with any updates) this spring.

As can be seen from the list linked to, not all Minarets have registers. Some of them have been checked for Matt's signature, but I don't think people have yet photographed register pages to find someone who might have seen Matt.

Two caveats: some who might have been climbing the Minarets that day might already have been contacted when the overnight permits were pulled. Also, some Minarets get very little traffic. I think Clyde gets the most -- not sure whether it's log from that summer would still be there but the others probably would be.

Looks like Sierra club stores summit logs at the Bancroft Library in Berkley. Questions for those in the know...
1. Are all the minarets/Ritter/Banner covered by the Sierra club and gathered and stored.
2. Has anyone reviewed the stored summit loges to get the names of those who climbed on July 17th of that year?

As noted above, I think the Banner & Ritter logs have already been photographed and most of the Minaret logs are probably still in the mountains, but it does make sense to double-check the library before heading up a peak for info that may no longer be there!

3. If the logs are on the mountains still what about sponsoring a climbing event to photograph the logs for the dates that Matthew went missing. Again the goal would be to contact those climbers to see if anyone saw Matthew in an area to LIMIT the search area.

Makes sense for any logs on the mountains that haven't already been checked. I'd also recommend photographing pages just before and for a couple of weeks after July 17, 2013, in case anyone spoke with Matt before that day, was still there then, or noticed something amiss in the next couple of weeks.

One could also prioritize certain Minarets, such as Kehrlein (Maverick's group and Cragman have been wondering whether Matt might have climbed it) and Clyde (because it gets more climbers, though that might mean that the relevant log is no longer on the mountain).
guyman

Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
Nov 27, 2015 - 10:36am PT
In this day and age it seems pretty silly to still be recording anything that matters so much with pencils and paper.
It should all be done online, and just remove the (eyesore) registers from the summits altogether.


I don't think the summit registers I get to are eyesores in the least. Recording your summits on line is stupid.

Mathew is at home in the Mountains now. If this happened to me, I would wish to never have my body found and removed.
kief

Trad climber
east side
Nov 27, 2015 - 12:30pm PT
Going into the third year of this saga I have utmost respect for Dean and his efforts but the "Citizen Search for Matthew Greene" as chronicled over on High Sierra Topix sounds like an accident waiting to happen:

"There wasnt time enough remaining in the day to do any searching, so today was about getting settled in and acclimatizing. I took the opportunity to ask for another lesson in negotiating Class 3 rock. The boys took me up to a rockface over a nice pool they had discovered the year prior. There I practiced proper handholds and descents facing the rock."

Another one of the (five) "searchers" on that outing was the object of a SAR and heli-extraction himself a couple of years ago in Tehipite Valley after a backpacking partner cancelled out and he decided to make the trip anyway with his 14 year old son. The kid freaked out on the steep switchbacks descending from Hay Meadow and after screeing down to the Middle Fork of the Kings they decided to fish and lounge around for several days waiting to be reported overdue rather than repeat the trauma.

It's one thing for experienced people with demonstrated good judgment to be out in sketchy terrain like the Minarets trying to help bring closure to Matt's family. Other folks maybe need reminding that good intentions are the prime paving material on the road to the hot place.
Alpineholydog

Trad climber
Spring Tx
Nov 28, 2015 - 09:57am PT
Perhaps I misspoke in my earlier post.
Knowing that all the potential peaks are climbed each year it might be possible to have a coordinated effort though the climbing shops in the area to pool the data from the peaks in question. No "Event" is necessary.

I agree that climbing in the area is really serious business and not at all for the new climber. Especially if the snowpack ends up high this year.

It just seems that if the area to search could be narrowed down to a particular trail then finding Matthew would be more possible.

It has occurred to me that there are likely lots of climbers out there that did not have backcountry permits for those dates. Matthew did not as far as I know.

Personally I would like to remain where I was if I was in Matthew's place but acknowledge that it is not a decision for me to make. If finding him brings his family solace then may the search by those interested proceed and hopefully bring them closure.
LAhiker

Social climber
Los Angeles
Nov 28, 2015 - 10:45am PT
Alpineholydog,

That makes sense. The point of my detailed post and link was that some of the info, including photos of some of the summit registers, may already be available without any further climbing. And as you note, some registers may be at Bancroft Library, though I doubt that any recent registers from the Minarets besides maybe Clyde would be there.

For the remaining summit registers, it would be great if some person or climbing shop or whatever encouraged people who were climbing the Minarets anyway to take photos of the relevant pages. So far my appeals have not had that effect.

Because some of the Minarets are rarely climbed, they may be less fruitful sources of people who might have seen Matt.

I certainly wasn't suggesting that non-climbers attempt any Minarets! I mentioned Kehrlein because it looks like no one has checked its register to see whether Matt might have climbed it that day. When around a month ago Jimr of Maverick's group floated the theory that Matt might have intended to climb Kehrlein and Starr, Dean said he'd go check the Kehrlein register if he could. But then the snows came in.

I completely agree that the main use of the registers at this point is as a source of names of people who might have seen Matt or who might have other relevant info. For that reason I think we need to encourage climbers to photograph pages for some time around July 17th, 2013 as well as for that day.
Alpineholydog

Trad climber
Spring Tx
Nov 28, 2015 - 11:34am PT
Lahiker,
We are on same page. While not as exciting as searching the back country some of this busy work might bear fruit for next year. Being in Texas I probably won't be of much help. Based on Matt's climbing history it would be possible to make a list of Summits he would have pursued and then based on those mountains attempt to find the registers and names of climbers in the area. If we could narrow the search for Matt to Ritter/Banner such as Cragman's intuition has led him, then a more thorough search of that area might be possible.

It underlines how incredible it was for Norman Clyde to find Pete Starr on Michaels Minaret in 1933. Now much harder for us with the passage of time.
DataJunkie

climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
Dec 14, 2015 - 02:04am PT
Just a note... something just occurred to me.

I've hiked the Agnew->Shadow trail that Matthew may have taken that day (but not the Minaret Lake trail, which is another possibility). I did this very late in the season, yet I still came across about 10 people on the trail. I was the only one that was by myself, so even had I not stopped to talk to some people along the way, I think I would have stood out.

I find it strange that nobody came forward to say that they saw him on the trail that day. I feel like hikers are pretty cognizant when in the wilderness (touristy trails like Rainbow Falls are another story... nobody says hi or anything). I suppose perhaps too much time had passed maybe, but I'd imagine I'd at least remember seeing a solo hiker and their gender at the least.

The most likely outcome is that he is up in the mountains, but part of me still thinks never made it to the trail.
T H

Boulder climber
ne'erdowell
May 30, 2016 - 09:57pm PT
Credit: T H
Cragman

Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, California....via the Damascus Road
Jul 16, 2016 - 10:27pm PT
Sitting here in Mammoth, just miles from where I have been searching for Matthew....contemplating my upcoming search...the third for this season.

Tomorrow is the 3 year anniversary of his disappearance....so hard to fathom at times.

Matthew's case has become so consuming for me at times, and in spite of not having found anything, I remain undaunted. I truly believe someone, someday, will come across the piece of evidence we're looking for.

That will be a great day.

Credit: Cragman
Pea-dub

Ice climber
sun diego
Jul 16, 2016 - 10:50pm PT
God's speed Dean
Stay off the sketchy stuff if you
are buy your self. Long time to be missing.
Don't really know what else to say.
Batrock

Trad climber
Burbank
Jul 17, 2016 - 03:55am PT
I recently saw picture in a post either here or on Mountain Project of a pair of mountaineering boots someone found stashed and were covered in snow. They seemed to be similar to the ones pictured in the missing person poster. About a week after seeing the picture I saw the missing person poster with the boots on it and immediately thought of the picture in the thread of the stashed boots. I thought the thread or TR was on about a trip to the Palisades or Mount Humphrys but I have been unable to find that picture since then. I'll keep looking.
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